Chapter Status

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Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:07 am

Given that the worlds about to end...again :roll: I thought it might be an idea to just put this out there to see what the reaction was on restarting the chapter.

Here are the main requirements for ZS Chapters status:
*Members: Three active Zombie Squad members to act as the responsible coordinators or officers of the chapters. These will be the people responsible for the relevant paperwork, and who we at ZS-HQ will look upon as the official leaders of the chapter.

*Events: At least 2 charity events hosted a year (blood drive, food drive, clothing drive, local charity fund raiser, highway clean up, etc).

*Regular meetings: Meetings at least every other month for the officers/members to plan events. Meetings (in person) at least once a quarter open to the public for recruiting and publicizing.

*Paperwork: We'll have an application for chapter status, a chapter agreement, an application for charity events, and the reports you'll file after each event and chapter meeting.
One by one:
Members
3 people are needed (President, Vice-President and Treasurer) who all hold valid ZS Memberships.

Events
2 events per year is pretty easy to do when you think about it; Race4Life, Movember, giving some clothes to the local charity shop, and even just using something like TextGiving are all easily do-able, the UK is one of the biggest charitable givers in the world after-all. The most sustainable way of organising them is to have one digital campaign (i.e. online fundraiser) in the winter like the ZS Disaster Relief Drive for Hurricane Sandy and a more tangible event (i.e. where people physically participate in some way) in the summer like the ZS:UK Pen Y Fan Hike for the NSPCC.

Regular Meetings
BY FAR the hardest to pull off, but also some of the most fun, in the days of the UK Chapter the members were so widely geographically separated that it was so logistically challenging to get everyone together we usually coupled them with events. A better way of doing them would be to have a chapter meeting online (over something like Skype) and arrange either 3 meetings in different areas with an office at each; or one meeting with the officers that changes city each time, both try to ensure that the most people can attend (IIRC an office needs to be present at an event to make it chapter official).

Paperwork
This consists of 3 cheets of A4 when the chapter is setup and the occasional event report, I've not enquired for a while how the use of the trademark/etc is handled but back in '09 it was via a paper request made to HQ.

The thing I'd probably recommend adding to this breakdown is a calendar, given that the UK members are so geographically dispersed its difficult to get them all in one place, events tend to crop up a month or so in advance on an ad hoc basis but it'd be helpful if folks could see when events were likely to be held in advance of that to be able to work it in around their other commitments.

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by ForgeCorvus » Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:30 pm

Sounds good....Just need to herd some cats now :wink:

If it helps, I've just gone 'Green'

I'd love to meet up, dependent on cash and time (both of which I'm short of)
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:17 pm

Epic, likewise.

I thought something like this would help provide some structure & give some adv notice for those that need it?

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Chapter Status

Post by wee drop o' bush » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:21 pm

Sounds great, obviously I live in Northern Ireland so an official role would be problematic but I would like to help out unofficially as much as I can.
Just bear in mind that I'll be out in the lambing shed from next week till the end of April :gonk:
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:32 pm

wee drop o' bush wrote:Sounds great, obviously I live in Northern Ireland so an official role would be problematic but I would like to help out unofficially as much as I can.
Just bear in mind that I'll be out in the lambing shed from next week till the end of April :gonk:
I gets a bit squirrelly :crazy:
An official role wouldn't be out of the question, there would be no obligation for you to personally attend anything, the rules only stipulate that an officer has to be present (not all officers). It's great that you want to get involved though! Could certainly use the help!

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by mystic_1 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:35 pm

Aeon wrote:in the days of the UK Chapter the members were so widely geographically separated that it was so logistically challenging

...

the UK members are so geographically dispersed
You mentioned it twice in your post, and this is the real underlying problem. It's not just an issue in Europe, ZS chapters are no longer considered to be statewide (i.e. ZSC017 - Florida) because that was too far for people to get together regular, and as a result many of these state-wide chapters went inactive (i.e. ZSC017 - Florida).


My interpretation of the ZS Chapter system is that chapters are intended to be local, real-world groups of ZS members who perform work in meatspace.

ZS already has a strong online presence and conducts regular online fundraisers. (shameless plug: if you haven't already contributed to the Hurricane Sandy charity drive, please do so! http://zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopi ... 2&t=101851" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )

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Chapter Status

Post by wee drop o' bush » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:44 pm

I am very heartened by the fact that there are more and more UK members active now & they're a great bunch of people too :D
Ideally groups covering smaller areas will start in the future, but I'm just glad that the ZS:X sub forum has been more active of late.
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:50 pm

mystic_1 wrote: You mentioned it twice in your post, and this is the real underlying problem. It's not just an issue in Europe, ZS chapters are no longer considered to be statewide (i.e. ZSC017 - Florida) because that was too far for people to get together regular, and as a result many of these state-wide chapters went inactive (i.e. ZSC017 - Florida).
...
(shameless plug: if you haven't already contributed to the Hurricane Sandy charity drive, please do so! http://zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopi ... 2&t=101851" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )
Agreed, the distance was always an issue, we partly combated that by moving the location of the events and meetings around the country. We had some enthusiastic members when the chapter was active who didn't mind travelling half the country for a good event, part of the issues that lead to it going inactive were that events would change date according to the schedules of interested members which made it difficult to get the time away from other commitments. In my proposal above I've tried to account for it by shifting some of the face-time onto online meetings/charity events and by putting together a calendar so folks can be more certain about when things are likely to take place and therefore plan accordingly.

I take your point, a lot of chapters struggle to stay active because of the ephemeral nature of their member base and willingness to commit to travelling any considerable distance long-term. I think if we can drum up the numbers there's no reason given the scheduling jiggery-pokery in the proposed events calendar we can't make a sustainable plan and keep the requirement to travel to a minimum.

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:51 pm

Oh, on your point about Sandy...donated earlier today :D

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by ForgeCorvus » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:57 pm

Charities...Any thoughts or shall I start another thread about such ?
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:58 pm

ForgeCorvus wrote:Charities...Any thoughts or shall I start another thread about such ?
Few ideas, new thread?

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by mystic_1 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:32 pm

Aeon wrote:In my proposal above I've tried to account for it by shifting some of the face-time onto online meetings/charity events and by putting together a calendar
I touched on this in my other post, but I don't think that online meetings and online charity events will qualify towards chapter status.


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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:16 pm

mystic_1 wrote:I touched on this in my other post, but I don't think that online meetings and online charity events will qualify towards chapter status.
mystic_1
The formation of the first chapter was launched off the back of an online fundraiser, the discussion at the time was that the requirement only stipulated that a charity event be held prior to the application. MY proposal was purely to move those aspects of chapter business which can be conducted online to be done so, for the reasons described previously. I have, however requested up-to-date steer from HQ to clarify the situation.

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Chapter Status

Post by wee drop o' bush » Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:19 pm

Good job Aeon :clap:
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by mystic_1 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:31 pm

Aeon wrote:
mystic_1 wrote:I touched on this in my other post, but I don't think that online meetings and online charity events will qualify towards chapter status.
mystic_1
The formation of the first chapter was launched off the back of an online fundraiser, the discussion at the time was that the requirement only stipulated that a charity event be held prior to the application. MY proposal was purely to move those aspects of chapter business which can be conducted online to be done so, for the reasons described previously. I have, however requested up-to-date steer from HQ to clarify the situation.
I know you did, because I'm on the team that responds to such emails, evaluates event requests, and reviews chapter applications.

As I said earlier, ZS chapters are local entities by definition. Chapters are considered to cover a two-hour radius around their location. ZS no longer approves state-wide (or nation-wide, or international) chapters.

In addition, participation in online charity drives is not considered acceptable for chapter qualification events.

What you're proposing is a completely virtual chapter that has no real-world existence. The closest thing that ZS has to this is the ZS Amateur Radio Club, which is not a chapter.

I'll make sure you get the full package that we send out to people inquiring about starting up a chapter, since the relaunch procedure for existing chapters is the same.

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:49 pm

mystic_1 wrote: In addition, participation in online charity drives is not considered acceptable for chapter qualification events.

What you're proposing is a completely virtual chapter that has no real-world existence. The closest thing that ZS has to this is the ZS Amateur Radio Club, which is not chapter.
As I've said we'll be following the same model as we did during the chapters initial formation (I should know I organised it back in 2008/2009), which during discussion with the board we agreed was acceptable. Ive just read your response to my email, thanks for providing that information. Ill escalate the discussion to the board after speaking with the other UKers if further clarification is required.

As previously stated (twice) my proposal (which is all it is as this juncture) is not to completely virtualise the chapter but simply to hold some of the chapter meetings online, with the occasional online based fundraiser (discussed above), i am not, and would not suggest any setup that depicted a chapter with no real world presence (what would be the point?).

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by mystic_1 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:06 pm

Aeon wrote:
mystic_1 wrote: In addition, participation in online charity drives is not considered acceptable for chapter qualification events.

What you're proposing is a completely virtual chapter that has no real-world existence. The closest thing that ZS has to this is the ZS Amateur Radio Club, which is not chapter.
As I've said we'll be following the same model as we did during the chapters initial formation (I should know I organised it back in 2008/2009), which during discussion with the board we agreed was acceptable. Ive just read your response to my email, thanks for providing that information. Ill escalate the discussion to the board after speaking with the other UKers if further clarification is required.

As previously stated (twice) my proposal (which is all it is as this juncture) is not to completely virtualise the chapter but simply to hold some of the chapter meetings online, with the occasional online based fundraiser (discussed above), i am not, and would not suggest any setup that depicted a chapter with no real world presence (what would be the point?).

The chapter requirements are constantly being re-evaluated, the requirements today are different than they were in 2008/2009. I have already cued in the appropriate board member, we are in touch regularly and many of the things I have said here come from those discussions.

feel free to elail chapters@zombiehunters.org with any further questions.

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by K9medic » Sat Dec 08, 2012 6:57 am

Looking at this logically, what advantage do we gain from having an “active” chapter? As I see it we can still donate to a charity, organise mock bug outs and chat post on line as we are now.

I don’t mean this as way to circumnavigate the rules, however I don’t believe we have enough members to set up more than one chapter in the UK, and trying to organise UK wide meetings were a majority of us can get to is just about impossible.

Personally, living in the Borders, I did find it difficult to travel to South Wales for the M.B.O. And I just don’t see how I could justify travelling to a central location for meetings. I have just attended a Medical CPD day in Birmingham, not counting the cost of entry to event, just with mileage, over night accommodation and lost earnings it cost me close to £250.
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:14 am

mystic_1 wrote:
The chapter requirements are constantly being re-evaluated, the requirements today are different than they were in 2008/2009. I have already cued in the appropriate board member, we are in touch regularly and many of the things I have said here come from those discussions.

feel free to elail chapters@zombiehunters.org with any further questions.

mystic_1
I'm not sure you understand the proposal; the only departure from the requirements listed both in your email and in the chapters forum is that some of our bi-monthly meetings be conducted online, the only person suggesting anything like a 'virtual chapter' is you and its a pretty misleading straw-man argument to make as I already know for a fact that a couple of well established state wide chapters using online meetings to suppliment their real world meetings & events.

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:22 am

K9medic wrote:Looking at this logically, what advantage do we gain from having an “active” chapter? As I see it we can still donate to a charity, organise mock bug outs and chat post on line as we are now.

I don’t mean this as way to circumnavigate the rules, however I don’t believe we have enough members to set up more than one chapter in the UK, and trying to organise UK wide meetings were a majority of us can get to is just about impossible.

Personally, living in the Borders, I did find it difficult to travel to South Wales for the M.B.O. And I just don’t see how I could justify travelling to a central location for meetings. I have just attended a Medical CPD day in Birmingham, not counting the cost of entry to event, just with mileage, over night accommodation and lost earnings it cost me close to £250.
Last time the chapter was active we had members coming to meetings, etc who wouldn't have had it been an informal meetup. Something about the formality of being an extension of ZS must have given it more credibility.

Having said that, if HQ (& its Chapter Volunteers) are going to be intransigent and make it overly difficult for the sake of beaucracy then theres nothing to stop us from organising events, meets independantly.

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by K9medic » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:33 am

How many of the people posting these days live Live within reasonable travelling distance of a national meeting point? Plus these days the price of fuel is a lot more than it was in 2009.

How long were we an “active” chapter? Not trying to pour cold water on the idea of becoming active again, but last time it closed down almost overnight. Yes I know some of the reasons, however there was no chance for members to try and rescue the chapter, it just closed down.

Most of the active members from those days have moved on to other forums, that are having regular RV’s both at national and local areas. How many active members do we have these days?
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by Aeon » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:43 am

K9medic wrote:How many of the people posting these days live Live within reasonable travelling distance of a national meeting point? Plus these days the price of fuel is a lot more than it was in 2009.

How long were we an “active” chapter? Not trying to pour cold water on the idea of becoming active again, but last time it closed down almost overnight. Yes I know some of the reasons, however there was no chance for members to try and rescue the chapter, it just closed down.

Most of the active members from those days have moved on to other forums, that are having regular RV’s both at national and local areas. How many active members do we have these days?
Why not? Seems to be the season for parade raining.

The whole point of conducting some of the chapters business (that we could) online, was to reduce the burden on people to make those kinds of journeys. Additionally the proposal was to have a regular face-to-face meeting that moved around the country so everyone would have a chance to attend, its not mandatory for everyone to turn up to every meeting though.

The board shut the chapter down last time off the back of a collection of issues not least we lost 2 officers and therefore couldn't carry on under the rules stipulated in the chapter charter, if you want to know why the remaining members weren't given a chance to internally elect more officers that'd be a question for the board. There was a subsequent attempt by some of the guys to restart things but i think they struggled to fulfil the charters obligations.

Its true the chapter forum isn't as busy as it once was but before we had the chapter forum we were spread out over the forums, no telling really how many UK'ers are present on ZS who've taken one look at the Inactivity of the chapter and just gone elsewhere on the forum (or off it).

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Re: Chapter Status

Post by sheddi » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:53 am

K9medic wrote:Looking at this logically, what advantage do we gain from having an “active” chapter? As I see it we can still donate to a charity, organise mock bug outs and chat post on line as we are now.

I don’t mean this as way to circumnavigate the rules, however I don’t believe we have enough members to set up more than one chapter in the UK, and trying to organise UK wide meetings were a majority of us can get to is just about impossible.
^ Yeah, this.

However, let's imagine that the penetration of ZS membership into the UK population is a uniform 1 in a million[1]. This would give roughly 63 members in the UK .

Looking at the regions of England, there would be:
9 members in the South East.
8 members in Greater London.
7 members in the North West.
6 members in the West Midlands.
6 members in the East.
5 members in the South West.
5 members in Yorkshire and Humber.
4 members in the East Midlands.
3 members in the North East.

Scotland would have 5 members.
Wales would have 3 members.
Northern Ireland would have 2 members.

In theory, there would be enough members for Chapters in every nation, and every English region, except Northern Ireland (sorry Wee Drop). In practice you're unlikely to get even half the members interested in being Chapter officials, which leaves only Greater London and the South East as viable regions (and, since they're adjacent, they could be combined without stretching the travel time requirement too much).

Given where the population is, if we ever manage to renew the UK chapter, it's likely to be based in London and the South East.



[1] Based on the number of active on-line participants I think this hypothetical number is somewhat on the high side.
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Re: Chapter Status

Post by mystic_1 » Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:54 am

Aeon wrote:I'm not sure you understand the proposal; the only departure from the requirements listed both in your email and in the chapters forum is that some of our bi-monthly meetings be conducted online, the only person suggesting anything like a 'virtual chapter' is you and its a pretty misleading straw-man argument to make as I already know for a fact that a couple of well established state wide chapters using online meetings to suppliment their real world meetings & events.

If you are unable to meet the chapter operating requirements in the real world, than you're not fulfilling the chapter operating requirements. Online fundraisers have been denied in the past as chapter charity events. The point of local ZS chapters is to gather people and host activities in the real world.

Having officers who don't live in the same country, and are too far away to attend meetings and events, would also be counter to the way chapters are intended to run. Remember, chapters are now considered to cover a two-hour radius, so you shouldn't be thinking about a "UK chapter" so much as a "London Chapter" or "Manchester Chapter" or "Dublin Chapter".

Regarding the question of officers, currently the only process that's required to replace one is to file a new Chapter Agreement with the new officer's information. The new officer must be a paid ZS member of course, but the process is pretty easy and several chapters have done so in the time that I've been working with the ZS Chapter Admin team. I can't speak to what happened when ZSC010 was marked inactive, as that was before my time. I can say that today, replacing officers is as simple as letting the chapters team know about it and filing a new chapter agreement.

I'm glad that you have so much enthusiasm towards getting ZSC010 operational again, and this is something that we'd like to see happen. I like Sheddi's post, as he rightly points out you could theoretically have several chapters in the UK.

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