Bug out stove. The HOBO.....56k warning

Items to keep you alive in the event you must evacuate: discussions of basic Survival Kits commonly called "Bug Out Bags" or "Go Bags"

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Bug out stove. The HOBO.....56k warning

Post by Woods Walker » Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:01 pm

Here are some pics of hobo type wood burning stoves. Starting with a ZIP stove, trailstove and my homemade hobo. I have some fan photos. The copper fan is for the trailstove. I made it out of copper because it is easy to work with and conducts heat. This allows the fan to blow HOT air for a blast furnace effect. I used a CPU fan. Think about your computer. My CPU fan has run for some 5 years now. My homemade hobo has a fan holder/blower but I have yet to put in the fan (I gave away my last one and just built this stove). The stove comes apart so I can adjust the body size. The trailstove benefits more with a fan due to its smaller firebox. Both the homemade hobo and the trailstove DO NOT need a fan to run. The zip stove MUST have a fan. The trailstove and all my homemade ones are made out of stainless steel. The ZIP stove’s firebox is made out of galvanized steel. They must have used standard pipe for the firebox as the galvanized just burns off. I used about a big hand full of sticks in all the burn pics. The flame and heat output is impressive. All stove pics are using fans with the exception of the homemade hobo stove and a parting cooking trailstove shot.

Why a HOBO stove and not a small campfire? I have a few good reasons.

1. First in the North East most parks and trails do not allow open fires. They are only allowed in campsites. Not a bug out issue however.
2. Greater BTU output for less wood.
3. I find with a cotton ball or pine tar it is much easier to start wet wood. The flames from the starter material tend to hit the wood in the perfect spot. Under the wood. The reflected heat dries out the wood in the firebox fast. I have never failed starting wet wood.
4. Easier to use under a tarp. The fire is contained in a small area. If you are handy one can even make a spark arrestor. I have done this.
5. When the fire burns down to coals restating is easier because of the updraft and reflective heat. But that is subjective.
6. A 5-gallon bucket of wood lasts me all night.
7. Fast set up. I don’t need to look for rocks to support a grill. Rocks are easy to find in the summer but often frozen to the ground in winter.
8. Does not scar the land like a ground fire. A 5-inch ring of fine ash remains. With the zip stove all the ash remains in the firebox. The company states ash should be packed out. But that is just silly.

I am not saying that a HOBO stove can replace a raging, “white man’s fire” Or every other camp stove. I am not saying small campfires are not good to cook on or boil water. But you get a lot of heat for very little wood with a HOBO wood burning stove

ZipStove.

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http://www.zzstove.com/sierra.html

The trailstove. For best results make a X pot support to raise to pot 1/2 or so above the top. I sorry no pics of that but if people are interested I could take some and post it

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http://www.trailstove.com/


My homemade MEGA HOBO. I can change the stove size by changing out the body.

Short mild steel body

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Stainless long body.


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You will need not pack fuel. You don't need to build a fire ring and look for tricky pot supports (rocks etc). The hobo stove is a self-supporting foolproof system that anyone with a Bug out Ruck should consider. They are light weight to boot.
Last edited by Woods Walker on Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by misanthropist » Wed Jun 14, 2006 6:18 pm

I use a trailstove myself. I like it a lot. No moving parts, no need to carry fuel. Burns everything pretty well. I can't remember the last time I used a liquid fuel stove, actually.
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Post by Woods Walker » Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:54 pm

I stopped using white gas some time ago. Still have my MSR international white gas stove. It puts out good BTU's but in hard conditions the seals etc would need to be replaced. It has screwed me before so I carried the repair kit. The 11 oz tank needed to be pumped too often during cooking. The larger tank helped out but the stove was heavy (fuel). Also I do not care for the smell of gas when cooking under a tarp. I use a hobo stove or cook right on my lightweight tent stove. I guess for an urban setting with access to abandoned cars (fuel tanks) then maybe I could pack it. But just too many thing that can and do go wrong. Also if forced into the backcountry the stove would be worthless in a week or so. I do carry a homemade alcohol stove with 8 oz of fuel for light duty cooking on the trail or if all the wood is so wet that even I can't get it going. This can happen when lots of moisture is frozen into the wood. Something you may have come across. But nothing beats the smell of a nice Maple fire. Here are some of my alcohol stoves. Maybe others could key into the types of stoves they carry. No right or wrong answers. Just different preferences.

The down side the alcohol stove is lower BTUs. So unlike white gas fuel stoves don’t expect to cook for large groups or melt snow. The up side is no moving parts. They are fast and easy to use (no pumping and often they are self priming). Good for one or two people. Windscreens are useful for most liquid fuel stoves but they are needed for the alcohol stove. The fuel is also a disinfectant and if you decide to carry pure grain you can get smashed. Takes the edge right off. I use Denatured Alcohol. For anyone that has never used DENATURED alcohol do not drink it.

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Here are some stoves that anyone can buy.

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Post by jakemuay » Sat Jun 17, 2006 10:13 pm

Very cool (or hot). Do you have plans or instructions for your Mega hobo?
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Post by TheRodfather » Sun Jun 18, 2006 1:31 pm

Damn WW, you make some really good & informative threads.

+1 to you.
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Post by Woods Walker » Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:04 am

I will take a pic of the 3 parts to the stove and post them sometime this week but unless you are good at welding it would not be an easy project to do. Mega hobo puts out some crazy BTU's. I like when it turns wood into gas and shoots out balls of flame. I have been thinking about building a wood gas stove. These stoves turn the wood to gas and produce very little smoke. Think of a wood gas stove like combustion but in reverse. That makes no sense but is the only way I can describe it. Heat from a wood fire but no smoke and very little ash. Maybe "Combustion but in reverse" was not the best way to describe a wood gas stove. I will go with "inverted downdraft gasifier". This is from the first link.

"The stove can be started and operated indoors with no exhaust fans and no odor of burning wood."

I have to build this thing.

http://www.repp.org/discussiongroups/re ... Turbo2.htm

http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/WoodGasStove/


TheRodfather

Thanks.

Edit to add info.

Here is a wood gas stove for sale.

http://www.spenton.net/

here is a review of the stove.

http://www.freewebs.com/markviibullitt/REVIEW.htm

I bet it would not be hard to build a better one than is for sale or the homemade empty tin can one in my second link.
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Post by Woods Walker » Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:07 pm

Here is the pic of the 3 parts of the homemade mega hobo as promised.


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Post by Tomcat1066 » Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:00 pm

Woods,

Maybe I missed it, but any chance you can direct me to a website on building a hobo? Lord know, I can never have enough ways to cook.

Also, how is the smoke with one of these stoves versus a regular wood fire?

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Post by Woods Walker » Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:01 pm

Tom here is a nice little hobo stove that you can make.

http://www.nimblewillnomad.com/stove.htm

http://zenstoves.net/Wood.htm

The hobo can make more smoke than you ever believed possible or much less than any camp fire. It is all up to the person using the stove. I can run them very clean.
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Post by Tomcat1066 » Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:23 pm

Cool! What seems to make the difference? I'm sure wood selection has something to do with it, but anything else?

Tom

Editted to add: PM SENT!!! :mrgreen:
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Post by Woods Walker » Wed Jun 21, 2006 6:17 pm

Fuel is important but airflow is key. Too much wood and not enough air = more smoke. I will have to do a thread on combustion. More people know about the combustion of wood the better the chance of survival. It is easy to think this is not important. Just grab any old thing lying around and burn it. But survival is about efficiency. Death comes more from a slow grind rather than a fantasy bear attack. Every little screw up burns callories and water. Add a bunch together and you die. We can be sloppy today with a Super Market down the road but in the woods nature doesn’t give any buy one chicken and get 2 free deals.
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Post by jptp0831 » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:29 pm

Woods Walker, I bought a Trail Stove. Now, that have one and understand how it was assembled I will make my own. I tested it and it works! It works better than any other stove I have tried. I was able to get the fire so hot that the sides of the stove glowed red. If anyone has a little sheet metal experience you can make one of these. Brilliant! Thanks for you post.
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Post by Woods Walker » Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:00 pm

I have a fan and an X pot support for the trailstove I should do an up date on how to make these items. Crap look at the photos my old pic service sucks. I need to replace them. I don't know why people carry white gas stoves. I can see for short term use but anything longer than a week and they are not worth it. Don't over stuff that trail stove or it will clog.

I just fixed the photos in the main feed.
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Post by CLEAR CUT » Sun Aug 27, 2006 6:47 pm

Here's some of my newly created hobo stove. I made it out of ducting, sheet metal and some rivets I had laying around. Still needs some work but shows definite promise.
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Post by Gunny » Sun Aug 27, 2006 10:10 pm

Ha! Looking good Woods and CC.

Woods: Do you employ any 'traditional' mutli-fuel stoves? Think MSR's line or JetBoil.

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Post by Woods Walker » Sun Aug 27, 2006 11:47 pm

CC.

I like your stove. Now you just need a door and a spark arrestor.

Gunny.

"Woods: Do you employ any 'traditional' mutli-fuel stoves? Think MSR's line or JetBoil."

I have a MSR Wisperlite international and a Pocket rocket. But have moved away from them.

The white gas/Auto gas stove has some real pros. Gasoline has an enormous potential energy. Much more than most people understand. I think a gallon of gas has something like 21 sticks of TNT worth of explosive energy if conditions are right. So there is some good reason to carry one however there are some good reasons not too. The MSR stove have seals and other parts that often fail. They have failed on me and a repair kit is a must have. The lower the tank gets the more it must be pumped. Carrying the fuel is heavy and if it can't be re supplied even a large tank comes turns into a paperweight after a week. Maybe a tube with ball pump to get some gas out of cars etc. But the stove in not really sustainable in the longer term. MSR and the military was working on a capillary action stove that would have nearly no moving part and depends on capillary action to power the stove. The vaporization would be much more efficient and the stove would not break. This seems like a good thing.

The pocket rocket like the Jet boil uses Iso-butane fuel tanks that maintains its pressure even when the fuel is low. Iso-butane too has massive amounts of potential BTU’s. The pocket rocket type stoves have very few parts to break and are therefore extremely reliable. They fair a bit worse in very cold weather but nothing a few minutes in a occupied sleeping bag or jacket can’t correct.

I just don’t see the value of these stoves in an extended bug out as they are not worth taking on a week long camp. A good wood burning stove uses like nothing for fuel and can boil unlimited amounts of water without the difficulties of using hot rocks to heat the water or trying to balance a pot on two rocks or hanging above a fire. But these methods work. Also the stove allows for a lower key fire that will heat a shelter or under a tarp etc. Plus they get a person thinking about more stainable life style more away form gear that will not last forever or could get trashed. Heck even a Zip stove will run longer something like 35 hours on a D cell battery and 10 gallons of wood. It is nice to boil your pots clean and never care or think about any fuel.
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Post by Gunny » Mon Aug 28, 2006 12:03 am

Woods Walker wrote:CC.

I like your stove. Now you just need a door and a spark arrestor.

Gunny.

"Woods: Do you employ any 'traditional' mutli-fuel stoves? Think MSR's line or JetBoil."

I have a MSR Wisperlite international and a Pocket rocket. But have moved away from them.

The white gas/Auto gas stove has some real pros. Gasoline has an enormous potential energy. Much more than most people understand. I think a gallon of gas has something like 21 sticks of TNT worth of explosive energy if conditions are right. So there is some good reason to carry one however there are some good reasons not too. The MSR stove have seals and other parts that often fail. They have failed on me and a repair kit is a must have. The lower the tank gets the more it must be pumped. Carrying the fuel is heavy and if it can't be re supplied even a large tank comes turns into a paperweight after a week. Maybe a tube with ball pump to get some gas out of cars etc. But the stove in not really sustainable in the longer term. MSR and the military was working on a capillary action stove that would have nearly no moving part and depends on capillary action to power the stove. The vaporization would be much more efficient and the stove would not break. This seems like a good thing.

The pocket rocket like the Jet boil uses Iso-butane fuel tanks that maintains its pressure even when the fuel is low. Iso-butane too has massive amounts of potential BTU’s. The pocket rocket type stoves have very few parts to break and are therefore extremely reliable. They fair a bit worse in very cold weather but nothing a few minutes in a occupied sleeping bag or jacket can’t correct.

I just don’t see the value of these stoves in an extended bug out as they are not worth taking on a week long camp. A good wood burning stove uses like nothing for fuel and can boil unlimited amounts of water without the difficulties of using hot rocks to heat the water or trying to balance a pot on two rocks or hanging above a fire. But these methods work. Also the stove allows for a lower key fire that will heat a shelter or under a tarp etc. Plus they get a person thinking about more stainable life style more away form gear that will not last forever or could get trashed. Heck even a Zip stove will run longer something like 35 hours on a D cell battery and 10 gallons of wood. It is nice to boil your pots clean and never care or think about any fuel.
Good response, thanks :) Makes sense too, I'll have to give your wood burning stove a more thorough look.

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Post by jptp0831 » Mon Aug 28, 2006 1:07 am

If you don't make one, they can be had for under $30.00 USD delivered. Does anyone know if coffee cans are galvanized?
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Post by Ivan » Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:08 am

jptp0831 wrote:Does anyone know if coffee cans are galvanized?
I wouldn't think so, as there would be no need. I have not seen one, at any rate.. Pineapple juice cans are galvanized, however.

Galvanized metal has a flecked appearance.

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Post by Civilian Scout » Mon Aug 28, 2006 9:49 am

Aren't there some health hazards associated with exposing galvanized steel to very high tempertaures? I believe there are some dangerous gases that can be released, zinc oxide or something like that. Anyone have the scoop on this?

Making one of these could be a nice, inexpensive winter project for me. Lord knows I love to tinker around with things. This morning I think I found just the right thing to use for the body of a hobo stove, a 5 liter micro-keg. I have two sitting in my kitchen. The beer is gone now, so I might as well put them to use. :)
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Post by jptp0831 » Mon Aug 28, 2006 11:58 am

Yes, when heated you get zinc gas. Well, I give the coffee can a try.
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Post by 2now » Mon Aug 28, 2006 12:08 pm

Instead of a coffee can for a base stove unit, what about a standard mailbox?

It’s usually a metal box with a door on one end, although it is painted. I can’t figure out if it would be better to put it upside down, so that the top was flat and make some legs, or just put in on the flat bottom. But it seems that a mailbox is pretty much purchasable for under $10 in the basic shape a stove needs to be in.

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Post by Woods Walker » Mon Aug 28, 2006 1:51 pm

Zinc is a non-issue as it will burn off but don't cook on any stove with a galvanized coating until it burns off. You can also use Stainless Steel kitchen containers for a small hobo stove. These are cheap.
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Post by jptp0831 » Mon Aug 28, 2006 2:05 pm

Once again the master speaks. These are so simple they are brilliant. I was going to use a coffee can because I have one. Thanks for your help WW. This will be fun.
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