Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Topics in this category pertain to planning. Discussions include how to prepare yourself, your family and your community for catastrophes and what you plan to do when they hit you.

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Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by wee drop o' bush » Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:49 pm

Vel454 wrote:Whether it's something super practical or not, knowledge is knowledge. It weighs nothing, and takes up no room. Thanks for the idea! Living in the Pacific Northwest we have a lot of spider webs around, could be a useful bit of knowledge some day (but I hope it'll never be needed). Good tip.
Ditto :)
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by FyreWitch » Thu Jun 16, 2011 8:15 pm

wee drop o' bush wrote:If you have an infected cut or burn that is prurient (green 'n yukky) slather some honey on it & then cover with a sterile dressing. Repeat the process every twelve hours or so, using a clean dressing each time. You'll see all the green infected gunk that the honey has drawn out onthe old dressing each time you replace it!
Also on a cut or scald that isn't infected neat lavender oil reduces inflammation & speeds up healing...but never use lavender on a still pus filled wound! You have to draw any infection out first!
Obviously don't use either honey, dressings or lavender if you are allergic to them...yada yada yada :)
ps I'm a trained, practising
Aromatherapist so both tips have been tried & tested by me on my willing subjects :twisted:
But if any of you think they're nonsense fair enough

I can attest to the truth of this. Aromatherapy, herbalism and folk medicine all gain necessity when "modern" medicine isn't available.

Rugger - good info! I never heard of the spiderweb packing before but it is logical and makes sense. Thank you.

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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by yossarian » Thu Jun 16, 2011 8:54 pm

The spider web trick was in The Grapes of Wrath. Nice to hear it in the non-fiction section too.
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Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by wee drop o' bush » Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:48 am

FyreWitch wrote:
wee drop o' bush wrote:If you have an infected cut or burn that is prurient (green 'n yukky) slather some honey on it & then cover with a sterile dressing. Repeat the process every twelve hours or so, using a clean dressing each time. You'll see all the green infected gunk that the honey has drawn out onthe old dressing each time you replace it!
Also on a cut or scald that isn't infected neat lavender oil reduces inflammation & speeds up healing...but never use lavender on a still pus filled wound! You have to draw any infection out first!
Obviously don't use either honey, dressings or lavender if you are allergic to them...yada yada yada :)
ps I'm a trained, practising
Aromatherapist so both tips have been tried & tested by me on my willing subjects :twisted:
But if any of you think they're nonsense fair enough

I can attest to the truth of this. Aromatherapy, herbalism and folk medicine all gain necessity when "modern" medicine isn't available.

Rugger - good info! I never heard of the spiderweb packing before but it is logical and makes sense. Thank you.
My cousin us a GP & we've had a few spats about this subject...BUT he does concede that Aspirin is from Willow bark, Penicillin is from the penicillin mold, digitalis is from the foxglove plant etc etc:D
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by FyreWitch » Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:45 am

I find more doctors who are becoming selectively respectful of natural healing methods. Not a loud bunch. But the few are quietly coming around. In a serious SHTF or TEOTWAWKI, there will be great need of healers who can work wiithout pharmaceticals to depend upon. Very happy to meet a like- minded soul :)
Also, medical science is rediscovering the uses of treatments such as leeches and maggots again. I see a variety of non-convential treatments ordered. Like Net-pots for those with sinus problems rather than decongestents or antihistamines.

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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:05 am

I can also verify the spider web treatment, I've used it on some rather bloody scrapes, just passing the wounded area through the web. Yes, you'll probably need several, but that's not usually a difficult task.

And, I like the wood chopping trick posted, that's pretty slick. Beats making a single chop, and bending over, rinse and repeat...

I'm sure this one won't be too popular, but- if you take a USGI body bag camping, it can be: a hammock, a ground sheet, a sleeping bag cover, a stretcher, and, if all goes as bad as it can, it's original purpose is still workable. I'm taking mine along with a poncho and woobie as my sleep system this summer, and except (hopefully) the original purpose, I'll be using it as all of those things. I'm 6'2". and 225 lbs, and I still find it roomy.
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Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by wee drop o' bush » Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:20 am

FyreWitch wrote:I find more doctors who are becoming selectively respectful of natural healing methods. Not a loud bunch. But the few are quietly coming around. In a serious SHTF or TEOTWAWKI, there will be great need of healers who can work wiithout pharmaceticals to depend upon. Very happy to meet a like- minded soul :)
Also, medical science is rediscovering the uses of treatments such as leeches and maggots again. I see a variety of non-convential treatments ordered. Like Net-pots for those with sinus problems rather than decongestents or antihistamines.
I agree that in a SHTF scenario as traditional medical supplies run out people will need to look to what's available in the natural world round them. My friends dad has had maggot poultices used on wounds that aren't healing well due to his diabetes :shock:
I'd have them as a last resort but I'd be using a honey poultice first! Manuka honey is amazing at drawing out infected matter whilst reducing Inflammation & speeding up healing:D
Don't start me please as I'll go on & on:lol:
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by EricinVirginia » Fri Jun 17, 2011 7:29 am

I've always heard that running water is cleaner than trickling water is cleaner than stagnant water. Anyone know if there's truth to that? I know when I'm out and about, I always try to collect and filter running water as opposed to standing.

Spiderwebs, nice. Gross, but nice. I presume you're talking about webs that don't have the spiders and their food in them... right? Please say yes.

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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by Vel454 » Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:24 am

EricinMaryland wrote:I've always heard that running water is cleaner than trickling water is cleaner than stagnant water. Anyone know if there's truth to that? I know when I'm out and about, I always try to collect and filter running water as opposed to standing.

Spiderwebs, nice. Gross, but nice. I presume you're talking about webs that don't have the spiders and their food in them... right? Please say yes.
You don't want dead and vampirized insect corpses in your wound? :roll: :lol:

As for the running water bit, it makes sense. Stagnant water would have more insects in it, any contaminates would simpy mirk around the area, instead of washing down stream (wouldn't trust that all of it is gone just because the water is running). As far as any tested proof goes though, I am completely clueless and curious about it too. But given the two choices, I would always take water from a running source first, assuming - as far as I could tell - all else was equal. Good question bro, hope someone more knowledgable chimes in. :D
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by Meat N' Taters » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:00 am

If you get finned by a catfish, the slime on it's body is a natural antidote to the toxins.

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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by CaptBrainFreeze » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:52 am

Emergency bonding/glue.

I know there are several ways but this one is my favorite because of the strength it produces.
Fish scales= scrap away till you collect a good amount. At least 10 ozs. Wash them, removing the smell. Add enough water to barely cover them and bring to a boil, reduce, add a tight fitting lid and cook for sixish hours. (The proteins will cook down and produce a clearish liquid). Cool and store in a cool place NEVER TAKING OFF the lid to whatever container you put it in until you are ready to use it. Never know when you need glue, being sealing wounds or repairing gear.

Conventional wisdom says put pack extra glue :lol:

( was gonna post a video I made on this once but it seems to have gone poof, guess I'll do a take two.)
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by Super Kill Guy » Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:22 pm

KnightoftheRoc wrote:I'm sure this one won't be too popular, but- if you take a USGI body bag camping, it can be: a hammock, a ground sheet, a sleeping bag cover, a stretcher, and, if all goes as bad as it can, it's original purpose is still workable. I'm taking mine along with a poncho and woobie as my sleep system this summer, and except (hopefully) the original purpose, I'll be using it as all of those things. I'm 6'2". and 225 lbs, and I still find it roomy.
And they're cheap http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/n ... x?a=529490" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by Prepared American » Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:00 pm

KnightoftheRoc wrote:I'm sure this one won't be too popular, but- if you take a USGI body bag camping, it can be: a hammock, a groundsheet, a sleeping bag cover, a stretcher, and, if all goes as bad as it can, it's original purpose is still workable. I'm taking mine along with a poncho and woobie as my sleep system this summer, and except (hopefully) the original purpose, I'll be using it as all of those things. I'm 6'2". and 225 lbs, and I still find it roomy.


I totally agree. I have a CBRN Casualty bag left over from the first golf war that I have used for all the above. It is a little more heavy duty and has a vynil window over your face. Makes a great bivy.
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Sat Jun 18, 2011 4:24 am

Prepared American wrote:
KnightoftheRoc wrote:I'm sure this one won't be too popular, but- if you take a USGI body bag camping, it can be: a hammock, a groundsheet, a sleeping bag cover, a stretcher, and, if all goes as bad as it can, it's original purpose is still workable. I'm taking mine along with a poncho and woobie as my sleep system this summer, and except (hopefully) the original purpose, I'll be using it as all of those things. I'm 6'2". and 225 lbs, and I still find it roomy.


I totally agree. I have a CBRN Casualty bag left over from the first golf war that I have used for all the above. It is a little more heavy duty and has a vinyl window over your face. Makes a great bivy.
If it's laid out with 6 handle loops like the body bag, I'd love to see pics of it rigged as a hammock. I have back issues, so a hammock has to be pretty taughtly hung, for me, or I need to be EVAC'ed in the morning. I'm still figuring mine out, to accommodate this problem with a solution that does NOT involve ramming a walking stick up me bum before bedtime :lol:
Vel454 wrote:
EricinMaryland wrote:I've always heard that running water is cleaner than trickling water is cleaner than stagnant water. Anyone know if there's truth to that? I know when I'm out and about, I always try to collect and filter running water as opposed to standing.

Spiderwebs, nice. Gross, but nice. I presume you're talking about webs that don't have the spiders and their food in them... right? Please say yes.
You don't want dead and vampirized insect corpses in your wound? :roll: :lol:
Man, what a NOOB! :lol:
As for the running water bit, it makes sense. Stagnant water would have more insects in it, any contaminates would simpy mirk around the area, instead of washing down stream (wouldn't trust that all of it is gone just because the water is running). As far as any tested proof goes though, I am completely clueless and curious about it too. But given the two choices, I would always take water from a running source first, assuming - as far as I could tell - all else was equal. Good question bro, hope someone more knowledgable chimes in. :D
Moving water, especially if it gets to "tumble", aerates itself. This not only helps to drop heavier contaminants, but also helps to purify the water- many waterborne ickies do not like air, and die in it. Where I live, we have one of the major reservoirs for NYC nearby, and one of the last stages before being piped down to the city, is aeration via a HUGE fountain. Before 9/11, locals used to go park near it, to enjoy the evaporative cooling it provided during the summer. And to neck, but that's another topic...
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by TacAir » Sat Jun 18, 2011 2:00 pm

Rugger wrote:
the_alias wrote: Have you ever done this?

I find the idea of finding enough spider webbing to "pack" a wound big enough to need packing somewhat dubious. Because surely if you need to pack the wound then it is pretty bad and you aren't going to be wandering around looking for spiderwebs :?
I actually have. Learned both (the pissing and packing) from the guys on my parents ranch, all in one event. I was climbing up on a windmill and trying to chain off the fan so that I could do some work on it. The brake at the bottom was broken, so I had to climb up, wait for the wind to die down a bit, and grab/stop the fan to chain it off.
Image


Well, even when they are moving slow, they are a lot harder to stop than you would think. I grabbed one of the blades (with leather work gloves) and tried to stop it. It slowed but got yanked out of my hands. One of the blades that was coming right behind it sliced the top of my left forearm, half-way between my wrist and crook of my elbow, for a semi deep inch and a half cut. No muscle, but right down to it. Still have a nice scar. One of the vaqueros had already started collecting webs from all of the cedar trees in the area when I got down. It was gushing pretty good, combo of exertion, heat, and somewhat deep cut. It wasn't a whole lot of webbing, and it doesn't take much. You don't want them to be compacted down super tight. Keep them kind of fluffy before you put them into the cut.

Anyway, pissed on my arm, put in the webs, and wrapped it with a bandanna. Worked like a charm. For something really life threatening, yeah, you don't need to be running around collecting them. And it's not going to be an alternative for something that would require a tourniquet. But for most stuff that's not a scrape, it'll work great. I'm sure climate/season has a lot to do with it, but you can find a lot more spider webs than you would think.

If you have soft hands (not doing manual labor) urinating on your hands while working will help to build up callus as you work. At one point I had calluses hard enough to 'sand' pine.

Also - if you have a bad case of 'road rash', use sugar to stop the weeping and protect the skin. Carry a few sugar packets in the FAK just in case.
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by kcor_77 » Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:10 am

Not sure if this is the type of wisdom that is wanted here but it has helped me over the years.

Glue two pennies next to the terminals on your batterys. It will act in the same way zinc acts on a bout engine. It attracts all the bad stuff you don't want on you car or truck battery.
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by thelung187 » Sun Jun 19, 2011 7:38 am

If man's best friend is part of your family and you keep a first aid kit for them (you should!), make sure you keep a small bag of cornstarch and some Q-tips handy. This can be used to stop small bleeding wounds if you're out on the trail somewhere and they get hurt. I imagine the concept is similar to flour-based solution somebody proposed earlier, but I can only speak personally to having used cornstarch with success.
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A summary of the contributions so far

Post by AnonEmous » Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:06 am

Here is a quick summary by topic of the excellent non-conventional wisdom so far; these are great, keep them coming...
- Be sure to check the original contribution for all the details.
- When adding new contributions, please respond to Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know instead of this summary
- When adding new contributions, please include a source of the information if possible

Basic Survival:
- AnonEmous: bringing water to a rolling boil is enough to purify it once the water naturally cools; it is not necessary to boil water for 5 or 10 minutes to kill pathogens
- TacAir: iodine is not necessarily capable of neutralizing giardia cysts or cryptosporidium oocysts in water; it is advisable to purify water with another method before drinking

First Aid:
- DannusMaximus: pouring cool water over a cut or scrape is an effective way to clean it; hydrogen peroxide or iodine may irritate wounds
- Meat N' Taters: the membrane on the inside of the shell of a raw egg can be used to close up a cut
- Rugger: urine is a source of sterile water which can be used to irrigate or clean a wound, unless the urine comes from someone with a VD or UTI
- wee drop o' bush: an infected cut or burn that is prurient (green 'n yukky) can be treated by applying honey and covering with a sterile dressing. Repeat the process every twelve hours or so, using a clean dressing each time; the honey will draw out the green infected gunk on the dressing each time.
- Rugger: spider webs can be used to pack a wound and significantly aid in clotting.

Cleaning:
- FyreWitch: Borax is a great all purpose cleaner and also helps keep the environment free of insects such as ants and fleas, but do not use this around small children

Animal Encounters:
- AnonEmous: a mix of 1 quart 3% hydrogen Peroxide, 1/4 cup Baking Soda, and 1 teaspoon liquid soap in a tub of cool water will help to get (most) of the skunk smell out; tomato juice is not effective
- FyreWitch: the BEST cleanser for skunk odor is an enzymatic odor remover or cleanser available at pet stores or farmers' markets
- Meat N' Taters: a natural antidote to the toxins in catfish fins is the slime on it's body.

Building, fabrication materials:
- KnightoftheRoc: electrical connectors and plumbing fittings are the same sizes and threads; electrical PVC is grey, plumbing PVC is white or green
- KnightoftheRoc: a USGI body bag can be used as a hammock, a ground sheet, a sleeping bag cover, or a stretcher
- CaptBrainFreeze: fish scales can be used to make glue; scrape scales off to collect at least 10 ozs. and wash them to remove the smell; add enough water to barely cover them and bring to a boil, reduce, add a tight fitting lid and cook for sixish hours. The proteins cook down to produce a clearish liquid.

Vehicle related:
- kcor_77: gluing two pennies next to the terminals on a car or truck battery will attract all the bad stuff you do not want on the battery.

Miscellaneous:
-TacAir: urine will help build up calluses on your hands for manual labor.
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Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by wee drop o' bush » Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:49 am

Great summary AnonEmous
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by Vel454 » Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:49 am

Just a lot of little stuff that comes to mind. I don't have any references to anything, just stuff I've picked up myself, been shown, or heard about.

1. Old blacksmithing trick: if your hammer head is sliding up off of the handle, flip the hammer upside down, choke your hand down a bit on the wood, and hold it with a loose grip. Smack the end of the handle, and the forces of inertia will push the hammer head back to the proper place. You should give yourself enough room on the handle, with the hand thats holding it, to 'catch' the handle from falling out of your hand after each blow. Then add a wedge to it.

2. No compass or map and it's too cloudy to see the sun? Pay attention to the folliage around you. If your in the northern hemisphere, moss will grow predominately on the side of a tree or rock that's out of the sunlight, creating a rough direction north. If your in an open plains and you know the predominate wind direction, check to see which way the grass is bent over. It's fairly common to see an entire field of knee high grass bent over towards the south east, if that's the predominate wind direction. Also, most trees and plants will grow the strongest towards sunlight. If you see a cluster of trees, where in one general direction, the branches on each tree are pretty short and/or little foliage on them, but on the sides and front of the three, the branches are really thick and stretch out away from the trunk, it can act as a rough guide north for you. Plants need sunlight, and they'll stretch for it and put most of their energy into reaching that direction, often leaving the backside rather sparse (ever notice how your christmas tree usually has a "bad side" :lol: )

3. A blade of grass stretched taught between your thumbs can create an emergency whistle.
Image

4. If your trying to siphon gas out of a car (with the owner's permission of course) check to see if there is any gas in the tank first, by blowing into the hose and listening for bubbles. Can save yourself some time and energy.

5. The amount of heat put out by firewood, is directly related to it's weight (when dry of course). Something to think about when falling timber on your property/buying firewood/whatever.

6. If you ever are faced with the situation of having downed powerlines in your path in a SHTF or whatever scenario. The wider the wires are mounted apart, the more distance they require to not arc into each other. Some of the large lines on the steel towers that carry power from one region to another can have up to 12-16 foot spaces between lines. Some of the powerlines you see on the urbam street only have a few feet between lines. Use this as a rough indicator of the proximity you can get to them. Obviously you should avoid downed powerlines at all costs. But realize that some lines can arc out and get you quite a bit further than others. If you made it passed one set, dont assume you have the method figured out, the next set of lines can be a lot bigger and meaner, and reach out quite a bit further.

7. If your in your vehicle on a very steep incline and your engine just died, but you still have battery power while driving a stick. You can use your starter to repeatedly lunge your vehicle forward by leaving the clutch out while turning the ignition. You run a high risk of burning out your starter doing this, but if it's a last ditch effort, it's a tool of knowledge that can make or break a situation. Can also be used to lunge a vehicle forward off railroad tracks if broken down, last couple yards to a gas pump, etc.

8. You can magnitise a tool (screwdriver for example) in a pinch, by wrapping a short length of wire around the metal and touching your vehicles battery terminals with each end. Wear gloves or something, so you dont get burnt. Only takes a fraction of a second, but if you need it, it's another option.

9. If you're building a fence, placing the fence posts in upside down, will make them last longer.

10. If you make a pot of coffee and you dont drink all of it and it gets cold, use it to water your plants. It has a high amount of nitrogen in it and your plants will be happy.
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bigmattdaddywack
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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by bigmattdaddywack » Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:48 am

Necro:
Ivory soap can be used to tan skins in lieu of brains in the brain tanning method . I am looking into that for next deer and trapping season.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ejd2rsXoQSI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:28 am

bigmattdaddywack wrote:Necro:
Ivory soap can be used to tan skins in lieu of brains in the brain tanning method . I am looking into that for next deer and trapping season.
A friend of mine, who introduced me to trapping and skinning, told me that the Ivory Snow FLAKES work best, if you can find them. For some reason, around here, they don't seem to be on the shelf as much anymore.

The reason they work, is the astringent action the soap has on the fats and body oils in the skin, pulling them out into the solution. Pretty much anything that can do this will work for tanning, with various results for longevity of the skin. Scraping off as much body fat from the inside of the skin as possible beforehand will shorten the time required, and give more uniform results.
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bigmattdaddywack
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Favorite Zombie Movies: Zombieland, Shaun of the dead, dawn of the dead, 28 days later,Hide and Creep, Night of the living dead, Undead, Return of the Living Dead.
Not truly zombie movies but, Evil Dead I and II, Army of darkness
Location: St. Louis, Missouri

Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by bigmattdaddywack » Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:59 am

They have not made Ivory soap flakes since 1978.
http://www.ivorysnow.ca/faq.php#10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ejd2rsXoQSI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grq0rhtbtAw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Non-conventional wisdom: Please add what you know

Post by KnightoftheRoc » Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:01 pm

bigmattdaddywack wrote:They have not made Ivory soap flakes since 1978.
http://www.ivorysnow.ca/faq.php#10
He was buying them in the early eighties- they must have had an incredible amount of it warehoused, if it was still on the shelves then. Does explain why I don't see it anymore, tho!
silentpoet wrote: My first two warning shots are aimed center of mass. If that don't warn them I fire warning shots at their head until they are warned enough that I am no longer in fear for my life.

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