Would .22lr be enough?

[Lufah234]

Would a .22lr fired from some sort of semi-automatic rifle be enough to pierce the deteriorating human skull of a zombie and cause damage to the brain? I was thinking .22 because the bullets are common and cheap, which would make finding corresponding ammo easier to find in a PAW. Sorry if this should be in the firearm section, but I thought that since this particular section is for discussing combat, it would be perfect for this post.

[Agent]

There are quite a few threads on .22lr for these situations if you search a little...

This was in the news the other day:

Cousin mistook partner for squirrel in hunting accident

By Kent Tempus, Shawano Leader

A Green Bay man shot in the head while hunting Sunday was wounded by his hunting partner, according to a Depart-ment of Natural Resour- ces conservation warden.

Chou Vang, 70, was struck below the right ear by a round from a .22 caliber rifle fired by his cousin, Ge Vang, 46, also of Green Bay.
...
The two men were 237 feet apart, the investigation determined. Schraufnagel said neither man was wearing blaze orange, but that’s not required when hunting small game, only during the deer gun season.

Despite the wound, Vang remained conscious and alert after the accident. He was taken by helicopter to St. Vincent Hospital in Green Bay, and has been released.

http://www.shawanoleader.com/articles/2 ... /news4.txt

Better than nothing, but far from ideal is the usual conclusion of these threads (after much flaming etc).

[Alaskanon]

There are quite a few threads on .22lr for these situations if you search a little...

This was in the news the other day:

Cousin mistook partner for squirrel in hunting accident

By Kent Tempus, Shawano Leader

A Green Bay man shot in the head while hunting Sunday was wounded by his hunting partner, according to a Depart-ment of Natural Resour- ces conservation warden.

Chou Vang, 70, was struck below the right ear by a round from a .22 caliber rifle fired by his cousin, Ge Vang, 46, also of Green Bay.
...
The two men were 237 feet apart, the investigation determined. Schraufnagel said neither man was wearing blaze orange, but that’s not required when hunting small game, only during the deer gun season.

Despite the wound, Vang remained conscious and alert after the accident. He was taken by helicopter to St. Vincent Hospital in Green Bay, and has been released.

http://www.shawanoleader.com/articles/2 ... /news4.txt

Better than nothing, but far from ideal is the usual conclusion of these threads (after much flaming etc).

Well below the right ear is the jaw, a non-lethal shot by most calibers. A direct head shot is a kill shot. Let's not forget Brenda Spencer. She killed 2 people and wounded 8 with a .22 rifle. Now as we all know zombies aren't real. In a self defense situation a .22 definitely has the power to wound/ward off an attacker with the potential and ability to kill.

[Agent]

I know below the ear isn't a instant kill spot, just posting it since I saw it in the news a couple days ago. But the fact that the guy was 70 and described as "conscious and alert" doesn't sound very promising for SHTF. That said, other than my 12g, my only other gun is a 10/22 so I'd be using it if I had to.

[Paladin1]

[Finch]

absoultly

22lr would be fine

just make sure you get "some sort of semi-automatic"

preferably a 10/22 Gatling gun



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2yzcMPQZdU

[Crajon]

22LR is okay for small game : squarrles, rabbits, snakes and so on. But larger animals you can bring them down with a 22 but you need to be a very good shot or really close to them. Which reminds me of an old saying , it is unwise to hunt Polar bear with a stick.

[jakecwu]

22LR is a great round, for small game and plinking. I was once even told by a real live state police trooper that more people were killed by the .22 than by any other round. That being said, you better be a hell of a good shot to make it work, and I certainly wouldn't rely on it. From a ballistics standpoint, to answer your question, yes it will penetrate the skull of any zombie you may encounter. It may not, however, exit the same skull. Which leads to the aforementioned lethality. Good luck!

G-

[Jeriah]

OP: Search through the existing threads on this topic, there are WAY too many points and counterpoints, pros and cons, to go through all over again here.

The summary is: a .22LR is sometimes fatal, sometimes not. In any given case, it MIGHT work. These facts are true of any caliber. The .22LR is fatal less often than most other calibers, all else being equal. It is a very common caliber, so more people are shot with it than with any other caliber (in the US), so more people die from it. It can be lethal on humans but not reliably so. Act accordingly.

[Penzanse]

Ask yourself this(this can be asked for anything).........Do I want to find out in the ZPAW that it doesn't work? Have a 6-8" barreled 22lr pistol. Try it, if it doesn't work, use it for game. If you didn't properly prepare and you put all of your eggs in the 22 basket, oh well.......

[ML_Roak]

Shoot a coconut with it and see what it does. I've seen the remnants of what a 22 will do to a human brain, the bullet broke into 4 large chunks and bounced around inside the skull, it did not exit. DOA.
A 9mm carbine would have much more punch, and be not much louder. But I wouldn't throw a 10/22 and a brick of ammo in the ditch if I came across one. Any port in a storm.
JMHO,
ML Roak

[azombieattack]

absoultly

22lr would be fine

just make sure you get "some sort of semi-automatic"

preferably a 10/22 Gatling gun



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2yzcMPQZdU

Holy crap thats awesome!!!!


We're talking a 22(long rifle) I knew a guy whos girl friend shot him 3 times with a regular 22 and it didnt even peirce his cloths, this was from about 25 yards or so. IMO 22LR at 20 less yards, yes, it will penetrate a skull.

[Alaskanon]

We're talking a 22(long rifle) I knew a guy whos girl friend shot him 3 times with a regular 22 and it didnt even peirce his cloths, this was from about 25 yards or so. IMO 22LR at 20 less yards, yes, it will penetrate a skull.

Must of been some real light loads. A .22 should at least penetrate skin (even a good bb gun can do this at 50 yards, I've seen it happen before)

[azombieattack]

We're talking a 22(long rifle) I knew a guy whos girl friend shot him 3 times with a regular 22 and it didnt even peirce his cloths, this was from about 25 yards or so. IMO 22LR at 20 less yards, yes, it will penetrate a skull.

Must of been some real light loads. A .22 should at least penetrate skin (even a good bb gun can do this at 50 yards, I've seen it happen before)

50 yards???? must have been one helluva BB gun

[Alaskanon]

We're talking a 22(long rifle) I knew a guy whos girl friend shot him 3 times with a regular 22 and it didnt even peirce his cloths, this was from about 25 yards or so. IMO 22LR at 20 less yards, yes, it will penetrate a skull.

Must of been some real light loads. A .22 should at least penetrate skin (even a good bb gun can do this at 50 yards, I've seen it happen before)

50 yards???? must have been one helluva BB gun

Well I was at a park with some people and we were all standing in a group talking. All of the sudden one guy starts yelling and grabbing his face. We looked at it and he had a BB lodged in his cheek if I remember right. As it turned out, after the cops came, the guy who shot him (he was aiming for someone else in the group, but he missed) was across the park and in his house. It was about 50 yards, give or take a few.

[Phoenix David]

While a .22LR can and does kill many pre-zombies, it's track record in that area is not that good. Bullet placement would be a major factor in weather of not a .22LR would incapacitate a pre-zombie or a full fledged zombie but even then it may not to sufficient damage to immobilize the pre-zombie or full fledged zombie.

Your probably better going with a round that has a better track record, because when the ZPW happens it's not the time to find out that it takes 14 rounds of 22LR to stop the flesh munching horde shambling after you

[The Sundance Kid]

So obviously best bullet placement would be head shots?

I can knock the shit out of a coffee can at about 175-200 yards with my Remington 552 Speedmaster, so I assume that would be about the only time you would ever aim for center mass with a .22? Long distances?


Can anyone else think of any scenarios where a head shot wouldn't be your best option?

[azombieattack]

Can anyone else think of any scenarios where a head shot wouldn't be your best option?

With a 22. no


I will say any 22 would not be my weapon of choice, but I certainly wouldnt dicard it either.

[Alaskanon]

Can anyone else think of any scenarios where a head shot wouldn't be your best option?

With a 22. no

Not exactly true, in a self defense situation lethal shots aren't necessary. A limb shot should be pretty effective at deterring an attack, a CBM shot would also work well as it doesn't destroy the tissue as much as larger calibers would. (For the record, I do not carry and have never shot an aggressive target with one. I am basing my statement on what I have seen while hunting small game like ptarmigan)

[azombieattack]

Can anyone else think of any scenarios where a head shot wouldn't be your best option?

With a 22. no

Not exactly true, in a self defense situation lethal shots aren't necessary. A limb shot should be pretty effective at deterring an attack, a CBM shot would also work well as it doesn't destroy the tissue as much as larger calibers would. (For the record, I do not carry and have never shot an aggressive target with one. I am basing my statement on what I have seen while hunting small game like ptarmigan)

While I do agree with your theory. But with a 22. you better take the time to aim for the head, considering the zombies are likely to be wearing cloths, you may not even penetrate the flesh to a point of impeading the zombie...

Have to say with 22. head shot allways, even if you do not penerate the skull, the force of impact should throw their balance off enough to make the either fall, or at least get them off track.

[The Punisher]

absoultly

22lr would be fine

just make sure you get "some sort of semi-automatic"

preferably a 10/22 Gatling gun



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2yzcMPQZdU

Holy crap thats awesome!!!!


We're talking a 22(long rifle) I knew a guy whos girl friend shot him 3 times with a regular 22 and it didnt even peirce his cloths, this was from about 25 yards or so. IMO 22LR at 20 less yards, yes, it will penetrate a skull.

This is much cooler:

Video

I have seen people killed with .22 rounds... so yes, it'll work (probably more so on a decaying skull than a fresh one). Oh and yes this has been discussed more times than one can count.

[spyderco monkey]

I've got to say this would be pretty decisive

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFuuU21c ... re=related

edit! Or this!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS31Gm9t ... re=related

As for the .22, the Aguilla Interceptors look like the .22lr ticket for ZPAW cleanup- 1470fps w/ a /40gr solid--> at 100 yards, the same energy as a 40gr subsonic at the muzzle.

Still, virtually any other caliber would be better.

[deepcover1]

Just like every other Cal Bullet, The .22 Cal is deadly when used properly, More murders and Hits are done with the .22 and .25 cal then any other cal bullet in the United States each year, .22 cal guns were the choice of many Hitmen over the years because of the difficulty in tracing the bullet/weapon by Law Enforcement. Here is a story on a 70's Mafia Hit Squad known as the '.22cal-Hitters' that used silencer-equipped, .22-cal. automatic pistols http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 65,00.html


Break in the hit-team hunt

The Mafia's current version of Murder, Inc. is a squad of professional hit men armed with silencer-equipped, .22-cal. automatic pistols. Although they have accounted for at least 20 Mob executions over the past two years, mystified lawmen knew them only as the ".22-cal. hitters" (TIME, April 18). But now the FBI believes it has a big break in the case —and indeed one of the killers. Last week federal prosecutors in Los Angeles were preparing indictments against an underworld moneylender named Joseph Ullo, charging him with two of the .22-cal. slayings.

Ullo, 49, a short, wily onetime New York City hoodlum who moved west 14 years ago, had been arrested a week earlier on a convenient charge of loan-sharking, with bail set at $1 million. Federal officials believe that he murdered Jack Molinas, 43, a gambling figure and porn-film distributor who was found shot in the head in his Hollywood Hills home in August 1975. The other victim: Vincent Calderazzo, a New York Mafia soldier whose bones were discovered by hikers in a shallow desert grave near Victorville, Calif., in March. Both were killed with .22s.

Authorities have the testimony of three accomplices in the murders. They also have two .22-cal. weapons that one accomplice says were used in the killings; a gun fanatic, he could not bear to follow Ullo's orders to dispose of the pistols and instead stashed them in a safe. FBI agents found them there, along with seven other guns allegedly used by Ullo. The three witnesses told their stories last week at Ullo's bail hearing. Eugene Connor, 43, a man with an arrest record of car theft, said that he was Ullo's getaway driver on the night of the Molinas slaying. Reason for the hit, according to Connor: Molinas refused to pay a $50,000 debt to Ullo. Connor says he waited in the car while Ullo crouched behind a neighbor's backyard fence, waiting for Molinas to return home. Then, Connor has testified, Ullo dropped Molinas with a single shot; Connor heard the popping sound that is characteristic of a silencer-equipped .22.

The story behind the Calderazzo killing was apparently more complicated. Investigators say that it involved an old associate of Ullo's from his New York City days: Manhattan Mobster Vincent ("Chin") Gigante, a power in the Mob family once headed by Vito Genovese. Calderazzo worked in Gigante's gambling network. Following a 1976 FBI raid on his operation, Gigante suspected he had been betrayed by Calderazzo and ordered him to Los Angeles—ostensibly for his own protection.

Calderazzo's sojourn soon ended at Ullo's San Fernando Valley home. The FBI's two other witnesses, Robert Zander, 28, and Craig Petzold, 32, say that they were working at Ullo's place when they heard screams from a guesthouse. Minutes later, they said, Ullo summoned them to the house, where they saw Calderazzo's body. They testified that Ullo gave Zander a .22 automatic with instructions that it be delivered to Connor. Then the pair were ordered to dump Calderazzo's body in the desert, where it became fodder for scavenging animals.

The FBI hopes to link Ullo with a third Mafia hit victim: Michael Ariola, a massage-parlor operator who was shot with a .22 in Los Angeles last year during a Mob takeover of such emporiums. His body was found in a car trunk at the Los Angeles airport. Just before his death, the FBI has learned, Ariola rejected an Ullo demand for a share of his massage-parlor revenue.

At his bail hearing, Ullo's bond was cut to $250,000, but he was told that if he managed to post the sum he would have to report to a U.S. marshal twice a day, every day. At week's end Ullo was still behind bars. That was surely a relief to Witnesses Connor, Zander and Petzold. All are in protective custody after alleged death threats by Ullo. They have more reason than most to remember that two victims of the .22-cal. hitters were FBI informants—and four others were potential prosecution witnesses.

[Wolfdude87]

My god this thread must have been done like 50 times before this. If you're shooting zombie squirrels go for it. If you're shooting zombie people only as a last resort. If there's a doubt, it's not enough.