Where do you draw the line? (Extended families)

[Akin]

I would rather have you then most of my family.  It looks like US utah people need to see about helping our L.A. ZS members when "The BIG ONE" hits.  If you can make it out of L.A. I know of a place you could set up.
And I am sure every one knows about my fealing on my family.  BUT my dad is on the "Band-Wagon" this after-noon we are going to get together and do his and my step mothers 72 hour kit.  When he said that I gave him all the food for his "starter" kit. (Heat Water,  eat food!)

Interestingly enough, I don't see The Big One as being a bug-out event. The devastation will be bad, true, and to one degree or another, widespread; but get a few hundred miles from the San Andreas and the only affect you're likely to experience will be traffic delays caused by the convoys of supplies heading to the west coast. 

Plus, in my case, assuming I wasn't squished like a bug, I'll be working so much that my OT-swollen paychecks would be staggering. Whether or not I'd even have to tap into my personal supplies is an interesting question... the City has a lot of supplies stashed away to keep things running in an emergency. 

In my case, bugging out from a local disaster, no matter how bad, would be career suicide... does anyone know what happened to the public safety personnel who fled New Orleans after Katrina? I'm actually curious, now that I think about it...

But given a disaster of sufficient magnitude, we're talking apocalyptic, heading for the hills becomes the only option. 

Soooooo... whereabouts in Utah should I be heading? *grin*

[sql_yoda]

In my case, bugging out from a local disaster, no matter how bad, would be career suicide... does anyone know what happened to the public safety personnel who fled New Orleans after Katrina? I'm actually curious, now that I think about it...

But given a disaster of sufficient magnitude, we're talking apocalyptic, heading for the hills becomes the only option. 

Soooooo... whereabouts in Utah should I be heading? *grin*

I know we have an abundance of guys who prepare for the worst on this forum, but I think I need to be ready for something more likely. Here, the most likely is a tornado - second is a very hard winter storm - third is something like yellowstone national park exploding and we have years of ash raining down - in the vein of pompeii.

I love zombie squad because I can already handle the first two thanks to long dead threads on this very site- and there are some really awesome ideas for how to handle the third possibility too.

[nathat]

I hate to be this way, but it is my job to look after my wife and myself. Past that, I will try to look after our parents/brother/sisters, but only if it does not hurt her or myself. Past that, more extended unless... etc.

Point being, I'll help out as many as I can as long as it does not take away from the priority group before them. Once we reach the limit (whatever that may be) unless they have something to offer to the group; I can not help. Sorry.

[SoilSpinach]

Definitely don't assume. If I were the owner of that farm, I would not be willing to take ANYONE in, especially if we're talking about a biological disaster PAW. I would not have prepared for the extra people, and things could definitely go sour when there are all sorts of different opinions in a high energy/stressful situation.

I live far enough from my family that I know they would definitely not show up at my door.

[Davo]

I think I'd have a hard time turning family away, empty handed or not. I am however quite good at putting people to work, there would be no free lunch in the skelco compound.

QFT.

We'll be moving to our BOL this spring. 20 acres in a very rural location, my wife and I and our good friends, a couple who are also preppers. We have some livestock and 2 acres cultivated already, and will be doubling the garden and doubling the caning in 2012. I say that to give background for the following:

Mrs.Davo and I don't have any blood family members within 600 miles, so I doubt that any of them would show up, but we know that if people start bugging out of their homes, we will have as many of the other couple's family members as can make it; we figure up to four family units, maybe a dozen folks. We are going to be getting a yurt for each group, plus some minimal stuff for heating. We are not only expecting them, but hoping they make it, because just the four of us won't be able to provide much security.

However, I do have some friends in Atlanta (300 miles from our BOL/new home) that have gotten the invite. They know they can pre-position stuff at our house, and I hope they will take advantage of that. We also have agreed that if these few people show up empty handed, they will be welcomed, because they are hard workers and possess various skills that will compliment what we already have nicely. We have talked about converting our basement/garage into a dorm for up to a dozen folks, if needed - less privacy the more we take in, though. Also, our co-preppers can fit up to six in their house if needed. We figure a few weeks of cohabitation will encourage folks to put the yurts up.

I am probably not unique in always having dreamed of "getting away from it all and living off the grid" so to speak. Well, we cashed in most of our retirement funds to build our now-through-retirement dream. We know it won't all be butterflies and rainbows, but we are still looking forward to it. Hopefully it will always be by choice - but it shouldn't be too drastic a change if it becomes a necessity.

[squinty]

There are some extended family members for whom I would take a bullet if that were necessary. They'd probably do the same for me. They can come to me and I'll share whatever I have, and I know if I wash up on their doorstep they'll take me in. We've talked about it and planned for it.

There are some other, fairly close family members I don't trust to come into my home right now. If you can't trust 'em in the NAW, you can't trust 'em in the PAW, so they are out in the cold and I sleep like a clear conscienced baby.

[allofthemonkeys]

I have some dead beat extended family, who I would have to think long and hard about letting in. At the same time, I have some white trash family who, while they have their own problems, have some handy skills that would be good to have around.

[squinty]

I have some dead beat extended family, who I would have to think long and hard about letting in. At the same time, I have some white trash family who, while they have their own problems, have some handy skills that would be good to have around.

That's a good point, but IMO trustworthiness trumps skills. If I can't trust you not to screw me over the first chance you get, then your skills and talents become liabilities to me, not assets. But in my case, the people I don't trust are, for the most part, people who didn't cultivate much in the way of skills.

[JLB]

Simple, when it comes to family (which I define VERY loosely, most of my family is not related by blood) & their families, all (with the only exceptions being trust issues of various types, which must be individually evaluated) are welcome. It helps that most of them are, to different degrees, prepared themselves- not all are, but they are still welcome- I need farm labor, I am aware that some of them are unable to, for different reasons (mostly age related, & my elders took care of me when I was young I will take care of them when they are old), do a lot of physical labor- still welcome. Their are even people who I have not spoken to in years, also welcome. There are people I do not like but who fall within my families family, welcome. That being said, the farm rules are set by me & the other people who live here now- this is not a democracy. This applies now & will apply in the PAW, this is one place I refuse to compromise my morals during hard times.

[Kathy in FL]

Difficult question to answer. My family I would take in. My ex Sister in law, mother of two of my nephews ... that would be a stretch but I doubt I could take my nephews without her. On the other hand I don't know how long she would survive a SHTF situation. I have a step nephew from my brother's second wife that I would take in for his sake but he is an "adult" severe ADHD and if I know the kid/young man he would take off and likely get into trouble and not be coming back. My husband's side is countable on one hand - literally - and I'm not sure if they would come to us or not.

What I am prepared to do is take in stray kids. It might not happen right away but I will never turn a child away. Some adults I know can take a long walk off of the old Skyway bridge.

[Norwegian]

Not sure were to draw the line. Most of my extended family is in Switzerland so they are too far away. I may take in my grandparents from down there i they can make there way to me, and maybe one of my uncles and his wife but my other uncle, his wife and my cousins are not welcome as they are useless and not people I'd want to depend on. My parents are 600km's away but i don't want them here as our relationship is not very good. my sister is even further away but she has some useful skills and I'd trust her with my life so she is welcome. I also have a grandfather down there that would be welcome but he is in a retirement home and has severe hart problems (pacemaker and multiple minor hart attacks in the last couple of years), as well as problems with short term memory, so i doubt he would last long.

That said, for now i have no preps and live in a very small flat so i really have no means of taking in anyone but my girlfriend.

[g211]

I would gently discourage anyone from coming here, not because it would present a hardship for me, but because I think rural life is more difficult than most urban people believe it to be, and I also believe that abandoning a familiar place to which you're adapted for an unfamiliar environment while under duress isn't an entirely sane strategy for survival. I think most of my family would find trying to survive here to be a very difficult experience. I wouldn't stop anyone from trying it if they insisted, though.

Still, I'm not prepared to feed or provision anyone but myself here. Others would be allowed to come here to fend for themselves if they thought that doing so would be easier here than in the city, but I would make sure that they knew that I was not accepting the position of being their new mommy by allowing it.

I don't expect I'd get many takers, to be honest.

[squinty]

I have a family member who neglects her own survival now, and places the rest of the family in jeopardy (drug habit, with a history of running successful cons to "burn" drug dealers - ie, get drugs from them without paying. Concomitant scary history of drug dealers seeking direct and indirect retaliation, with my elderly parents, at one time, in harm's way because of it.)

Someone with so little commitment to survival in the NAW isn't going to be an asset post-apocalypse. Sometimes you just can't rescue a drowning person, for fear they'll pull you under with all their clutching and flailing.

[hkusp1]

I'm grabbing my wife and my dogs everyone else can go screw.

[brothaman]

It's my household, then my mom and dad. (they got skillz) and then we'd have to grab who ever my mom says we have to.

Yea, it's like that. ... so I guess my asshole sister is coming along for the bug in.

[Redsky]

Hard call there. There has to be a point where you draw the line even with family. As for me it's simple just me and the wife. The kid's are gone, school and marriage. I still have them in the plans but given the distance and or "situation" I'm not sure that they would "bug out". "Randoms" showing up, would really depend on the "situation". Do I know them for starters? How could they help? Are they bringing their own gear? Its' a moral dilemma. Do you turn away kids because their parents are questionable? What's is the group policy on that? Hopefully where ever I am ,"bunker ed in" it could happened or "BOL" if happens I'll be surprised.
Additionally, without starting a new thread, What if you were the one seeking shelter? How would you present yourself to a "group" or community to gain entry?

[duodecima]

Hard call there. There has to be a point where you draw the line even with family. As for me it's simple just me and the wife. The kid's are gone, school and marriage. I still have them in the plans but given the distance and or "situation" I'm not sure that they would "bug out". "Randoms" showing up, would really depend on the "situation". Do I know them for starters? How could they help? Are they bringing their own gear? Its' a moral dilemma. Do you turn away kids because their parents are questionable? What's is the group policy on that? Hopefully where ever I am ,"bunker ed in" it could happened or "BOL" if happens I'll be surprised.
Additionally, without starting a new thread, What if you were the one seeking shelter? How would you present yourself to a "group" or community to gain entry?

I don't think there's "policy" on this - whether it's family, friends, neighbors, children, pets, etc. Everybody makes their own decisions about what they should do - resources, safety, local factors, and random circumstances seem to factor in for most folks.

My uncomfortable situation is that while a sister&her kids are planned for, her ex & his current wife are Not Welcome. New wife's kids? I've got nothing against them but their grownups aren't staying here, so probably not. Another brother&kids aren't exactly unwelcome, but they're not in the plan. There's a boatload of cousins I'd want to take in if I could - but even with family it becomes a question of resources.

How to present yourself to a group seems worthy of its own thread - I think Skills, Sanity, Work Ethic, and Gear, are all going to be important. But this is another really good argument for why Skills > Gear, they pack a lot lighter and can't be stripped away like gear.

[Pineslayer]

I guess I'm lucky in one way, small family. I am constantly asking this question. Right now I'm planning on 6 people, besides me all women. They are a hardy bunch and not to be messed with. My bro has been invited, although we are not talking right now, he is brave and a good worker. My friends who say they are coming here get the standard answer, "not without preps". Most of my friends who live in the city are prepping for a "normal future", retirement, vacations, and a slight downturn in our way of life. I hope they are correct. My retirement account is less than typical. I have campers and the like to isolate people in a sickness/flu issue scenario. I think that there is strength in numbers, but if you don't have food for them... My friends here in the 'hood and I have mapped out lines of defense, vacant houses to house viable refugees, and have started to really ramp up food storage(food bank), to help those that are worthy. Who is worthy?..doctor, dentist, military, and Angela Jolie.

[DarkAxel]

I have a very large extended family, and to put it simply, most of them are people for whom I would not cross the street to piss on if they were on fire. I actively prep to defend my family and property from some of them (drug addicts, thieves, and all-around asshats).

[KnightoftheRoc]

To me, "family" is about more than just a bloodline or a marriage certificate. To each their own in that regard, you know your own situation better than I could ever manage to.

That said, however, I think it's a good idea, even aside from the prepping mindset, to step back and sort of assess members of the family, ourselves included. Try to assume the outlook of an outside observer with no preconceptions or history with anyone involved. How would you, for instance, appear to someone watching you? Would they think you a hard worker, or a slacker? A team player, or a troublemaking rabble rouser? If you were the one needing a place, what do you bring to the table to make you an attractive candidate?

I know that, for myself, I bring a host of skills, some stronger than others, and a willingness to work hard at them- often harder than is smart, but still. My family, as much as I love them, does not include my liking them all. I love my kids, but each of them is an individual, with faults, just like me. They aren't perfect. So, I have to look at what level of overlooking faults I'm willing to be comfortable with- after all, they are going to have to overlook ALL of mine. One daughter may not be able to cook, but is totally OCD about cleaning- fine, that's workable for the group, and keeps her happy and productive. Another may be a total slob, but cooks like nobody's business- again, that can be made to work. In fact, I'm dealing with similar issues to this at home, with the people already living there. Finding a "system" that promotes domestic tranquility is tough enough in good times!

For anyone coming from outside the home, I'd want them to consider my home to be my castle, because I do. They'd better come equipped as if they were going to be storming that castle, or laying siege to it. In other words, prepared for a long term effort. Because if they aren't going to come equipped well enough to bust in, the door's not going to be thrown open for them. That's not to say if my 80 something mother comes knocking, I'd keep her out in the cold, but beyond my own siblings and their own, people better be considering other options.

I have a friend since childhood that I consider my "little brother". He's an abrasive, rascist, bigotted asshole. And, the first choice to have next to me in a foxhole. He would come with a list of skills rivaling my own, and I'd be willing to overlook most of his bad points in order to have access to his good points. And, I know that in a reversed situation, he'd do the same. To me, "warts and all", he's still family, bloodlines aside.

Rather than restate the good advice listed above, that's pretty much all I got. A given space can only handle a given number of people, so if I were to give only one sentence of advice, it would be "be selective".

[GMScooter]

Wife and kids are my #1 priority. I am lucky in that my mother is a fantastic seamstress, my dad and bro are like me. We are good at building and fixing things. Besides that we are all good shots. We also are all on good terms. With or without preps we'd handle it. I doubt any family outside that would gather.

[cwadej]

Sadly, only one member of my extended family has anything to offer. My dad would meet my immediate family (wife and kids) and we'd move to our rally point, to meet a small number of trusted friends. Save for the kids, all are trained in many aspects of survival, overlapping skills of course.

So, What would I do? Mourn the loss and move on.

[duodecima]

Was discussing this with my sister (who is invited and prepped for) yesterday.

We decided the term for the folks who say they'll just come over to your place should be "apocamooches."