In a legitimate zombie apocalypse..AR or AK?

[SeerSavant]

Actually, I think it's the easiest round ever to stop, at least with ballistic armor...

Well, most zombies you would encounter wouldn't be wearing ballistics, now would they?

If I got bit, you'd have to deal with a zed in plates and an ACH... Better hope zed-me can't use the SGL21 or the Glock...

If you haven't seen it... Dead Heat, with Treat Williams and Joe Piscipo...

Detective Roger Mortis (get it??? It get better) Thought he was having a bad day, when he is killed in the line of duty... Then brought back... Hilarity ensues...

[squinty]

Of the two, I would take the AK-47. If I could choose from any weapon, though, I would stick with a reliable M1911. Easy to keep it in working order, great weapon for untrained persons, accurate, it's unstoppable.

Actually, I think it's the easiest round ever to stop, at least with ballistic armor...

I think that honor goes to .38 S&W. Not .38 Special, but the original .38


I'll throw in that no weapon is "great" for untrained persons, but the 1911 is much further down on the list of handguns I'd choose to hand to a person with limited training.
You want an "easy for a beginner to learn" handgun, go with a Glock or an XD.
The 1911 has to much going on for someone who's only knowledge of handguns is "I think this is the end the bullets come out of."

When I first tried shooting handguns, I found the 1911 the easiest to shoot accurately, because of the short, single action, straight back style trigger. It was very forgiving of my noobish lack of trigger discipline wrt accuracy. Deadly unforgiving from a safety/ND standpoint, of course. But it took a lot more practice for me to "get" how shoot double action handguns, and triggers that moved in an arc instead of straight back.

[Doctorr Fabulous]

Of the two, I would take the AK-47. If I could choose from any weapon, though, I would stick with a reliable M1911. Easy to keep it in working order, great weapon for untrained persons, accurate, it's unstoppable.

Actually, I think it's the easiest round ever to stop, at least with ballistic armor...

I think that honor goes to .38 S&W. Not .38 Special, but the original .38


I'll throw in that no weapon is "great" for untrained persons, but the 1911 is much further down on the list of handguns I'd choose to hand to a person with limited training.
You want an "easy for a beginner to learn" handgun, go with a Glock or an XD.
The 1911 has to much going on for someone who's only knowledge of handguns is "I think this is the end the bullets come out of."

When I first tried shooting handguns, I found the 1911 the easiest to shoot accurately, because of the short, single action, straight back style trigger. It was very forgiving of my noobish lack of trigger discipline wrt accuracy. Deadly unforgiving from a safety/ND standpoint, of course. But it took a lot more practice for me to "get" how shoot double action handguns, and triggers that moved in an arc instead of straight back.

I think he was referring to things like safeties, mag releases, backstrap safeties, and the hammer. A Gock has two things (for a noob): the Bullet Hole, the Bang Button. There are more controls that take time, but I'd rather teach trigger discipline than try to tell them how to shoot when the safety's on and the target is bloody close.

[AK47Heaven]

Doc I assumed you were a Corpsman, but your sig has a Lcpl insignia?Just wondering.Thanks for the constructive posts.

Actually, I think it's the easiest round ever to stop, at least with ballistic armor...

Well, most zombies you would encounter wouldn't be wearing ballistics, now would they?

If I got bit, you'd have to deal with a zed in plates and an ACH... Better hope zed-me can't use the SGL21 or the Glock...

An 03 Marine Zed in plates..shitty.

Haha didn't they use guns in Land of the Dead?That was seriously some of the worst acting and writing I've ever seen in a movie.I know Romero is the original but he sucks.His movies blow.

[Doctorr Fabulous]

I'm an Infantry Marine, Lance Corporal, and I have gone out of my way to become as good as a senior-line corpsman can teach me to be. Doc kind of stuck after awhile, since a few of the staff-NCOs thought I was a Corpsman (I was teaching a medical class with no blouse or insignia on.) One of them called me Doc for about twenty minutes when I mentioned a procedure he wasn't familiar with, and I didn't realize it until a Sergeant walked over and showed the Staff-Sergeant in question my rank.

OT, I stick by this in all things: Do not give someone a mediocre weapon because they have no training. Do what the Corps does, and give them the weapon best suited for their needs, and you can train a solid rifleman with only about 200 rounds of ammo. There's a great deal of training that requires no ammunition whatsoever.

[Kutter_0311]

OT, I stick by this in all things: Do not give someone a mediocre weapon because they have no training. Do what the Corps does, and give them the weapon best suited for their needs, and you can train a solid rifleman with only about 200 rounds of ammo. There's a great deal of training that requires no ammunition whatsoever.

^^See that? Remember it.

A buddy and I trained half a dozen civs on CQB when we built an airsoft team, almost entirely using dry weapons and yelling "BANG! BANG!" during drills. We cleared everyone's houses too many times to count. If we'd have had more time for immediate action drills in the woods, I think we would have been more effective, but you take the training time you get. As it was, anything close-in was dealt with very well by all, but I almost had to drag my DM toward the enemy by the balls or he wouldn't get within range!

1) Assess needs (situation/enemy/etc.)
2) Find tool that fills needs
3) Buy tool
4) Train with tool in all ways
5) ???
6) Victory!

[Niblick]

Best AR vs AK thread ever...There's so much good info being thrown around. I think some folks just click the last page and say "been done to death" without reading any of it.

If I had the choice I'd go with an AR, but I don't. I have an AK and am training to be proficient with it. I'll try to add something new to this by saying that I'm a 27 year old grunt with arthritis in both thumbs. For me, it's honestly painful to put 300 hundred rounds downrange with 7.62x39. Much less so with 5.56. This results in me not training nearly enough due to the mental association of AK 47 with pain for the next 5 days.

Unfortunately house hold 6 doesn't see it as a true problem and has so far vetoed my many attempts at a colt 6720. Maybe I should switch it up and ask for a PSA instead.

PS. Can I haz GaryMalibu's mini14 pleez? Probably the coolest rifle I've ever seen in my life.

[Kutter_0311]

Best AR vs AK thread ever...There's so much good info being thrown around. I think some folks just click the last page and say "been done to death" without reading any of it.

Totally agree! It's amazing what can happen if someone posts a question with actual parameters, and continues to flesh out the scenario as the threads progresses!

If I had the choice I'd go with an AR, but I don't. I have an AK and am training to be proficient with it. I'll try to add something new to this by saying that I'm a 27 year old grunt with arthritis in both thumbs. For me, it's honestly painful to put 300 hundred rounds downrange with 7.62x39. Much less so with 5.56. This results in me not training nearly enough due to the mental association of AK 47 with pain for the next 5 days.

Unfortunately house hold 6 doesn't see it as a true problem and has so far vetoed my many attempts at a colt 6720. Maybe I should switch it up and ask for a PSA instead.

Thumb arthritis? How much did the VA rate you for that? Just curious, as I've seen buddies with some weird disabilities that make mine look 'normal.'

What kind of AK is it? Maybe someone would take it off your hands

[Niblick]

Kutter, I'm still wading through the whole VA claim process. With the recent push to get soldiers out of the army the system is very congested right now.

Mine is a hand picked Wasr 10 that does alright. I've had a bunch of offers but don't want to be firearm-less in the interim. The main reason I haven't "upgraded" yet is because my future finances are so up in the air with me getting out and the VA's history of lowball disability ratings. In the meantime I'm focusing on non 1,000$ preps. Food, water and other survival items.

[Kutter_0311]

Yeah, wait till things calm down to change anything major/expensive.

I assume you had your claim in within 1 year of getting out? You'll get back-payed from the day you got out then. Make sure you get evaluated on every damn thing that's bugging you, and add your back and knees even if they don't bother you much now. You're a grunt, so your back and knees are going to be fucked up. I have 20% on my broken ankle, and 10% on each knee, for 40%. My spine is a train wreck, but I didn't think to have them check it when I got evaluated. Started seeing a chiropractor shortly after, who took x-rays, and got copies for myself so I could take it to VA. If VA rates you 50%+, one more piece of paperwork will get you 50% Social Security, as well.

I haven't seen any evidence of VA lowballing, but you do have to sell your pain, and that's an odd thing for most vets to do. Especially right when you get out, as your still used to an environment that shuns whiners and malingerers, or anyone that could be considered one. It's important to mention that, as a grunt, stuff is more of a problem in the field, where noone can record minor injuries. Every grunt I've known has self-medicated in the field. I always carried 200mg Advil, cuz that was my miracle drug. I shared it with my whole squad. The Infantry can't even get out of the prone without Ranger Candy

I think a lot of guys get worn down by the layers of BS when you go through VA, but remember that it pays for your whole life, and goes up with each dependant. Do it right that first time, get everything evaluated and rated, and you'll be set. Then, if shit gets worse as you age, you can get it upgraded, but that is wholely another PITA...

[Niblick]

I'm still in and my meeting with the VA rep is Tuesday. You're absolutely right about the infantry environment and you give sound advice as to how to proceed. I will do as you say. For so long I've downplayed how much pain I'm in to the other guys, now I'm gonna be honest. Oh and I always have two 200mg ibuprofens in my breast pocket too, ranger candy FTW (or loss depending on your point of view)

[Kutter_0311]

Oh, have VFW or DAV as your 'representative' or whatever it's called. Not having one appointed is like going to court without a lawyer. Fail.

When you get your rating and that back pay check appears, pay off your bills first. Then buy a nice AR Good luck!

[zflask]

I have both, but if I had to choose in the heat of the moment I'd probably go with my ar. The ak is amazing, but if I have to move the ar is lighter, more manueverable, and more people in my area most likely have .223 rounds laying around.

[Niblick]

Son of a bitch...just...son of a bitch. Read the rules and read the thread your posting in and you will understand why all I have is; son of a bitch

[Kutter_0311]

Yeah, most people don't quite get it at a post count of 3, but hey, everyone has a learning curve...

zflask, unless you plan on grouping with friends, only figure your own ammo into the equation. We don't play the 'scavenger' game here. At all. With anything.

Example: Water in a stream/lake is one thing, that's a natural occurance, open to all. So is rainwater. Water in someone else's hot water heater, inside their empty house, is not free to take, no matter how long the residents have been gone or dead. That's just how we roll here. Say it with me, "CHARITABLE ORGANIZATION!"

[Niblick]

Yea I overreacted a touch. But didn't we just go thru this on the last page? In regard to my arthritis issue, do you think a different pistol grip on the wasr would help I do like the platform and could really get behind an ACE folder/ultimak+ aimpoint set up if it was just a bit easier on my hands.

[Kutter_0311]

If you have the stock AKrap pistol grip, I'd sure give something else a try.

My WASR's both had SAW grips after the first gun show

There are lots of other options out there now, of course. AK's finally have some solid aftermarket options.

[Niblick]

Roger, I'll switch out the stock grips before I give up hope. 25$ as opposed to a whole new system...I really want this to work.

[Kutter_0311]

I suggest hitting a gun show and feeling up as many grips as you can to try to find one that doesn't hurt.

i know the SAW grip was nice (to me) but there are plenty of others for the AK now.

[Czechnology]

I have a Hogue on my Draco, and bakelite on my other two. I never had a problem with the stock AK grip, and seem to be the only person on the planet who thinks those hollow SAW grips are only moderately more comfortable than a steak knife.

So yeah, what Kutter said. Try them all.

*ETA: I just realized you have arthritis... maybe try the Hogue in particular? It's quite soft and rubbery, for an AK grip.

[Paladin1]

I'm a Hoguenite. I put the Hogue's on my AK's and AR's.

I think the SAW grips suck.

[SeerSavant]

Hogue grips, without a doubt. The wife has one , I have i on my Arsenal, I even have the wrap around grips for my springer...

It's soft enough where it needs to be, but never feels too soft.


Everybody's hands are different, but I love hogue grips, they grip great, and seemed to be designed for comfort and control...

Example; The wife is a little lady, petite you might say... Her hands are not only small, she's had carpal tunnel surgery in both wrists... She has no problem with my AK, except for the length of pull (put a shorter stock on it for one trip and she had a blast ) and she has the Hogue grip on her Ruger SP101... Which I have fired. We got it because it fit her hands perfectly, and was far easier for her to manipulate, but I find that the grips also support my hands, which are considerably larger.

I won't say they are one size fits all, but they are definitely forgiving and allow a larger range of sizes in comfort...

[Einher]

I think the SAW grips suck.

Hmm, I was thinking of replacing the russian 'donkey dick' grip on my Saiga with a SAW grip when I get some cash freed up actually...

Is there any particular reason they suck or do you just not like them personally?

[AK47Heaven]

I have a Hogue grip on my AK and it kicks major ass.One of the few products I would truly recommend.