Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Tue May 10, 2011 11:18 pm

urthshu wrote:Wouldn't an easy way to practice urban bug-outs be to have someone texting you scenarios randomly? You could arrange for a friend to text, say, that a nuke plant melted down on a day s/he chooses and give you updates [this area rioting, that area filled with refugees, your car broke down, etc] and you have to deal with it as it comes up while trying to get to your BIL.

Call it the Murphy Plan. :lol:
I like it! Finally, a situation where that SOB Murphy works FOR you! :lol:
I like it enough, I'm gonna try this.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by PacmanSurvival » Tue May 10, 2011 11:55 pm

I did a mock bug out once, went to bed at 8pm, woke up at 3am, grabbed my backpack and ran to the nearest wooded area, which was about 2 miles away at the time.

I didn't take any transportation or anything that could get me in trouble or do anything I could be arrested for, such as weapons or killing any wildlife, I took a small survival knife with me but that was the only weapon, there was this plot of public area I could go to and I had planned this about a week in advance.

What I did was I made a short list of things I had to accomplish before I could go home.
-Make a fire.
-Build a shelter.
-Find a water source and boil the water.
-Make a meal out of instant rice and beef bullion cubes.
-Finish above tasks before noon.

When the sun came up, I decided I would try to sleep in my makeshift shelter, this was in an area where humans don't frequent, nobody ever goes there, it's just land off to the side of some old railroad tracks that aren't in business anymore.

I made it by lashing some thick sticks together in a square fashion with paracord, four sticks acted as pillars and four others acting as support beams for more sticks to be laid across.

It turned out to be about 4 foot high and roughly 6 foot in both directions.

Then I laid some smaller ones across the top, covering it with leaves, then another layer of sticks and then more leaves, I made walls by using some camouflage netting I had in my backpack, which I placed over the shelter before applying the roofing.

I applied leaves to the side walls as well for added camouflage.

So I crawled inside, tucked in the netting around my shelter, placed rocks on the netting to hold it down just in case, then enclosed myself in and slept for a couple hours on my sleeping mat curled up in my mummy bag, nobody bothered me, no animals bothered me, it actually wasn't too bad.
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by pj_01 » Thu Jun 09, 2011 9:09 am

Urban Bugouts are interesting to do. i have done a few in the past as an experiment. i will have to post a few pictures of what me an my friend did but here are some of the details that might help you.

When bugging out in a town/City you lose the abundance of trees and foliage to make a shelter but with what you lose you gain. You lost the trees but you gained standing structures such as sheds, garages, homes. in the event of an actual disaster a number of facilities such as these will be abandond.

i live in a small town of 1500 people with the nearest city about 50 miles away. we did a mock bugout to try and experience both urban and wilderness bugout.

Here is how our weekend Bugout went. We started at a 3rd friends house 10 miles from town. we walked into town via main road with full packs. Each pack was 45 lbs. at the start.(have a few guns but they where put away Rossi Trifecta and Henry AR-7, and two Air pistols, all where in packs to be hidden and not scare anybody).
We arived at my first friends house where we set up camp around 7pm. the walk took about 3 hours as we stopped twice and took two shortcuts.
Camp was set up in my buddies new empty shed we just put together the week before. using a pelet pistol we shot a rabbit that was going after his garden and cooked it for dinner with a make shift smoker from an old grill. we also took some food out of the garden that was ready to be picked.

Saturday morning we decided to ride two bikes he had in the garage. they both needed work 1 with no brakes and the other would skip gears if you peddled to fast. we made better time for the 12 miles it was to my 25 acre property with our hunting cabin (which we did not make use of). we parked the bikes in some brush and draped a tarp over them to keep dry while it rained. we also had two swiss volcano stoves so we gathered a bunch of wood and split it down so we can cook with them. we turned the last of the rabbit and some ramen into rabbit/chicken noodle soup and dropped in some carrots and celery. later that night we broke out one of the MRE's and each had one.

Sunday morning we broke camp and loaded up. Finished what was left of the MREs we had opened the night before. We returned the bikes to his house then dicided to take a different route to our friends house. we grabbed a canoe from, the garage and took the creek behind his house the rest of the way. it took about an hour to get to the area we wanted to be. my friend stayed with the stuff at the stream while i walked the 1/4 mile to the house and got my explorer. we loaded the canoe and packs and went back to his house and talked on what we can do different such as fixing the two bikes. and losing the few pieces of equipment we didnt use like the small shovel and the fishing poles.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by urban-survivalist » Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:04 pm

Incredible Thread.

I did it.

About 2 weeks ago, I finally got fed up with all the ultra-planned, "pack-everything-and-head-for-the-hills" field testing. Not realistic. So I decided to try to get a little more gnarly. An urban bug out--clear the neighborhood and a mile or two of area surrounding your home, but still in the city. And not with all your pals.

To try to keep it somewhat raw I decided:

-72 hours
-Alone
-only used what came in a commercially prepackaged kit (hurt me to leave some of my other gear at home, but it was a fun limitation)
-couldn't use any running water--drinking fountains, toilets, sinks, fountains
-cell phone but no charger (in bug out you would probably have the former in your pocket but not the latter)
-No wallet--brought my id, but didn't want the temptation of having access to funds (plus by the time you're bugging out, trying to buy a bunch of stuff and transfer money around may not be too feasible either)
-NO PLANNING--I decided to do this about 11 pm on Thursday, and walked out the door on Monday. Purposely didn't want to think it out.

I walked out the door with my little prepackaged bob and had myself a 3 day adventure. I brought my camera along to capture my experience--if you feel like checking out the video, you can do so at: http://www.the-urban-survivalist.com/72 ... ield-test/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yes there were some iffy encounters with other homeless people, there were some less than sanitary moments, and it was still a million miles away from what a true bug out situation would've been like. But it was a great exercise. Slept on cardboard in planter boxes, crapped in bushes. Eye opening time...

Kinda funny that I would stumble onto this now. I had no idea that anywhere near this many people had contemplated similar things. But being relatively new to ZS and even prepping in general, I know there are lots of cool projects going on that I have no idea about.

@masterblaster--I live in North Park and considered the San Diego riverbed for a night
@pistolpete--my thoughts exactly about real urban disasters vs. simulated.
@redcrow--awesome story about the abandoned tunnel. My brothers and I found one next to Miramar lake in San Diego that actually led to an underground reservoir (as part of water treatment). Be a great place to camp.
@maine1--one of my biggest takeaways from my 72 hour urban field test has been about urban foraging and small game hunting. I was thinking the slingshot route too...
@cauldron--totally right about the homeless dependency. Still depending on food scraps, public transportation, running water, handouts, and climate controlled libraries
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by EODguy » Sat Jun 11, 2011 7:23 pm

I do Urban Bugout almost monthly. I live near Atlanta, but work in town. I have taken the weekends, and just said ok, 24 to 36 hours, I'm on my own with with I have in my pockets. BO is easy with all the nice gear and a plan, and we hope we get benefit of notice but you never know. I have made caches all over the city and this is one thing I check on during my "off-the-grid" time. Are my caches in place, are they still viable, has the area changed since my last visit. I do a lot of surveillance detection, mostly looking for predatory types and things. Also I look for new security enhancements like cameras or locks that I pre-planed to defeat or bypass. Amazing how much a city can change if your just look.

Also, the standard urban uniform is dickie work clothes and a big key wad (Bump Keys) and a smaller non-tactical looking bag. I got a great "string" backpack from a lawyer at a bike show, holds some essentials, but looks the part. Just look like you belong, don't eye "F" everyone and every thing. Avoid cops, avoid the homeless, keep to yourself. Find back ways into places that you don't normally see everyday.

Also I bought some small driveway alert systems that work on rf, They have a good 400' range. I deploy them as early warning devices to keep from having someone walk up on me. Norther Tools had a set for $19.00 they work great, small and will fit inside a Naglene Bottle.

It's easy to say just head out of town, but try it some time, start small hikes, notes lot's of pictures. Do your recon, what can help you, where can you go, where can I get out of the elements. Once you change your whole thought process, it will become easier. I'm new to ZS what I have learned in the past year of reading and watching... Lot's of folks and the gear they have. Ok take a Water bottle, couple of 30 gallon trash bags, 50 feet of 550 cord and a multi tool. All the high-speed gear is cool and sexy, but just damn. I can be issued all the fancy weapons, NOD's and tactical kit available, but bottom line all that stuff just enhances the effectiveness of the operator, you, you are the most important element, everything else just makes the job / task easier. Just my 2 cents worth!
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Sun Jun 12, 2011 1:11 am

EODguy wrote:I do Urban Bugout almost monthly. I live near Atlanta, but work in town. I have taken the weekends, and just said ok, 24 to 36 hours, I'm on my own with with I have in my pockets. BO is easy with all the nice gear and a plan, and we hope we get benefit of notice but you never know. I have made caches all over the city and this is one thing I check on during my "off-the-grid" time. Are my caches in place, are they still viable, has the area changed since my last visit. I do a lot of surveillance detection, mostly looking for predatory types and things. Also I look for new security enhancements like cameras or locks that I pre-planed to defeat or bypass. Amazing how much a city can change if your just look.

Also, the standard urban uniform is dickie work clothes and a big key wad (Bump Keys) and a smaller non-tactical looking bag. I got a great "string" backpack from a lawyer at a bike show, holds some essentials, but looks the part. Just look like you belong, don't eye "F" everyone and every thing. Avoid cops, avoid the homeless, keep to yourself. Find back ways into places that you don't normally see everyday.

Also I bought some small driveway alert systems that work on rf, They have a good 400' range. I deploy them as early warning devices to keep from having someone walk up on me. Norther Tools had a set for $19.00 they work great, small and will fit inside a Naglene Bottle.

It's easy to say just head out of town, but try it some time, start small hikes, notes lot's of pictures. Do your recon, what can help you, where can you go, where can I get out of the elements. Once you change your whole thought process, it will become easier. I'm new to ZS what I have learned in the past year of reading and watching... Lot's of folks and the gear they have. Ok take a Water bottle, couple of 30 gallon trash bags, 50 feet of 550 cord and a multi tool. All the high-speed gear is cool and sexy, but just damn. I can be issued all the fancy weapons, NOD's and tactical kit available, but bottom line all that stuff just enhances the effectiveness of the operator, you, you are the most important element, everything else just makes the job / task easier. Just my 2 cents worth!
That driveway alert idea is pure gold, right there.

Without opening yourself up to missing caches, can you suggest things to look for, when making these caches? What do you find works best for storing in an urban area- for instance, most people are familiar with the idea of a "bear bag", containing your food, and hanging in a tree 100 yards from where you sleep- what would the urban version of that be, in your mind? I'd be more worried about squirrels and rats/mice in town, as bears are rarely seen there.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by EODguy » Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:06 am

Knight,

I love PVC pipe, I can hide stuff in it cheap, bury it or paint it. I never leave stuff in there that I worry about getting lost. Food articles, trash bags, maybe hand sanitizer, food condiments, socks and underwear. After being in the military, a lot can be said for a couple of wet-ones, and a change of socks and underwear. I also put in blank puzzle's like crossword, find a word, and Sudoku. Some batteries, small lithium and AA / AAA Nothing too big, but might help me out in a crunch. I also mark the tube with a Geocaching sticker http://www.cache-advance.com/proddetail ... MedSticker" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; so if it is found by local authority authorities, in most cases they leave it alone and it offers a good cover story incase it is compromised.

In Atlanta, I have 6 ammo cans placed, each have some more items, suitable for longer bugging. Water purifiers, small sleeping bags http://www.countycomm.com/sleeping.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; small am-fm radios http://www.countycomm.com/smallradio.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; or my favorite am/FM/Shortwave with clock alarm and flashlight for $28.00 http://www.countycomm.com/gp4light.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; small pocket LED's for $1.20 http://www.countycomm.com/orngled.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (I don't work for the company, they just have good stuff) of course I have some other items in there but we shall just say it's well stocked. Seed packets as well! Everything is inside the ammo can in a watertight trash bag, in a cheap string backpack, so I can grab and go. I check each site monthly for security and entry.

I just looked the Driveway alarms are now $11.00 http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsea ... eway+alarm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Updated: I have also started adding Ciprofloxacin (Cipro) and Potassium Iodide (KI) tablets in case I have to bug in a dirty area. Cheap and could be hard to get, also I have Theraflu and a bunch of Imodium A-D. Getting sick or the runs, can kill your survival plan and make you dependent on others, something I think we can all agree on.

I hope this helps, I try and give the sources, save some $$$ buy more ammo

I invite your comments and suggestions
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:42 am

I hear you on the PVC- as a plumber, I'm very familiar with it's uses, and I've made bury tubes for friends in the past out of 6 inch, which is big enough to fit a full sized rifle, if you wanted. The geocaching stickers- that is a stroke of brilliance, I doubt I would have thought of that myself. You probably already do, but geocachers use ammo cans a lot, you could put the stickers on those, too.

A word of advice on the PVC glue joints- always use primer on the fitting and pipe before gluing- your joint will be ten times as strong as one done without the primer. Teflon tape on the threaded portions, too, will help keep them sealed, and assist in getting it open again, once sealed. It can often be re-used, too.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by EODguy » Sun Jun 12, 2011 11:15 am

KnightoftheRoc wrote:I hear you on the PVC- as a plumber, I'm very familiar with it's uses, and I've made bury tubes for friends in the past out of 6 inch, which is big enough to fit a full sized rifle, if you wanted. The geocaching stickers- that is a stroke of brilliance, I doubt I would have thought of that myself. You probably already do, but geocachers use ammo cans a lot, you could put the stickers on those, too.

A word of advice on the PVC glue joints- always use primer on the fitting and pipe before gluing- your joint will be ten times as strong as one done without the primer. Teflon tape on the threaded portions, too, will help keep them sealed, and assist in getting it open again, once sealed. It can often be re-used, too.

Knight,

All my hides are marked like geocaching hides. I always use the purple stuff first :-) then the glue. I have one I made then poured concrete over it and formed it like a a small concrete parking lot marker. Looks broken at a glance, most folks would never give it a second thought. Got the idea in Iraq. if it's good enough for IED's, good enough for urban hides. Weighs a ton, but no one will mess with it. Pictures to follow. I will go check on my hides in about 10 days, I have a trip first next week.

Hey on one of my boxes, it was open, I watched it for surveillance, then approached. Someone left a note, signed a small piece of paper to tell me the log was gone for my geocasching hide. Rescued, and moved to a more safer place. I checked and sure enough, a listed geo hide was with in 25 meters of my hide. Go figure...

Thanks for the G-2 Knight!
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by urban-survivalist » Mon Jun 13, 2011 8:51 am

The geocaching idea really is pure brilliance. So common and so unquestioned these days. Thanks for the idea. After reading about cache you found open, I did some investigating of my own and found out there were 49 geocaches within a one mile radius of my house. Definitely seems like a good item on the checklist for locating good cache spots--check resources for other nearby geocaches. Not to say that somebody can't come along after you and place one after yours is cached, but that could be part of the monthly check up. To get started locating existing caches, visit http://www.geocaching.com/seek/default.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (after typing in the location, you can see them on a map for closer detail). There are also tons of geocache apps for smartphone users.
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:36 am

Inspired by this thread, I've started making arrangements for my own urban bug-out. I'm arranging time off for a vacation (before I snap and end up on Cops), and I've got two friends with creative writing skills helping me out. Once I tell them my vacation schedule, they will randomly text me with a crisis- the only aspect of this they'll be working together on. The only limit I placed on the premise, is that it not be something that would wipe out the house and me with it, right off the bat. Dying right away, even in theory, would sort of defeat the purpose, no?

They will then, independently, send me text messages with random events supposedly taking place. For instance, a text I receive may say something like "Huge accident at intersection of Main St. and Broadway, fires, casualties". I'd take this to mean the intersection is impassable, either due to the 'fires', or EMS, and alter my course to compensate. Of course, if the text comes in after I've gotten past that intersection, I need take no action regarding it. And, being fictional, I couldn't stop to help the casualties, or I'd be looking at that possibility, if it were real.

As I receive each text, I'll log the time and location, and the content of the text, then log what action I'm taking. If I need to change plans, I'll add that, too. This will help me figure out where the fail points might be, and keep me from forgetting what happened along the way, and when. It also keeps it honest, as the texts are stored on the phone, and sometimes text messages are delayed in receipt (ever see the flashmob commercial? lol).

When I explained my idea to them, one said "It's your vacation- wouldn't you rather relax?" To which, I replied that IS how I relax- I get out and DO stuff. In this case, I get to go out, alone, for two days and a night, test some of my gear, practice with the rest, and basically go solo camping, which I haven't done in years. The mock bug-out lends a sense of fun to it, by virtue of the challenges. It will keep me moving at a good pace, because of the "urgency" of it, but not so rushed as to attract attention, so there's some 'grey man' practice involved as well. It will also give me a chance to see up close what problems could arise in a real bug-out, like a bridge I'd planned on crossing being missing, or something like that. I'll have at least two water crossings to make, and staying dry would be nice.

Goals will include:
*Taking only my EDC and BOB, and whatever I'm wearing at the time. Making do with what I have, not what I wish I had. Hat, coat, BOB, and hit the door, kissing my girl as I leave.
* Getting out of the city intact, while "avoiding Imperial entanglements".
* Survive the entire time on rations- they pack the calories, but do NOT fill a belly. This will be uncomfortable, and needs to be addressed, to see how I handle it.
* Find and purify at least 2 quarts of water along the way. I have some of the tools I want, enough to get the job done, but they remain untested. This will be a short enough trip that if I do have intestinal issues, it can be dealt with pretty much at home. While swearing at the FAIL that caused it.
* Attempt to use as LITTLE of my bug-out gear as possible. Unused items, except for medical items, can then be considered for dropping from the lineup.
* Navigate out of the city, and to my friend's place (one of my text-ers), charting my planned course, and actual course, reflecting changes made.
* Make a fire, cook a meal, and repair whatever needs repair. Rig for an overnight outdoors.
* Hoof it back into town, considering all mini-disasters to still be in effect, and deal with whatever new ones come up on the way in.

My destination is usually an 8 mile or so trip by car. With detours, I'm figuring on about a 10 mile hike each way, mostly along the side of paved roads. Some overland is possible, but not preferable, and can be used if need be. Ten miles in a day over trails in the woods is a good day's progress, so this should not be too demanding, but not a wimp trip, either.
I ran the idea past my g/f, and she was of mixed reactions. She sees the wisdom in it, but wishes she was going along with me. She also realizes that her knee and ankle have issues, and she's not up to a hike of this type yet (we're working on it). Having someone at home as a "base camp" to clear communications through will also help, and someone needs to have a copy of my proposed route, just in case I break a leg or something. She also sees the need for me to get out alone for a while, to decompress. In trade, she is getting a girl's night out, my treat, to keep it fair. Since neither of us has trust issues with the other, we can each have some time out and about, enjoy ourselves, and not have to argue about what we were doing, etc. afterward. Since we can't afford to go anywhere this year, this is an affordable alternative for a vacation. Plus, I'll be home with her for 7 out of the 9 days I'll have off.

I'll write up a report of how I made out when I get back, and post it for review. And, thanks to everyone for the ideas they've sparked in me, either directly, or indirectly.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by urban-survivalist » Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:24 pm

* Getting out of the city intact, while "avoiding Imperial entanglements".
Obi Wan was definitely a survivalist.

I think the "Murphy's" aspect is pure genius. Seems like there's hardly a better way to test "on your feet" thinking, and also have a couple people who know what you're up to. In fact, of all the survival TV shows that are out there, it seems like Murphy's would be better than them all. Especially if viewers could be the ones sending in texts to stage new developments.

Interested to check out your review and ahas.
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:56 am

Thanks.
Both of my "writers" will, of course, be given my proposed route beforehand- it won't be much good for them to be texting me "Downtown is gridlocked" if I'm uptown, and headed away from downtown. Other than the purely informative aspect, it's pretty much a case of "yeah, so?". Both have experience writing pretty good RPG games, so I expect them to both be rather inventive, but still within the realms of the possible.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by rsnurkle » Thu Jun 16, 2011 11:09 pm

KnightoftheRoc, sounds like an excellent trip, I really like the random events generator(s) :D you've worked in (and in the hands of your writer/dungeonmaster friends, the whole thing should be pretty interesting).

Ever since the winter mock bugout I've been trying to come up with what a decent mock bugout exercises would be for me, starting from an urban area and involving a (legal) overnight, instead of just planning a basic backpacking trip. I like your plan to start from your house and head to a friends at an appropriate distance and overnight in their backyard. I've been considering a roundtrip of about 10 miles starting and ending at my house, over-nighting in my backyard, and then hiking another route through the city the next day--although that still might not get me out of explaining why I'm not sleeping in my own bed to my mother, which probably won't go over well.

One thing I think I would add to an urban mock bugout would be an out-of-context exercise I've dubbed the Urban Escape Action Sequence (for extra cool points). Any zombie/disaster/action flick has a high chance of characters crawling through air ducts, climbing out of windows and down the sides of buildings, or otherwise moving through urban environment in an unusual but very motivated and time-sensitive way. Obviously I don't have air ducts to crawl through for real, and bouldering buildings is an unnecessary danger for an exercise, but I do believe that any BOB I build, should be given a mobility-retained/gear-snagging-or-falling-out test at the local park, or on the stairs in my house, or chasing that cat out of my grandma's crawlspace. And that way, I get to test the element of going "off-road" but in an urban environment, and in a legal and relatively safe manner. Of course, such a test should probably also involve doing a lot of stairs at high speeds, but I'll save that for later, right after I get another donut...

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Fri Jun 17, 2011 1:52 am

This comes to the YMMV aspect- where you are doing an overnight in your own yard, nice and legal, I'm doing it OUT of town- but a large part of the differences between the two could be as simple as the size of the towns involved. What I'm planning on doing, I could never accomplish if I lived in Manhattan. In a city of 25,000, however, it becomes a much more attainable goal.

If my city were accessible from ALL sides, this would be a pretty good exercise in seeing how long it would take to bug out of it on foot, as I'm smack dab in the middle of it right now. However, the city is bordered by a large creek to the south, and a major river to the east, leaving north and west as the most viable directions. North gets complicated- the next township borders ours with so little change between them, it is literally a matter of crossing a street to find you have changed towns. It's also mostly a retail oriented town, where the main road is just one mall after another, similar to Rt 17 in northern NJ, for anyone who's ever driven "The Gauntlet" there. Speed limits are posted at 30MPH, and no one is doing less than 50...four lanes wide in each direction. It's not for the faint of heart, or new drivers. To the west, there are still highways, but less stores, and the main highway heads into the mountains, with room to walk the shoulder without being hit. I'll be using part of that, most likely. My route will take me west, and then north, curving around our local version of "The Gauntlet", letting me avoid the traffic, intersections, and the recipe for disaster those create in a real disaster. Once north of the city, I can stick to secondary roads, cross country for some of it, or follow a watercourse, to avoid detection and problems. I'm going to be trying to Grey Man my way out of town- between my appearance, and whatever "crises" are sent to me, we'll see how I make out.

Once out of town, I'll have two water crossings to make, minimum. Any bridge could be "gone" at any time, so I can't be lazy about getting to them, and across, or I'm liable to have a text message telling me it just went bye-bye. The second crossing can be waded, but the first means a dip, and I'm not sure how early-morning it might end up being. It's not the water temp or the swimming I'm concerned with- it's with how cool it might be AFTER I get soaking wet. My friends are a bunch of evil, spiteful pricks that way. :lol:

I have a digital camera that does stills, video, and also records audio only. I'll be taking that, and spare batteries, with me, to 'record' my bugout, and to read the texts out loud into, so I'll have my record of the trip, and still be able to keep moving. My original plan was to write the stuff down in a notebook, but that means stopping, and stopping means becoming noticed. Plus, where I live, seeing someone with a pack on, walking along a highway mumbling to themselves, well- it's not really that uncommon a sight... :roll: I'll fit right in.

Another issue with the water crossing at the edge of town, which may interest some, is the group of homeless people living under that particular bridge. If I have to swim for it, I may well have to come into contact with them- I'm formulating alternative crossing points to avoid that. I'm not taking much with me, but it would be like gold to them, who have even less. There are two bridges crossing that particular water course, both at the edge of town (the creek makes up the border), and both have a population of homeless people living under them, so A or B, my decisions will likely be interchangeable between the two. Get across, avoid detection. To make the after-action report interesting, I may try to do this close enough to take a pic or 2, and still avoid being seen.

Most of this is going to be roadside hiking, really, and other than the text message 'disasters', probably not that interesting. Roadside may not seem all that grey man at first, but keep in mind that this is an area where there are a good number of hikers and hitchhikers, so even with the pack on, I won't really be that out of place in appearance. Where I may be forced to hoof it overland, I am hoping I'm not going to end up inadvertently trespassing- no matter where, someone owns the property, but some are more lenient about it than others. I always try to be respectful about it, and cross as little as possible of someone's land, and never do any damage to it- this means skirt the sides, in most cases, as there are a lot of crop fields around, and no cutting firewood, etc.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by urban-survivalist » Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:33 pm

Plus, where I live, seeing someone with a pack on, walking along a highway mumbling to themselves, well- it's not really that uncommon a sight... :roll: I'll fit right in
There's a certain degree of "being a weirdo with a straight face" that lends itself to urban survival. It's amazing what you can get away with if you have a totally straight face--farting loudly in big groups, walking past restricted signs with bunches of people around, and like you said, mumbling to yourself.

It's akin to the scary dog concept. If he sees you feeling unsure, than he knows something's up. But if you're acting like everything's cool breeze, he goes about his business.

There can be a lot of this during a simulation. Where you decide to pull out your meal and start eating, crash for the night, etc. For me, the best was when I was at the ritzy tennis club, with socks and shoes off airing out my feet and talking to the camera. 75 year-old leathery looking yuppies with tennis bracelets walking past and not really sure what to make of the new intrusion to their otherwise perfectly groomed world. Priceless.

Good luck with the streams.

@rsnurkle--cool idea about the UEAS...even if 70% for fun and 30 practicality...the Jason Bourne test. Jump a fence, scale a few trees, army crawl through a storm drain...who knows. Although not big enough for a serious BO scenario, one of my favorite packs for this type of crap is the USMC ILBE Recon Assault Pack. Awesome back contours and load distribution. Sits high enough off your butt to be out of the way on a run, good compressability, and cinches on the top of the straps to keep the pack from creeping away from your body...
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Wed Jul 06, 2011 2:40 pm

OK, I took my vacation to include the July 4th weekend, and the following week. I set this up with a friend, who was to create and 'run' a disaster for me to bug out from, through, and to basically keep me guessing. Rather than derail this thread, I started one of it's own, at http://zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopi ... 32&t=81281" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Please feel free to read it all, and make observations. It didn't all pan out as hoped for, but this is why we prep, right?
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by Vodage » Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:39 am

dukman wrote:I think the only thing you can really do is leave the B&E stuff at home, along with the non-legal length knives, and spend a day or two with the bums down the alley to learn what it is like to live in a cardboard house eating out of the dumpster :?
QFT
Dumpster diving needs its own thread. It is for sure an urban skill. I know non-bum people who do it.

Edit: Truth be told, you're unlikely to find a way to do a legal mock urban bugout, unless you live in a city that contains campgrounds for which you can get a permit.
For example, The Presidio District in San Francisco is an area where you can legally camp. http://baghdadbythebaysf.com/2011/02/ho ... francisco/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Sleeping in an alleyway with bums is quasi-legal, depending on what kind of shelter you're in. "camping" is only in the park code, "lodging" is in the city code.
Lodging requires that you have constructed a shelter, and (unbeknownst to most) requires that you refuse to take down the shelter when asked.
Sleeping in the doorway of a business is only considered tresspassing if there are "no tresspassing" signs posted. No sign, no foul.
Sleeping on the sidewalk was technically legal in San Francisco until recently. Check your local "sit/lie" laws to be sure.
Sleeping in parks during the day is legal. However, if you are in a sleeping bag or even under a blanket, you can be cited for camping. Again this is all San Francisco code.
I imagine it's similar in other places, though.
Squatting isn't the best option, either.
From Wikipedia:
Squatter's rights

Most cases of adverse possession deal with boundary line disputes between two parties who hold clear title to their property. The term "squatter's rights" has no actual legal meaning, but is generally used to refer to a specific form of adverse possession where the disseisor holds no title to any properties adjoining the property under dispute. In most jurisdictions of the United States, few squatters can meet the legal requirements for adverse possession.

If the squatter abandons the property for a period, or if the rightful owner effectively removes the squatter's access even temporarily during the statutory period, or gives his permission, the "clock" usually stops.[citation needed] For example, if the required period in a given jurisdiction is twenty years and the squatter is removed after only 15 years, the squatter loses the benefit of that 15-year possession (i.e., the clock is reset at zero). If that squatter later retakes possession of the property, that squatter must, to acquire title, remain on the property for a full 20 years after the date on which the squatter retook possession. In this example, the squatter would have held the property for a total of 35 years (the original 15 years plus the later 20 years) to acquire title.

Depending on the jurisdiction, one squatter may or may not pass along continuous possession to another squatter, known as "tacking", until the adverse possession period is complete. Tacking is valid only if the conveyance of the property from one adverse possesser to another is founded upon a written document (usually an erroneous deed), indicating "color of title." This concept is known as privity, a requirement for tacking under some statutes. If tacking requires privity in the jurisdiction, a squatter claiming adverse possession without a foundation on a written document (claim of right) may not tack previous periods of adverse possession onto his own for purposes of running out the statutory period.[15] A lawful owner may also restart the clock at zero by giving temporary permission for the occupation of the property, thus defeating the necessary "continuous and hostile" element.[citation needed] Evidence that a squatter paid rent to the owner would defeat adverse possession for that period.
Check your camping and sit/lie laws first. In general, the rule in cities is always "It's illegal to sleep."
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Mon Jul 18, 2011 2:31 pm

Dumpster diving can yield awesome finds. Sadly, in my area, it's illegal. But, curb picking is legal, so I'm always keeping an eye open and on the sides of the street when driving or walking- you just never know what treasure might be waiting. I've furnished entire apartments from curb picking- wasn't any kind of showplace, but it covered the essentials until new could be afforded.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by harold » Tue Jul 19, 2011 5:44 pm

i currently doing mock bugouts....i have to cheat or i will end up either in jail or hassled. so i dress like a jogger or bike rider and load a backpack down with water snacks and other innocent stuff to make up the weight(no burglur tools). i then have to walk from point a to point b either in the daytime or up to 11pm at night......walking with a huge backpack at 2am is going to get you stopped. i know it is cheating but i am building my stamina and learning the layout ON FOOT of my bugout route. i also can only do 2-4hrs at a time and i get picked up in a car and i cant sleep out at night but there are some things that will just get you arrested/hassled trying to do a realistic bugout right now.

i do not drink found water but i do make a point of noting water sources on my maps. in a real emergency i would have my filters and would have to drink the water but for now just locating water is good enough.

the main thing i have learned is that the world looks different on foot. you miss a lot driving in a car.

* forgot to mention...no one hassles me when i dress as a jogger with a big pack 'for water'...that is normal. when i went out in my tactical boots and long pants and was covered in sweat (its 110deg here) everyone stares at you .....so make it look like you are exercising. my actual bugout clothes will almost be workout clothes anyway just in subdued colors.

other stuff like fire starting i try and do in my patio with found materials i collect as i hike in my mock walks....

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:25 am

harold wrote:i currently doing mock bugouts....i have to cheat or i will end up either in jail or hassled. so i dress like a jogger or bike rider and load a backpack down with water snacks and other innocent stuff to make up the weight(no burglur tools). i then have to walk from point a to point b either in the daytime or up to 11pm at night......walking with a huge backpack at 2am is going to get you stopped. i know it is cheating but i am building my stamina and learning the layout ON FOOT of my bugout route. i also can only do 2-4hrs at a time and i get picked up in a car and i cant sleep out at night but there are some things that will just get you arrested/hassled trying to do a realistic bugout right now.

i do not drink found water but i do make a point of noting water sources on my maps. in a real emergency i would have my filters and would have to drink the water but for now just locating water is good enough.

the main thing i have learned is that the world looks different on foot. you miss a lot driving in a car.

* forgot to mention...no one hassles me when i dress as a jogger with a big pack 'for water'...that is normal. when i went out in my tactical boots and long pants and was covered in sweat (its 110deg here) everyone stares at you .....so make it look like you are exercising. my actual bugout clothes will almost be workout clothes anyway just in subdued colors.

other stuff like fire starting i try and do in my patio with found materials i collect as i hike in my mock walks....
I don't consider any of that "cheating" at all. Read my urban mock bug out after-action report, and you'll see that I left all the tactical crap at home for the same reasons. Marking sources of ANY useful items is a good idea- I made note of both water and fuel sources, I just didn't "sample" the fuels- that would have been stealing. A good part of any mock bugout is avoiding legal problems- consider them the invaders/zombies/whatever you are bugging out FROM. Even if you fail, and get stopped by the cops, if you aren't doing anything illegal (and you shouldn't be), they can't DO anything except help you learn where you messed up, and attracted their attention. Learning is good.

I'd suggest grabbing some of the found water as you go along, even if it's just a water bottle with a piece of tape to label the location, and practice purifying it- at home, if you have to. If you don't train (practice) with your equipment, you won't know what the weak points of it are until it's too late, and you NEED it. It can also act as training weight in the pack. Basically, do with the water what you're doing with your fire starting- practice.

"Cheating" would be having someone following you in a car, supplying you with AC for rest stops, cold water, snacks, etc., and a ride home if you get tired. I had to "cheat" in this manner for my MUBO, due to a knee injury. I COULD have pressed on, if I HAD to, but the fact that this was a training exercise made that point moot- I DIDN'T HAVE TO, so I used good sense instead, and got a ride home, instead of making the knee injury worse.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by harold » Fri Jul 22, 2011 3:56 pm

@ KnightoftheRoc

i have had several major failures out doing mock bugouts. one just the other day was catching tinder (on fire) using a cheap magifying glass....could not get the stuff to even smoke...! my little pocket fresnel lite it right up so, yes use and test all your equipment! it does look easy on youtube!

i will do what you suggest and collect water to run thru my systems at home....good idea. i do collect 'found' items to take back and repurpose like lead tire weights and pieces of steel i find in the street. the weird thing is that the most common item i find...is money. coins are everywhere...?

i am also trying to practice locating and identifying the local plants and trees....i have found 10 edible plants so far.....

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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by Vodage » Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:36 pm

I've been seriously considering doing one of these, but I've got a couple problems. First of all I have to get into the mindset that I'm bugging out, and not just doing a "bum for 3 days" run.

There are some pretty big differences here. If I'm really bugging out, I'm probably going to keep to myself. Being formerly homeless, this can prove a bit difficult. I can't seem to walk two blocks in this city without bumping into someone I know. Also, with San Francisco, "using what you find" is almost cheating. People leave free junk out ALL OVER THE PLACE here. In a real SHTF situation, the landscape might look very different. If restaurants are closed, that means no more leftovers placed politely ontop of trash cans. If everything is closed, that means no access to running water or restrooms. Now I'm not about to use the restroom in public (although the ticket one would get for deficating is pretty funny - it's categorized as "dumping", same as any other toxic waste^_^), but as far as realism is concerned, how far should I go?

I have a feeling that looking for food would be very different in a real bugout, so I guess I'd have to bring rations with me. I don't have a set BOL yet that I can share here, since most of the locations I know of in the city come from my past experience, which involved a lot of tresspassing. I don't know anywhere NEAR enough about plants to do any gathering, unless I see something terribly obvious like blackberry bushes, which are growing wild here in San Francisco. My real-life BOL for a disaster situation is a relative's house, as protecting the family is first priority. I guess I would need to set a BOL for all of us, then. Of course I don't expect the whole family to participate in the MBO, but it's a good idea to prepare a location that can be accessed by the less able of the group.

Now there's something to do, eh? I could spend the day searching for a proper BOL for the group. I should start the bugout, then, with the mindset that the family home has been compromised, and I now need a BOL for a 4-person group that includes an older person and a small child. This would definitely be a bit of a project, as I've just ruled out many of the more dextrous acts required to get to a safe spot.

I can't imagine doing a MBO for longer than 72 hours, mostly because I'm a gamer and would rather not be away from my precious Role-Playing-Game characters for too long.
I also really can't imagine what I would do. I'd be really tempted to just sit around with the other bums, or hang out with people in general.
People in SF are really friendly. It's the kind of city where you might walk by someone's front steps and get invited into a house party.
Unless zombies are having a brain barbecue, this sort of thing won't happen in a disaster situation.

So - there's all the chatter.

Goals
1. As little contact with other humans as possible. This is a bugout not a social event.
2. Proper rationing of food. I don't want to make it halfway through the MBO and have to go home and start rifling through my fridge.
3. Finding a group BOL. Something I should have already done, this will probably just take up most of my waking hours.

Givens
1. I'll always find a place for myself to sleep. This is literally a no-brainer for me, since I currently live in the same town I was homeless in.
2. I won't be needing rain gear. The weather here is unpredictable, but again, I know all the spots already.
3. I won't be going out of my way to get "real" water during this trip. I'm gonna cheat and use sinks and water fountains.

Things I don't have but should:
Cooking stove (guess I should learn how to make the ol' bum stove)
Real sleeping bag (sh*t happens when you're living on the street. All the good bags I've ever owned have been stolen)
Portable water purifier (For the 'real deal' no-running-water MBO)
Fancy water carrying system (camelbak, military canteen, etc.)

Things I just plain don't know how to do yet:
Purify water without a purifier. Do I just boil it? For how long?(San Francisco tap water comes from hetch hetchy - clean enough to drink straight from a bathroom sink)
Build a fire without a lighter (Long-time cigarette smoker here, never really without a lighter)
Desalinate water. Don't have access to that fancy new system MIT came up with, is there a cheaper way?
Identify edible plants. Like I said, the only thing I know about are wild Blackberries.

So my main question here is, will I learn anything if I cheat and use running water? What is the most effecient way to carry water?
If the answer is a Camelbak (which I'm not about to go buy right now), what's the 2nd most efficient way?


Still think the main obstacle here will be the social one. Especially with the ladies.
I'm single and in my twenties here, so if a woman invites me over, the MBO is postponed while I do some quality bugging-in. Ooooo Yeeeah.
Not that I expect random women to walk up to me and strike up a conversation. People in SF aren't THAT friendly. (oh, if only)

Maybe I need a helper or something. Find someone who can post a daily scenario for me. Currently don't own a cell-phone (my phone stays in my home; I'm old skool), but the public library has internet access, so any old ZS member could post a scenario in a thread. Since there are multiple library branches with internet access, there'd still be the ability to cut me off from entire areas. I really like the Murphy's idea.
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Re: Safe & Legal Mock Urban Bugout?

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:52 am

OK, in no particular order of having been asked-
I got myself a 5 liter USGI canteen that ran me about 15 bucks- so far, I'm liking it. The loops and ties would allow for rigging onto a LOT of arrangements, pack or otherwise. If you have/use an ALICE frame, it fits right into it. If you do not yet have a decent purification system, like me (still working on it), try seeking dependable sources, and marking them on a map, and then actually gather your potable water from fountains, etc. It's a step in the right direction, at least.

Rain gear- I'd get at least a poncho, just in case you don't make it to "one of your spots", or it's full, underwater, covered in debris, on fire, etc. Actually, I'd suggest TWO ponchos, so you can have a shelter from one, and wear the other- they also make GREAT rainwater catchers, and the hood gives you a collection point, like a funnel. For the space/weight/cost, there's really no reason not to own at least one.

72 hrs worth of food- I cannot recommend Mainstay rations enough for this. Daytrex is also good, but a bit tougher to pack, due to shape. Mainstays for 3 days would weigh about 2 pounds, tops, and take up the space of a small stack of paperback books.

I like the idea of seeking the BOL for the family- it's not just a good idea for a MBO goal, it's just a good idea, period. Knowing the physical limitations of the family members should keep you working at it, as you find and critique locations. You'll want this location to remain a secret, so there's your motivation to avoid people- no chit chat about what you're doing that way.
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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