The Great ACU Debate. (56K death!)

[Jeriah]

In my view, buying ACU gear because it's cheap, is like buying a $125 Mossberg 500 as your only firearm: it may not be my top pick, but if that's what your budget allows, it makes sense, and if the money you save is helping you stock food and water, or get out of debt, or buy latex schoolgirl outfits for your wife to dance for you in, then it's all to the good.

On the other hand, going from there to the step of arguing that ACU/UCP is a good pattern, is like arguing that the shotgun is a good defensive gun, because it's what you could afford. I'm not saying they're good or bad, what I'm saying is this: if something is affordable, and works, use it by all means, but don't then argue that because it's what you could afford, that it is also the best choice, unless you really believe that and would still buy it if money was no object.

The reason this is relevant is that, when you recognize the limitations of your system, whether it's camo or a shotgun, you can then modify the gear and your training to minimize the disadvantages. So, I'm not saying don't buy ACU gear, at all. What I am saying is that, if you look at it, and are honest, you'll see that it's usually too light, and too blue/cool, for most environments, other than couches and gravel driveways. But if you're honest about these limitations, hey, no worries! You can still buy cheapo ACU gear, and then when you've got your kit put together, a cheap bottle of brown RIT dye will take care of the problem pretty well.

[Kommander]

I am curious as to what "civilian colors" are?

[Jeriah]

I am curious as to what "civilian colors" are?

When I hear that I just read "solids." Look at an LL Bean Catalog sometime, they have all your favorite colors, they just call Coyote Brown "Arizona Sandstone," Olive Drab "Scottish Heather," and Foliage Green "Spruce Mist." Or some shit like that.

[moab]

In my view, buying ACU gear because it's cheap, is like buying a $125 Mossberg 500 as your only firearm: it may not be my top pick, but if that's what your budget allows, it makes sense, and if the money you save is helping you stock food and water, or get out of debt, or buy latex schoolgirl outfits for your wife to dance for you in, then it's all to the good.

On the other hand, going from there to the step of arguing that ACU/UCP is a good pattern, is like arguing that the shotgun is a good defensive gun, because it's what you could afford. I'm not saying they're good or bad, what I'm saying is this: if something is affordable, and works, use it by all means, but don't then argue that because it's what you could afford, that it is also the best choice, unless you really believe that and would still buy it if money was no object.

The reason this is relevant is that, when you recognize the limitations of your system, whether it's camo or a shotgun, you can then modify the gear and your training to minimize the disadvantages. So, I'm not saying don't buy ACU gear, at all. What I am saying is that, if you look at it, and are honest, you'll see that it's usually too light, and too blue/cool, for most environments, other than couches and gravel driveways. But if you're honest about these limitations, hey, no worries! You can still buy cheapo ACU gear, and then when you've got your kit put together, a cheap bottle of brown RIT dye will take care of the problem pretty well.

"or buy latex schoolgirl outfits for your wife to dance for you in"

LMAO! Literally! Maybe I can dye her hair with some RIT dye too!

I hear you. I agree it has limitations. a lot of limitations. I'm not arguing it's the best. I just hate seeing people put the smash on it right out of the gate for people that maybe can't afford better. And your right. A bag of RIT dye would fix this entire subject.

[moab]

I am curious as to what "civilian colors" are?

When I hear that I just read "solids." Look at an LL Bean Catalog sometime, they have all your favorite colors, they just call Coyote Brown "Arizona Sandstone," Olive Drab "Scottish Heather," and Foliage Green "Spruce Mist." Or some shit like that.

Yes. That's what I mean. Or worse - yellow, blue, red. But if your going for the grey man theory. More power to you! Chances are we'll all be screwed no matter what strategy we come up with anyway! LOL!

Besides. Aren't Zombies color blind?!

[Kommander]

To be fair I think there is a difference between "Arizona Sandstone" and "California Sunshine".

[moab]

To be fair I think there is a difference between "Arizona Sandstone" and "California Sunshine".

I concede to you sir. There is quite a difference.

[Sledgecrowbar]

I'm really surprised by the pics of the two hats on the pavement, ACU blends better than the Multicam on neutral dark grey asphalt. It doesn't do too terribly in the shadow pic versus Multicam, either. Multicam seems to come out ahead overall, which follows all the info I've read on the subject thus far, but ACU isn't as terrible in the bush as it looks standing on a street corner. Maybe the stuff I've seen in person is just faded? It sure looks faded. What I'm saying, from these pics, is that ACU at least functions.

I think It was mentioned, but CADPAT was the first, and MARPAT came from it. CADPAT looks like the best of the digitals for NA, but I haven't even tried to find it in the US. I'm still not sure who thought it would be a good idea to make a desert sand-base color with foliage green digital on it, it doesn't look right in the desert or foliage, and that's why it failed, but it looks good enough in these pics. I think if you're fighting in the Middle East, you should have desert camo, be it chocolate chip, 3-color, or digital. Sure, we should have camo that matches our native environment, but when was the last time we fought in America? The soldiers I see walking on the street look like they could blend into a moldy cement wall, and not much else.

I have trouble justifying camo, shy of an INCH situation where I spin the needle and head in that direction, it's as easy for me to get everywhere via urban territory as wilderness. A single set of Multicam is probably always worth it's weight to carry in an INCH bag, though. And once you do that, you may as well get a pack cover, parka and shell pants, hat, gloves and boots, and whatever web gear you equip with.

The solid-color strapping on camo gear pisses me off, to. Especially since they do make camo strapping.

[angelofwar]

Tagged for further reading...

Woodland fan here...

[omega_man]

I hear some frustration in your voice. You sound offended. I know what it's like to get issued crap gear. It sucks. I didn't mean to offend you.

How does relating my experiences with ACU in the field sound frustrating??? As a fellow Marine, you're not going to offend by wearing ACU--disappoint, yes. Lighten up.

And you're right, we probably have a fundamental disagreement over the need for matching cammies/gear in an INCH/BOB. But, as the subject of your thread reads: this is the ACU debate ("great" one at that). If you have an aversion to people disagreeing with you, then I suggest not creating a thread that opens up the floor to everyone's opinion.

My opinion, as succinctly stated as possible, is derived entirely from personal observations through the course my time in the Marines and having operated and trained in various environments with other branches of service. Our opinions differ, it is not frustration or offense, just disagreement--hence, a debate.

Semper Fi

[Blackdog]

Moab wrote:

"But for me it comes down to what I simply can and can not afford. I can't afford to sit around waiting for the time when I can afford marpat"




OK, so what's the debate??

If you want to get a complete outfit of ACU, do so.

Personally I think that agonizing over what pattern to fully outfit in for a possible event so jacked up that it makes you take your family in tow and bug out 1200 miles with a INCH is kinda, well, lame..... Unless this is the final, last, terminal piece of the keeping you and your tribe at 98.6 puzzle.

I will go on record as saying that I think the ACU uniform pretty much sucks (and not just for the pattern) and any piece of ACU gear needs a quick blast of Krylon to be truly happy.

RLTW

[angelofwar]

Ok...at home now...

I'm the same boat op. However, I will say that I try to acquire woodland before ACU, but, woodland is getting harder and harder to come by. I have just about everything in woodland/OD. I don't plan on going through major urban areas in an INCH scenario, so, woodland will be my first choice. Woodland is seriously underrated in it's ability to conceal in a wooded environment. It's also very effective in dark environments, if it's not to worn. We currently are using ABU's, which is essentially a tiger stripe version of ACU, which also suffers from being to grey/white in a wooded environ...but they have there advantages in concrete/rocky environments. The only serious issue I see with ACU is in wooded/green environments...maybe you could pack a pair of BDU's for movemnt in wooded areas...your pack (ACU) would be fine if set on the "whiter" ground, against a rocky area/back drop (or even a light brown one). I think you should consider woodland camo options in your inch plan, since they are as cheap as ACU, but, why pack two pairs of a moderately effective camo, when you can pack one ACU and one woodland, and be covered for both areas?

I also like the idea of the alice pack covers, being available in different patterns...so it doesn't matter what color your pack is.

5th post on here shows that they still make them in modern camo patterns:

http://iacmc.forumotion.com/t2434-alice-pack-cover

This may be an option...to help in trasitioning to different types of cover

[offcamber]

I hunt in Multicam, my buddy hunts his old issued ACU's.. the deer don't seem to notice a difference at all.

[Kutter_0311]

and I have yet to meet a ranger I haven't wanted to punch in the face...

No offense, but I haven't met a Ranger that hasn't wanted to punch a Marine in the face either...

Yeah, I think there's a lot of that. Call it personality clash, or just being too similar in some regards, or violent tendancies...

Overall, these are not groups of guys I'd put together on a small base anywhere in the US. The Sheriff just won't have enough cells...

The solid-color strapping on camo gear pisses me off, to. Especially since they do make camo strapping.

How do you throw off a well engineered blend of colors and shades that breaks up your silhouette into your background?

3-7 light tan horizontal stripes should do the trick... ***FACEPALM***

I hunt in Multicam, my buddy hunts his old issued ACU's.. the deer don't seem to notice a difference at all.

Now, IDK about zeds, but I am pretty sure that deer are colorblind...

[Blackdog]

and I have yet to meet a ranger I haven't wanted to punch in the face...

No offense, but I haven't met a Ranger that hasn't wanted to punch a Marine in the face either...

Yeah, I think there's a lot of that. Call it personality clash, or just being too similar in some regards, or violent tendancies...

Shoot, I kinda like the Jarheads on this board, I sincerely doubt that I would want to punch all you guys in the face if we were to meet in person .

Back to ACU, that shit makes my eyes hurt.

[ninja-elbow]

Hell, I'm still in love with Woodland and am starting to have trouble finding woody gear. It's out there but the supply is dwindling. Same with tri-color dessert.

ETA: Just be glad you're not arguing or into the US Navy digital tidal wave crap. I see pics of what were my old shipmates now in either that pattern or kakhis and I chuckle at the digital US Navy uniform.

[moab]

Here's a screen shot of ACU dyed with dark green RIT dye. The guy doesn't remember how much he used or for how long. Although he did do a few tests before he got this color. Straps, buckles and material all seemed to take to the dye. The top is original ACU. Left top looks like faded ACU. The bottom is the dyed ACU. And to the right is woodland. Just for comparison. He has other pouches that he dyed longer. That turned out a darker dirtier not that attractive color.



Not butt hurt here omegaman. You just seemed to be a little cranked up. I wanted to make sure I hadn't offended you in some way. I love a good debate too. Just wanted to make sure I hadn't offended you in some way. Semper Fi to you to brother.

I think the RIT dye color is much better than the original. And a lot closer to a faded dirtier graduated OD. That particular pouch does not seem to have that much of the lighter color digital on it. But you can see right above his fingers how some of the lighter color turned out. I think you could go even one step darker. As long as you don't lose some of the graduated greens. It would be interesting to see how a larger piece of material turns out. Like the leg of a trouser or a pack or something. I guess if you started with some small cheap pouches to test on. You could achieve a doable color. Which would quell this debate. I guess. Except for the cheap crotch ripping trousers. It makes me wonder if you could dye the straps on an ILBE(?).

I think I have to admit a subconscious reason for liking ACU too. Back in the late 70's early 80's we had the lighter colored ripstop. And just like any other piece of equipment (hat, boot, pack what have you...) the lighter it was the saltier you were. The real bad asses had worn out boots. And faded utilities. The more sun damaged and dirt damaged and lighter your gear was - the more of a bad ass you were. Sounds fucking stupid. LOL! But it was true. I remember seeing my first class of graduating grunts from basic with their boots all worn away in the heel from marching. And their uniforms all faded out. And the tops of their ears peeling away from sun damage. And you always felt a deep sense of admiration. The same followed you into the Fleet Marine Force. So you always tried to hold onto your utilities until some Gunnery Sergeant ripped you a new one. And made you throw them away. I wore my ripstop until they were almost falling off. Way after they had introduced Woodland BDU's. And we hated those BDU's. To god damn thick and hot in Socal and Asia. They were miserable to wear. After years in our airy light ripstop cammies. (I guess that's an old term too - "cammies". That's what we called them.) ACU reminds me of that. For better or for worse. For worse perhaps.

I have to admit I'm in love with this pack. This is the first modern back pack I've owned. Ignorance may be bliss. But I like it. After having humped Alice. And old backboards and old Kelties(?) hunting. This pack seems like a dream on my back. The straps and waist belt are like pillows compared to what I used to hump. I think you current duty guys probably hump more than we ever did. But your gear is a hell of a lot lighter. And a lot more comfortable. I remember disobeying orders constantly in the field. And leaving half of our bullshit behind. Or in a harbor site. Running light and lean on a few MRE's in our pockets, a poncho and liner. And that was about it. But I was in a STA platoon so we could get away with that.

I don't really mind that it's Army stuff either. (Being a former Marine.) We were kind of non conformists back in the day. Patriotic. But non conformist in any way we could sneak it in. Any way we could stick it in their ass. We would. LOL! So I don't really care what kind of gear I carry. As long as it works.

As for my 1200 mile bug out. It's a matter of months before we move back to WA from CA. So that situation will be rectified shortly. But the 1200 mile difference is simply because that is where my entire family is. If the SHTF we would "eventually" move in that direction. In the hope of getting to "friendlies". Unfortunately in the LA basin there are over 25 million people. They are going to fan out in all directions for many hundreds of miles. It will be a long trek even to get away from them. In comparison the entire state of WA has only 4 million people. That means 25 million people packed into a couple of counties. That are going to fan out in all directions. It poses a very interesting BO scenario. It's not a good situation.

I have other BOL's along the way. At this early stage of my temporary plan (meaning I'm moving soon.). East and north. I have a good (prepper) friend in Nevada that we can stay with as long as we want. And relatives north. But the first plan would be to try to hit the water in a boat and leap frog our way up the coast. I have sailing experience. And know where we can borrow a boat. A friend of mine owns several boats that could make the journey.

The problem with LA is that there is no "safe" BOL. Just to many people. You'd eventually be over run by a stronger force. I have relatives in the Valley (within a day or two walking distance). But even there is in the middle of city. It will eventually be over run. So yes. I have a BOL within typical BO distance. But it still isn't safe. Your not safe until you get at least a hundred miles out of LA. And even then you have 25 million other people doing the same thing. So probably several hundred miles.

And the distances are to far to get to anything considered rural. You can "drive" 3 hours east from me and not run out of city. Can you imagine how far that would be on foot in urban terrain? It's insane. So any bug out is really going to be an INCH. Is it the best plan in the world? No. That's why I'm moving back to WA. But the reality in this moment is that we would want to eventually make it home to WA. You can get to the Santa Monica mountains in a day or so. And follow those north along the coast. But thousands of other people will be doing the same thing. LA poses a real puzzle for bugging out. It's not built up. It's built out. Flat. That goes on for miles. With millions of desperate people. If someone has a better plan I'm all ears. It's just what I've come up with so far. Considering the situation that I'm in. And the several months before I rectify it by moving.

I could go into more of my plan. Like the fact that I need to carry civilian clothes for some portion of the journey to try to fit in. I'll try to pack my rifle so as not to stand out. But I've written enough here. Semper Fi.

[angelofwar]

Hell, I'm still in love with Woodland and am starting to have trouble finding woody gear. It's out there but the supply is dwindling. Same with tri-color dessert.

ETA: Just be glad you're not arguing or into the US Navy digital tidal wave crap. I see pics of what were my old shipmates now in either that pattern or kakhis and I chuckle at the digital US Navy uniform.

I have some spare (new) desert bdu's/accessories ninja from Enduring Freedom, shortly after 9-11...shoot me a pm if yer interested

[Blackdog]

Here's a screen shot of ACU dyed with dark green RIT dye. The guy doesn't remember how much he used or for how long. Although he did do a few tests before he got this color. Straps, buckles and material all seemed to take to the dye. The top is original ACU. Left top looks like faded ACU. The bottom is the dyed ACU. And to the right is woodland. Just for comparison. He has other pouches that he dyed longer. That turned out a darker dirtier not that attractive color.



Not butt hurt here omegaman. You just seemed to be a little cranked up. I wanted to make sure I hadn't offended you in some way. I love a good debate too. Just wanted to make sure I hadn't offended you in some way. Semper Fi to you to brother.

I think the RIT dye color is much better than the original. And a lot closer to a faded dirtier graduated OD. That particular pouch does not seem to have that much of the lighter color digital on it. But you can see right above his fingers how some of the lighter color turned out. I think you could go even one step darker. As long as you don't lose some of the graduated greens. It would be interesting to see how a larger piece of material turns out. Like the leg of a trouser or a pack or something. I guess if you started with some small cheap pouches to test on. You could achieve a doable color. Which would quell this debate. I guess. Except for the cheap crotch ripping trousers. It makes me wonder if you could dye the straps on an ILBE(?).

I think I have to admit a subconscious reason for liking ACU too. Back in the late 70's early 80's we had the lighter colored ripstop. And just like any other piece of equipment (hat, boot, pack what have you...) the lighter it was the saltier you were. The real bad asses had worn out boots. And faded utilities. The more sun damaged and dirt damaged and lighter your gear was - the more of a bad ass you were. Sounds fucking stupid. LOL! But it was true. I remember seeing my first class of graduating grunts from basic with their boots all worn away in the heel from marching. And their uniforms all faded out. And the tops of their ears peeling away from sun damage. And you always felt a deep sense of admiration. The same followed you into the Fleet Marine Force. So you always tried to hold onto your utilities until some Gunnery Sergeant ripped you a new one. And made you throw them away. I wore my ripstop until they were almost falling off. Way after they had introduced Woodland BDU's. And we hated those BDU's. To god damn thick and hot in Socal and Asia. They were miserable to wear. After years in our airy light ripstop cammies. (I guess that's an old term too - "cammies". That's what we called them.) ACU reminds me of that. For better or for worse. For worse perhaps.

I have to admit I'm in love with this pack. This is the first modern back pack I've owned. Ignorance may be bliss. But I like it. After having humped Alice. And old backboards and old Kelties(?) hunting. This pack seems like a dream on my back. The straps and waist belt are like pillows compared to what I used to hump. I think you current duty guys probably hump more than we ever did. But your gear is a hell of a lot lighter. And a lot more comfortable. I remember disobeying orders constantly in the field. And leaving half of our bullshit behind. Or in a harbor site. Running light and lean on a few MRE's in our pockets, a poncho and liner. And that was about it. But I was in a STA platoon so we could get away with that.

I don't really mind that it's Army stuff either. (Being a former Marine.) We were kind of non conformists back in the day. Patriotic. But non conformist in any way we could sneak it in. Any way we could stick it in their ass. We would. LOL! So I don't really care what kind of gear I carry. As long as it works.

As for my 1200 mile bug out. It's a matter of months before we move back to WA from CA. So that situation will be rectified shortly. But the 1200 mile difference is simply because that is where my entire family is. If the SHTF we would "eventually" move in that direction. In the hope of getting to "friendlies". Unfortunately in the LA basin there are over 25 million people. They are going to fan out in all directions for many hundreds of miles. It will be a long trek even to get away from them. In comparison the entire state of WA has only 4 million people. That means 25 million people packed into a couple of counties. That are going to fan out in all directions. It poses a very interesting BO scenario. It's not a good situation.

I have other BOL's along the way. At this early stage of my temporary plan (meaning I'm moving soon.). East and north. I have a good (prepper) friend in Nevada that we can stay with as long as we want. And relatives north. But the first plan would be to try to hit the water in a boat and leap frog our way up the coast. I have sailing experience. And know where we can borrow a boat. A friend of mine owns several boats that could make the journey.

The problem with LA is that there is no "safe" BOL. Just to many people. You'd eventually be over run by a stronger force. I have relatives in the Valley (within a day or two walking distance). But even there is in the middle of city. It will eventually be over run. So yes. I have a BOL within typical BO distance. But it still isn't safe. Your not safe until you get at least a hundred miles out of LA. And even then you have 25 million other people doing the same thing. So probably several hundred miles.

And the distances are to far to get to anything considered rural. You can "drive" 3 hours east from me and not run out of city. Can you imagine how far that would be on foot in urban terrain? It's insane. So any bug out is really going to be an INCH. Is it the best plan in the world? No. That's why I'm moving back to WA. But the reality in this moment is that we would want to eventually make it home to WA. You can get to the Santa Monica mountains in a day or so. And follow those north along the coast. But thousands of other people will be doing the same thing. LA poses a real puzzle for bugging out. It's not built up. It's built out. Flat. That goes on for miles. With millions of desperate people. If someone has a better plan I'm all ears. It's just what I've come up with so far. Considering the situation that I'm in. And the several months before I rectify it by moving.

I could go into more of my plan. Like the fact that I need to carry civilian clothes for some portion of the journey to try to fit in. I'll try to pack my rifle so as not to stand out. But I've written enough here. Semper Fi.

I may have razzed you a bit about the 1200 mile thing but...

I hear you. I never liked wearing the heavy BDUs and would stick to the ripstops winter and summer just because they would in fact actually dry out. Somewhere in the middle years we got issued the light weight OD Green OG-107 slant pockets and I loved those things and the same thing applied, the more faded the better. Those things would drop a crotch from time to time too but still I loved them. The good thing was they were unit issued so if you wore them out you just turned them into supply and got new ones, perfect then but supply ain't happening out here I would guess.

My personal feeling is that cammies are way way down the dealing with the shit list. They may or may not help. Dodge Commander Zero's crazy boys because you have cammies or get immediately strung up by the good people of Walnut Grove because you look just like one of Commander Zero's happy go lucky cammie clad sociopaths, who knows.

What isn't a feeling is that all the cammies in the world won't make up for not having the gear or skills to make bad water good, gear and skills to plug a hole in my wife and the other way around, good boots that don't frig up feet or fall apart, the gear and skills to keep from freezing to death and on and on and on just in the "highly unlikely" bug out scenario.

So, since I only have all these problems totally squared away in some other quantum theory alternate universe I personally will leave the matching cammo pattern problem for another day and concentrate on what I feel are more important keeping my tribe at 98.6 tasks.

Bugging out of frigging LA, man I don't even want to think about that possible CF alternate universe.

[moab]

blackdog - I hear you. Bugging out of LA. Shit living in LA. Is an alternate universe. If it was just me I'd get a dirt bike. Take the firebreak across the Santa Monica mountains. And strap an Uzi to my chest. (Kidding sort of. I have a friend who's plan is to ride his dirtbike out of town.) LOL!

Glad to hear someone else had the same "cammie" issues too. That term must sound awful to everyone but Marines. Kind of how "battle buddy" or "woobie" sounds to me. So what was the next generation of BDU's after woodland? Something you called slant pockets? Was it any lighter weight? God woodland BDUs were awful. It was like wearing Carharts. No offense to those that love them. But I run hot personally. I need light weight stuff. And layers I can add to my top if need be. I could wear shorts year around.

But your right. Need to stick to the stuff that really counts. Boot's are a good subject. I'm just starting. Just getting my gear together. Kept looking at boots. Wanted to find a deal. Kept thinking about all the miles I humped in shitty old black combat boots. But the more and more I looked at it. The more I decided this was one of the places I wasn't going to skimp on. Consulted my father. (An old Indian.) He said one word "Danner". I trust him. He's an old Marine. That spent the first three years of my life as a trapper. Been a woodsman in the big mountains of the NW his whole life. Used to build trails up into the high country for the Forest Service with my grandfather. I'll save up a little longer and get the boots I want. Rather than the ones "that will work".

I need to advance my training in first aid too. Good point. It's been to long since I studied or was trained in any of that. Became blatantly apparent when I started putting my FAK together. I need to know how more of this stuff works. Back in the day no one ever even considered giving an IV. A tourniquet was about as far as it went.

[Boondock]

Now, IDK about zeds, but I am pretty sure that deer are colorblind...

If I remember from the novel World War Z, the military switched to a blue, bite-proof jumpsuit as the Zeds weren't affected by camouflage.

Back on topic and closer to reality, I won't weigh in on the concealment/durability issues with ACU. There are positives and negatives.

I will say that the lone piece of ACU gear I'm packing is my boonie cap.

In a SHTF scenario, I worry about wearing too much ACU and being mistaken for military.

I'd hate to have to explain to a frightened populace that I'm not there to help, I'm trying to survive, just like everybody else.

That might not go down very well.

[Niblick]

In a SHTF scenario, I worry about wearing too much ACU and being mistaken for military.

I'd hate to have to explain to a frightened populace that I'm not there to help, I'm trying to survive, just like everybody else.

Aaaand the guy with 12 posts wins. This is your biggest hurdle. This is why blue jeans are a better idea. Shit, I personally know some NCOs that would shoot you on the spot for desertion.
I've read all your posts in all these threads and still have no idea what your really getting at. I think down the road, you're gonna look at your closet full of surplus UCP ta-50 and say; "WTF was I thinking?". Yes it's relatively cheap but no matter when you use this stuff, people are gonna think active army or former army. I don't understand why you would want to send that message.
Too many people with real life experience (not Internet pics) are saying yuck. Personally, I come hear for advice on things other people are more proficient with.
I truly mean no disrespect, I'm just trying to save you money.
Thank you for serving.

[run faster]

Im not military and all my stuff is AP stuff soooo my opinion doesnt really count.

But,
If the pics at the beginning are in the OPs AO, to me it looks like ACU would work. In fact I was pretty surprised at what I saw, the lighter colors seemed to blend in better than the darker colors, which surprised me because I always thought greens and browns would blend better. But that doesnt factor in light and shading etc. So I say if you like it, stick with it.

I personally probably wouldnt get it, I dont want to be mistaken for military for reasons like people thinking you will help them, or people thinking you are attacking them, or leaders thinking your AWOL, and out of respect


As far as ACU in phoenix, I spent ten years in Surprise and I think it would work good out there. Lots of lighter colors, greys, light browns, real light greens etc. Especially during the summer when its so hot, everything seems greyer. Now if you were on the east side of phoenix, it probably wouldnt work, with all that dark rock

[run faster]

PS, I recently paid 135 for a mossberg 500.....