Salam9nder's B.O.B. (pics, inventory, prices)

[Salam9nder]

Below is my first attempt at a bug-out bag; I've got it pretty close to complete save for whatever folks discover missing in this post and item upgrades. I tried to be frugal when putting this pack together, so I've cut corners in a few areas with the intent of improving the inventory on a gradual basis. I'm also listing the prices of what I can, with the thought that it may be helpful for people starting out on putting their first B.O.B. together. If you know where you can get a similar item but better quality or cheaper, please feel free to list it! I'm listing the prices for any items which I already owned as N/A.

For the most part I tried to stick to the 3-day concept of a bug-out bag, but I have less than that in some areas, and more than that in others. For instance, nearly every disaster agency in the country says you need at least one gallon of water per person per day. For three days, that's 25 pounds of water - no way I'm trying to carry that. On the other hand, a fishing kit wouldn't be necessary in a 3-day pack, but I'd like to have it in any survival kit, especially since fishing is such a viable food source in my area.

Rather than going pouch-by-pouch,I'm organizing the inventory as: water, food, shelter, clothes, first aid, personal hygiene, tool kit.

THE BAG



($35.00 shipped) Medium A.L.I.C.E. pack with frame.

True to the learning curve, this was my first purchase and first mistake - I bought it on Ebay for $18 (used but excellent condition) and paid $17 for shipping. I could have gotten this for $25 at a gunshow, along with many other items in the inventory. I strongly recommend gunshows for anyone starting a bag; there are lots of good deals and you're supporting the independent dealer. Shipping and handling costs jack the total price of items way up.

($4.00 each) LC-2 buttpack

I added one of these to each side for the first aid kit and tool kit. They don't sit very tight to the pack, though, with just the ALICE clips - probably because it wasn't designed to attach there.



So I've run zip ties through the D rings (which I think are where the suspenders would normally attach) and that keeps the packs from flopping around and getting sloppy. The problem with this solution is that now I can't easily detach the FAK or toolkit from the ALICE. I'd welcome any suggestions - I may just see if I can attach a MOLLE M249 SAW gunner's pouch there and get rid of the buttpacks.

WATER



($20.00) USGI canteen, cup, and cover - should have bought used; paid too much for these. Is the little pouch on the side for holding water treatment pills? Because mine fit perfectly in there.
($9.00) Nalgene bottle
(N/A) Gatorade bottle
($5.88) Potable Aqua iodine pills - treats 25L water.
($60.00) Katadyn Hiker water filter - filters approximately 750L water. Got this with a $75 gift certificate to BassPro from my ex-girlfriend's father.
($0.31 each) Powdered Gatorade - for amending the taste of filtered or treated water and replacing a few carbs and electrolytes.

I'm carrying 3 liters of water, which weighs 6.6 pounds if my math is right. I'm very tempted to cut that down to just one liter since water sources are so plentiful in my area - you can't walk a mile in any direction without coming across half a dozen freshwater streams, ponds or reservoirs. Between availability and the fact that I'm carrying 3 methods of treating water, I'm thinking I might be able to do without that extra weight. Thoughts?

I've got the Gatorade bottle in there just as a tip to folks on a budget; those bottles are made from much stronger plastic than the regular Aquafina or Deer Park bottles. The plastic is thicker and the corrugated design helps with their toughness. Plus, they're free - save the cash now, pick up some other items for your B.O.B. and upgrade to Nalgenes later.

I'd like to see how a MSR Hydromedary bag fits in one of the ALICE pouches, but for now the canteen will do for drinking without having to put my pack down.

FOOD



Not pictured is the scrubbing pad for cleaning the canteen cup.
($10.00 shipped) Datrex emergency ration bars
($1.00) Knorr Red Beans and Rice - for morale after eating 3 days worth of coconut-flavored wheat bars.
($1.00 each) Cliff Bars
(N/A) Camp stove - windscreen and stove made from recycled materials. The Nalgene bottle nests in that windscreen just right. Bonus points if you recognize the fuel bottle that's holding the denatured alcohol. It hasn't leaked! This Pepsi can stove and the other items are a work in process. Right now, I can boil 500mL of water in 12 minutes with 45mL of fuel. My goal is to get it down to boiling the same amount of water with 30mL of fuel and in 6 minutes, but I'm still trying different stove sizes and burner-hole placement.

VS.

I think part of the problem is that space between the cup and the windscreen in the left side of the above photo; too much heat escaping there. I might need to scrap the canteen cup idea and get an Olicamp cup, which will nest with the Nalgene bottle and should fit perfectly in that windscreen. Not sure if all 3 will nest together. Some of you may have noticed ideas borrowed from J. Falk - the windscreen can do double duty as a wood-fueled stove.

SHELTER



($26.00) USGI-style poncho and liner. This is not genuine military issue - I know I'm going to take some criticism for buying the made-in-China stuff, but I couldn't find the USGI ponchos for any less than $40.00 new, and that doesn't even include the liner. I'm not willing to trust the used ponchos on Ebay. I've tested this poncho in the rain and it does a fine job of keeping me and my pack dry, as long as I'm not carrying the machete as it is seen stowed in the first picture. I'm confident this poncho and liner will do for a 3 days-ish bag, so they will just have to suffice unless I can find a deal on some genuine USGI stuff locally.
(N/A) Thermarest self-inflating camp mattress. I'm considering removing this item due to its bulk and relying on gathering natural materials (dry grass, forest litter) for bedding. The other problem I have with the Thermarest is that they're not supposed to be stored in the compressed state because it will damage the self-inflating foam. So, if I can't keep it compressed, I might just set it aside and reserve it for recreational camping.
(N/A) Wool blanket
($9.00) Poly ground tarp - this is actually a footprint I made for my tent, which I later dropped from the pack due to its size. So the footprint is now my ground tarp. It's a 7' hexagon, though, so it's too big. I need to either cut a man-sized ground tarp from another cheap poly tarp, or invest in some good ground cover that is designed for that purpose. More balancing of cost vs. benefit for a 3-day bag.

On my to-buy list is a Eureka Backcountry 1 Tent, which I think will fit nicely with this pack.

CLOTHES



($32.00) Polypro thermal top, bottoms, and balaclava. These will be removed once the weather warms up a little more. They take up an awful lot of space at the moment.
($19.00) Dickies pants, one pair - 65% polyester, they're durable, low profile, and dry quickly if they get wet. Dickies makes cargo pants, so those are on the to-buy list. I wish they made a coyote brown or olive drab color, but I think I'll go with the charcoal color since it's a little more muted than navy (pictured at the end of the post). I'm avoiding BDUs because the ALICE already has enough of a military look without adding to it. I'm trying not to look like I'm playing soldier - might be another good reason to get rid of the canteen.
($3.76) Spare hat and bandannas - no dust mask in the pack, so the bandannas will have to do.
($41.91) Two Reebok short sleeve t-shirts, one long sleeve shirt. These are all athletic poly/nylon blends meant for wicking sweat.
($14.00) Two pairs Nike poly boxer-briefs.
($15.00) Four pairs polyester socks, one pair heavy wool socks. The wool will also be removed when the weather warms up.
($6.30) Hooded fleece. Not pictured because I was wearing it, heh. Got a great deal on this at the K-mart clearance rack.
(N/A) Some leather gloves are in there somewhere.

I'd like to eventually get some stuff sacks for the clothes instead of ziploc bags.

FIRST AID KIT



I'm a firefighter/paramedic, so it was reeeaaallly tough to not get all squirelly here. I decided to go with a stripped down cuts and bruises kit. Some things that are missing and worth noting: SAM splint - I can improvise some splints but this would be nice to have; I'm thinking about trying to find some space for one. CPR mask - family and friends I can do mouth-to-mouth on. Otherwise they're just not getting ventilated. Tourniquet - will improvise with a bandanna, cravat, belt, whatever. This is what I have - most of the prices are not available because I already owned the items:

(N/A) Blood pressure cuff
(N/A) Stethoscope
(N/A) Nitrile gloves
(N/A) Band-Aids
(N/A) Alcohol preps
(N/A) 3M Durapore tape
(N/A) 3M Transpore tape
(N/A) Four abdominal pads
(N/A) Space blanket
(N/A) Cravat
(N/A) Two ACE bandages
(N/A) Two Kerlix
($2.50) Triple antibiotic cream
($1.00) Crazy glue
($3.24) Meds: Aspirin, Ibuprofen, Tylenol, Imodium, Benadryl
($14.00 shipped) One-month supply of Iosat since I live in the plume zones of both a nuclear power plant and a shipyard that services nuclear-powered vessels, and I love my thyroid gland.
(N/A) Medical tools - these are kept wrapped in the bandanna so the pointy bits will be less likely to stab me if I fall on them. Two hemostats, one pair of bandage scissors, one pair of surgical scissors, two pairs of tweezers, one eye magnet. I think I'll reduce these to one of each tool.

PERSONAL HYGIENE



($0.50) Hand sanitizer
(N/A) Toilet paper
($2.88) Camp soap
($2.19) Bug spray
($1.47) Sun screen
(N/A) Lip balm
($2.44) Toothpaste and toothbrush
(N/A) Dental floss - will double as thread for sewing kit.

TOOL KIT



Most of the smaller items are stored in the black zippered bag to keep them in one spot. The larger items are in the main compartment of the ALICE. Some of these items, like a ferro-striker, the compass, the multi-tool, etc will be moved to my belt and pockets when given an opportunity during the bug out.

(N/A) Ontario Knife Co. machete. I can't say enough good things about this machete - it's more than 20 years old and still in great shape. The saw isn't good for much, but it looks cool. These people have me as a customer for life. They go for about $25-$30.
(N/A) Ka-bar Next Generation knife. This is a decent knife, but it's really too big for me to consider practical. It looks like you could kill an elephant with the thing. I need to sell it and get a more utilitarian knife. It was a gift - I think they sell for anywhere between $60-$110.
($2.50) Two lighters. I swear I'll zip tie the fuel plungers as soon as I find some zip ties that are the right size.
(N/A) Doan magnesium fire starter
($4.97) Mil-Spec steel fire starter
(N/A) Waterproof matches - I've heard some bad reviews of these but mine work just fine on the matchbox striker.
(N/A) Film canister with six Vaseline-soaked cotton balls
($0.88) Pad of index cards
(N/A) Fifty dollars in small bills
(N/A) Writing tools; carpenter's pencil, Sharpie, regular pencil and ballpoint pen
($2.88) Spork
($20.00) Silva compass - this model has the sighting mirror, which is sufficient to double as a camp mirror.
($4.00) Whistle/compass/thermometer/magnifying glass combo
(N/A) Mil-surplus compass - this is my old compass; think I'll remove this from the pack as redundant.
($3.88) Synthetic camp towel
($15.00) ID
(N/A) Zip ties
(N/A) Ancient Gerber multi-tool
($20.00) Pre-paid phone card; six hours
(N/A) 2G thumb drive - right now this item has copies of my personal info, medical history, drug allergies, emergency contacts, important phone numbers, copies of personal/family photos and pictures of my house and its interior. I need to get scanned copies of the following documents: home, auto and medical insurance, mortgage, birth certificate, latest W2, auto titles and registration, record of mortgage, car and utility bill payments. I also need to make a TrueCrypt file for these items - thanks whoever linked that source on ZS.
(N/A) Fishing kit in a tobacco tin. Also contains a needle for sewing.
(N/A) 25' of duct tape on a business card
(N/A) Two cord locks - free at a textiles convention
(N/A) Extra razor blades for my EDC knife
($2.00) Utility carabiners
(N/A) Three feet of heavy-duty aluminum foil
(N/A) Fifty feet of paracord, plus another 20' of "scraps" so I'm not tempted to cut my 50' section for small jobs.
($8.00) Hand crank radio with weather channel - I need to see if I can find a smaller version of one of these.
($4.00) Steel tent stakes
($6.95) Local map
($5.00) Hat lamp - a bit of a compromise but I figure it'll work since I always have a hat with me. It gives off as much light as most headlamps and is plenty bright enough for working around the camp or walking a trail at night. I think a proper headlamp would be more secure, though, especially if it's windy.
($7.00) Throwdown LED flashlight - 40 hours on 3 AAA batteries. I have the batteries for both lights covered with electrical tape so they don't burn down if they're accidentally switched on in the pack. I need to change the alkaline AAAs out to lithium.
($8.00) ANSI-approved and UV proof sunglasses/safety goggles.
(N/A) Contractors garbage bag.



Fourty-four pounds with three liters of water.

I can access the machete from this position, but I can't put it back unless I doff the pack. The LC-2 buttpacks are about one inch away from interfering with my arm swing when I walk, but they're okay in the current configuration.

I did a 5-mile/2-hour walk after these pictures. I can't really call it a "hike" because the land was totally flat and I was on a well-maintained trail. I didn't have to make any adjustments on where things were inside the pack. I noticed that the shoulder drag for which the ALICE is famous is directly proportional to how tight the waist strap is - considering how much weight I had, I thought the strain on my shoulders was acceptable. I'll probably invest in a MOLLE kidney pad if I find one at a gunshow or mil-surplus shop. I'm familiar with the Tactical Tailor improvements, but I wouldn't use them on a $35 pack.

Another thing revealed during the test hike - I need decent hiking boots. My work boots are just fine for unencumbered day hikes and overnight camping trips, but add 44 pounds to 5 miles and they don't cut the mustard. I'm a cheapskate, though, so I'm not willing to pay more than $70 for hiking boots. After that, I'll just invest in Band-Aids. I'd love to hear some suggestions on affordable hiking boots.



Another view of the tarp/wool blanket/thermarest pad roll. I could slim that down substantially by getting rid of the Thermarest pad and getting a proper ground tarp - future considerations.

Total investment: $464.37 - largely influenced by what I did and didn't already own before starting this project.

So that's version 1.0 - I'm looking forward to hearing critiques and suggestions!

[SweetTea]

Looks pretty good!

If I were you, I would keep the three liters of water. I know it's heavy as hell, but there's nothing like the satisfaction of knowing that you could go a full 24 hours without a refill. Aside from peace of mind, you also might want to consider the fact that at any given point, your actual water supply will be anywhere from .5-3 liters (if you're like me and like to save that last bit for emergencies). Also, how accessible is your water? As you probably know, you'll be much more hydrated and need less water if you can take little sips throughout your bugout rather than big gulping sessions, and I've found that it's much easier to drink well if your water is easy to get to. That's the main reason I don't mind investing in hydration packs, but that's a tangent.

For your boot issue, a cheaper solution might be to invest in quality hiking socks. I have good hiking socks to offset my secondhand steel-toed construction boots, and I've done 14 mile days with a pack your size with just a hint of hotspots at the end that were gone after a night's sleep. I know boots are hella expensive, so this might be a serviceable stopgap measure until you can save up enough.

The way your tarp is wrapped around your other stuff, rain could get in an really ruin your day. I know that blanket is wool, but you still don't want it getting soggy. I tarp-wrap stuff sort of "burrito-style," which covers all of the outside surface in tarp.

Looks like a really quality pack, good job!

[Woods Walker]

Nice. I would have looked for more UL shelter/sleeping solutions but heck you have the basics covered. Money spent on boots is money well spent so consider that. Waterproof boots are Key. I have some TT shoulder straps and London bridge straps for both my Alice packs. They increase the comfort but I agree that the straps can cost more than the pack.

You have:

1. Shelter.
2. Clothing and rain gear.
3. Water and filtration systems.
4. At least 3 ways to start a fire.

Once someone has those things everything else is just gravy. You did a great job with the supplemental clothing too however maybe some rain paints to go along with that poncho couldn't hurt. Shit you even have some sunscreen. Again protection from the elements. I got to say good job.

[Mags]

Nice looking set-up. Just can't believe you fit it all nicely into a med. ruck. I agree with SweetTea, reroll the tarp so it protects your other shelter kit. Otherwise nice set-up and rig. Got all the basics there.

[Rednex]

Nice set up you covered all the important areas ( food, water, fire, shelter, cloths)

You also said you had butt pack hooked to the ruck and was thinking of switching out to a saw gunners pouch. I used the alice clips and got two USGI 2qt canteen covers 1 on each side of my Alice pack. I keept the shoulder straps from them inside of them incase i have to unhook 1 and run with it. One of the 2qt canteen covers holds my stove set up and fuel not sure how much room you need ( my stove is a 13oz coffee can and misc. stuff )

[Chef]

Re. buttpacks on side and quick-detach capability: I wouldn't consider anything attached with ALICE clips to be QD, especially when mating two loaded bags. You might consider rigging a single strand of 550 in whatever length is appropriate to suspend the add-on bag and find a way to fasten the cord so it's easy to undo.

Either way, reattachment will be difficult.

USGI canteen, cup, and cover - should have bought used; paid too much for these. Is the little pouch on the side for holding water treatment pills? Because mine fit perfectly in there.

Yup.

I'm carrying 3 liters of water, which weighs 6.6 pounds if my math is right. I'm very tempted to cut that down to just one liter since water sources are so plentiful in my area - you can't walk a mile in any direction without coming across half a dozen freshwater streams, ponds or reservoirs. Between availability and the fact that I'm carrying 3 methods of treating water, I'm thinking I might be able to do without that extra weight. Thoughts?

I've thought about cutting down on the amount of water I carry, too. But remember water is precious and it'd be wise to have one full bottle for reserve while the next bottle is getting purified. I wouldn't be comfortable with less than two liters. An empty bottle weighs next to nothing and you could always have it reserve in case you needed to carry more water.

Camp stove - windscreen and stove made from recycled materials.

Nice. I like that.

Thermarest self-inflating camp mattress. I'm considering removing this item due to its bulk and relying on gathering natural materials (dry grass, forest litter) for bedding. The other problem I have with the Thermarest is that they're not supposed to be stored in the compressed state because it will damage the self-inflating foam. So, if I can't keep it compressed, I might just set it aside and reserve it for recreational camping.

Thermarest is a lot more comfortable than foraged material and doesn't require time or effort to round up when you want to lay down.

I know you're not supposed to store them compressed, but I just appropriated my dad's old Thermarest. I know for a fact that it has been stored rolled up and compressed in it's stuff sack since we went to Philmont . . . in 1991. Works fine if you give it a minute.

Personal Hygiene

I have a similar ziploc with TP and hand sanitizer. I slide a small pack of baby wipes into the hole in the center of the flattened TP roll.

machete

I don't like the plastic machete sheaths. They weigh a lot for what they are and don't really sharpen very well (you'd be better off with a file or a stone, IMHO). What you can do is slide it behind one of the three pockets on the ALICE pack and if memory serves, secure it by working the frog on the sheath into the grommetted holes along the webbing bar that circles the pack opening. That way the machete won't stick out up top so much and doesn't intrude on your interior pack space or keep the main lid from closing completely.

The way your tarp is wrapped around your other stuff, rain could get in an really ruin your day. I know that blanket is wool, but you still don't want it getting soggy. I tarp-wrap stuff sort of "burrito-style," which covers all of the outside surface in tarp.

I agree. Wet wool may stay sort of warm, but it's damn sure heavy. I want to get a casualty blanket as a combination blanket/ground cloth/tarp/etc.

[Rednex]

Not sure how cold it gets where you are.

Do you really need the wool blanket and the poncho liner? They are both blankets and the poncho liner with ponch is a coat and ranger roll.

[bioboy]

Nice set up I'm glad you have some survival items. I almost asked you why the heck you had that much medical stuff then I read the paramedic part and realized you can use that much stuff. It's something I get irritated by people buying stuff and putting it in there pack if they can't use it.

I think you might want increase the water unless all your walk out routes have access to water it might be more difficult. Canada is recommending 1 to 2 liters for drinking water. If you think about it sanitation for three days is fine to skip it not so if your bugging in and any water you use for cooking counts in to your water needs for the day. Plus if your near a river you can bath if you need to.

[Salam9nder]

For your boot issue, a cheaper solution might be to invest in quality hiking socks. I have good hiking socks to offset my secondhand steel-toed construction boots, and I've done 14 mile days with a pack your size with just a hint of hotspots at the end that were gone after a night's sleep. I know boots are hella expensive, so this might be a serviceable stopgap measure until you can save up enough.

Ah, good point - I did the loaded hike with cotton socks; need to see how they'll do with some socks made for the job.

The way your tarp is wrapped around your other stuff, rain could get in an really ruin your day. I know that blanket is wool, but you still don't want it getting soggy. I tarp-wrap stuff sort of "burrito-style," which covers all of the outside surface in tarp.

I tried the burrito wrap once but it made the roll too wide - I gave up on it too early, though; I should fool around with it a little more to see if I can get it good and compact in that configuration.

[stimpy321972]

Nice starting setup,, I use the cheap nylon laundry bags from wally-world, to wrap sleeping bags and blankets I want to keep waterproof. They run from $2-$5 at most any place. The camping stores charge 10-30 bucks for the same thing and they are half the size.

[Rock2Fox]

Don't skimp on the boots dude. $70 is cheap - it looks like you have a well thought out BOB, with some "not so cheap" items in it. Spend the extra bucks for some decent footwear. I wore out several pairs of boots in the Army, and several in civilian life - every time I tried to save money on them - I paid dearly for it on the tail end of the exchange. If your feet are fucked up b/c you bought cheap boots, then all that high speed gear might mean very little.

Love the bag though - it looks great.

Civilian Boots - http://www.montrail.com/Product.aspx?pr ... =120&top=1 - anything made by Montrail is tops in my opinion - the same pair has carried me up Kilimanjaro, the North Cascades, 14ers in CO and every hunting trip for the last 4 years.

Milspec Boots - I used various pairs manufactured by Bates - they worked well, but generally fell apart/ required resoling and repair after about 200 miles.

[Hachiman]

Nicely done, I hate ALICE but you are making it work well for you.

[Tetra Grammaton Cleric]

I tried the burrito wrap once but it made the roll too wide - I gave up on it too early, though; I should fool around with it a little more to see if I can get it good and compact in that configuration.

Compression straps?

With the compression straps that come with my Biker Swag I can compress a foam pad/"mattress", sleeping bag, wool blend blanket (all in situ), ground tarp and the swag itself (oilskin and thick PVC) pretty damn tight.

Very well presented thread. I definitely appreciate the good work, Ta.

-

[Blackdog]

I always see toothpaste in Bug Bags. I have stopped using toothpast for travel, backpacking and bugging out. I have found that tooth powder is more convienent as you can get a greater number of brushings out of a smaller package and the chance of popping the tube goes way down. I used the old stand by Pepsodent powder in a metal can during my military life, but haven't been able to find it for a while. Lots of other brands out there.

http://www.amazon.com/s/qid=1239085435/ ... der&page=1

[Merovech]

No firearm?

[slingstone]

I disagree on the tarp-burrito; put the wool blanket on the outside. Think about it. A wool blanket can get snagged or wet, but still be warm when you need it. If a tarp or thermarest gets snagged, it'll leak. Repairable, sure, but at a cost similar to a new wool blanket anyway.

Montrail is a great brand for quality, but in my experience the best option is to go to an outdoors shop and find a professional take a look at your feet and fit you. A good shop will have a wide selection of brands, giving you options to find a pair that will suit you needs without fighting against your feet.

[Salam9nder]

Nice. I would have looked for more UL shelter/sleeping solutions but heck you have the basics covered. Money spent on boots is money well spent so consider that. Waterproof boots are Key. I have some TT shoulder straps and London bridge straps for both my Alice packs. They increase the comfort but I agree that the straps can cost more than the pack.

You have:

1. Shelter.
2. Clothing and rain gear.
3. Water and filtration systems.
4. At least 3 ways to start a fire.

Once someone has those things everything else is just gravy. You did a great job with the supplemental clothing too however maybe some rain paints to go along with that poncho couldn't hurt. Shit you even have some sunscreen. Again protection from the elements. I got to say good job.

Thanks WoodsWalker - I think I'm going to get an UL footprint for my groundcover to replace that poly tarp; they're not expensive and it will be a big upgrade for the pack. I'll need to research the rain pants since I haven't owned any since back in the days when I had a motorcycle. The poncho does drip on my lower legs, though, so that and my boots will be a consideration.

[chr0nos]

Thermarest recommends unrolling your mat for 24 hours before a camping trip. This lets it decompress all the way after long-term rolled-up storage. The mat will function fine even after being rolled up for years, it will take longer to expand to full capacity.
As an alternative, you can buy a US Army closed-cell foam sleeping mat that can wrap around your tarp shelter, they go for about $10 online. A similar pad can be purchased in most sporting goods retailers, they are either in camping section or yoga mat. The Army foam pads are thinner and made of much more rigid foam. I prefer this because they smooth out the contours of whatever ground I am sleeping on, and weigh less than store-bought pads.

[Murph]

Looks like a pretty sturdy kit. And the more you go out and try things out, the more you'll figure out what you like/don't like and what works/doesn't work.

The buttpacks on the side is a pretty good idea. I think someone said they have their canteens there, which is what the norm is. If you want to have them come off and on easy you could use a combination of keyrings (on the ALICE threw the eyelets) and snap-links (on the buttpack) making it easy to clip on and off.

[Allen]

Nice Post!

A USGI Canteen cup holder would fit Your canteen cup better then the
can You made. They cost about 4.00

What are You digging with? The K-bar? Unless I missed it, I'd add a camp trowel.

Cheers!

[ironraven]

Below is my first attempt at a bug-out bag;

I don't believe you- you've done this before, you ringer.

>LC-2 buttpack
Oh my. BIG side pockets. I might suggest something more secure than zipties, But for this role nothing is coming to mind right away. Biners would be perfect, and you could run them up behind and around the webbing, but it would take a lot of fussing.

You can put a SAW pouch on there, but it won't be as big. Possibly the MOLLE sustainment pouch (at least I think that is what the are called) or MOLLE hyrdo bladder carriers with pouches attached would work.

Oh, and if you need another pocket, the straps that hold the flap down 4 MOLLE channels wide- you can find all kinds of MOLLE and ALICE pockets you can make work there. I think the ALICE SAW pouch will work.

>tempted to cut that down to just one liter since water sources are so plentiful in my area
Bad idea. You might find yourself having to dig in where you are due to an injury, or more likely, find that stopping every two hours to get water, and waiting another hour for ONE (1) container of water to steep if you have to use chemical treatments kinda sucks. I would never go without two liters, and honestly I don't like getting more than a hour or so from the blacktop without a gallon, and I live in one of those places were you really have to be unlucky to go much more than a mile without finding water.

Think of it another way- if you can avoid the watering holes, you've got tactical flexibility.

>I've got the Gatorade bottle in there just as a tip to folks on a budget;
AND, the 20oz ones take up one half of the pocket in the ALICE. 40 ounces of water, one pocket, sounds like a good deal to me.

>Datrex emergency ration bars
For ration bars, I prefer the 1200 and 2400cal bars over the 3600- easier to ration out and if the packaging gets compromized, you aren't out as much.

For three days, I think you are light on food. YMMV.

>get an Olicamp cup, which will nest with the Nalgene bottle and should fit perfectly in that windscreen.
The top rim of the Olicamp cup will EXACTLY fit into the rim of one the ends of a small coffee can. If you have a side cut can openner, you've just put a cover on your cup while making your stove, and fits into the stove very nicely:


As you can see, I run cross pieces, your side cut will work just as well, but I think keeping the can as whole as possible gives you a little more flexibility.

>Thermarest self-inflating camp mattress.
I like some kind of pad if I'm going to be on the ground, but scavanging for material takes time. If you want a pad you can just keep rolled, a close cell foam rig like the old USGI pad or the z-fold from Thermarest would be the ticket. And if you have the one you roll up, let that be the first thing in your ruck if you aren't using the radio pocket- it will give your pack some internal support.

Alternatively, get your butt off the ground. A net hammock runs less than 20 bucks, and if you take out the spreader bar, packs up small. Add a couple of real biners and some tree straps, and you are business. And a big honking net just has so many possible uses.

>Blood pressure cuff
>Stethoscope
Rather than cutting water to save weight, I would trim these. I know, you're a med, but that is what I'd cut.

>I swear I'll zip tie the fuel plungers as soon as I find some zip ties that are the right size.
*LAUGHS*


>Waterproof matches - I've heard some bad reviews of these but mine work just fine on the matchbox striker.
If you are going to use these, keep the dry, dry, dry.

>a needle for sewing.
"A"? As in singular, one (1)? Take three (3), they are little, light and easily lost.

>Hand crank radio with weather channel - I need to see if I can find a smaller version of one of these.
You can, but it will need batteries. I don't mind carrying battery powered, becuase I use it twice a day, 15-20 minutes each for news and weather, and a set of batteries is good for 20 hours, I've got at least a month of power on one set. (Figure there will be times where I "splurge".)

>I'm familiar with the Tactical Tailor improvements, but I wouldn't use them on a $35 pack.
One of my first serious BoB/camping packs was an ALICE. I seem to recall I had some oh so not sexy pads made from 1" thick upholstry foam and duct tape, with cloth sports tape over the duct so it wouldn't slide around. They needed to be rebuilt every summer, but they mostly worked.

>After that, I'll just invest in Band-Aids.
With new boots, or if haven't been hiking for a while, I put duct tape on the spots I know I will blister if I'm not careful. After a few days, I won't need it again.

+1 on the "casualty blanket". You can get a very good one for about 9 bucks at home depot- heavy duty tarp, dark brown, with a shiney inside. I'm going to be testing one more this summer, didn't get a chance to work much with it last year, but it is well thought of by some of the folks I know and I liked the results I got last year. You can spend about twice as much and get the HD space blankets, which work REALLY well and can be used a signal panel if they are in a bright color, but aren't as robust.

Absolulely a small trowel. Even just a cheap plastic one, or a the Wally World U-Dig-It knockoff. (Half the cost, and it just needs a few minutes of TLC with a file to just as good.)

If you are going to be near population centers, I'd say add a silcock key to scavange water from outdoor faucets. The multitool will get you most of it, but by no means all and won't let you close them. YMMV- it is pricy and heavy for its size and versatility.

Electronic light stick, as an area light in camp.

Some wire. I like to have a spool of insulated, solid strand hookup wire and strip it as and if needed, but any good steel or copper wire should do.

[Salam9nder]

Nice set up you covered all the important areas ( food, water, fire, shelter, cloths)

You also said you had butt pack hooked to the ruck and was thinking of switching out to a saw gunners pouch. I used the alice clips and got two USGI 2qt canteen covers 1 on each side of my Alice pack. I keept the shoulder straps from them inside of them incase i have to unhook 1 and run with it. One of the 2qt canteen covers holds my stove set up and fuel not sure how much room you need ( my stove is a 13oz coffee can and misc. stuff )

Okay - the USGI 2gt canteen covers will be something I'll look for in the shops and shows. I'll need to remember to bring my Nalgene bottle for checking the space.

Not sure how cold it gets where you are.

Do you really need the wool blanket and the poncho liner? They are both blankets and the poncho liner with ponch is a coat and ranger roll.

Not very cold at all; southern Virginia is pretty mild. Most of the colder winter nights are in the 20s, we occasionally get snow but it's rarely around for more than a day. I needed both in a tent for a 20 degree night here, so I'm reasonably certain I'll need them both if I use the poncho as a shelter, depending on how much time I invest in weather-proofing the poncho shelter. On the other hand, I'm going to be getting one of those heavy duty space blanket tarps to use as ground cover, so maybe I won't need as much insulation. I'll just have to field test it to see...

[Merovech]

I am still concerned that you do not have at least a .22 or other serviceable firearm.

Even a little Ruger MKIII Hunter, would give you (limited) personal protection and small game hunting ability.

[Salam9nder]

I am still concerned that you do not have at least a .22 or other serviceable firearm.

Even a little Ruger MKIII Hunter, would give you (limited) personal protection and small game hunting ability.

Yeah, a firearm didn't make the cost/weight/benefit analysis for this bag. All I own is a .38 revolver and an M1 Garand, and neither of those are good for a B.O.B. When I get around to putting together an I.N.C.H. bag then I'll make a decision on a firearm, but for now I want to concentrate on refining this bag and starting on a G.H.B. for my truck.

Of course, if the disaster was so bad that I needed to skulk around toting a rifle for personal protection (foreign military invasion, zombie uprising), the Garand would be coming with me despite its weight. I think that would have to be a TEOTWAWKI scenario, though, and I was really building this bag more in anticipation of the natural and man made disasters likely to occur in my area; hurricane, tornado, nuclear event, house fire, HazMat in my front yard, etc.