Doomsday and the availability of canning jars.

[Trioxin]

I came to grips with yet another misconception of survival prep today.
The tomatoes are coming in fast and furious around here, so I have decided this year would be the year to start canning. I bought 2 dozen jars around the beginnig of the spring. I have used them all and have around 20 tomatoes sitting on the counter. Today I hit the street looking for more jars and found NOTHING. I hit the two local dollar stores, completely sold out. Hit the hardware store, nothing. Farm co-op, sold out. I even tryed Wal-mart. They had only THREE 12 packs of half-pint jelly jars. I drove to the next closest wal-mart (40 miles) and found the same scenario. 5 12 packs of half-pints. Seems like evryone is buing canning stuff. Everyone I asked said the same thing, "Normally we have enough jars to last the whole season, but we sold out on two days", or some variation on the theme.
So here is where this whole thing is going...
I have been pretty secure with the whole "I'll just grow veggies and can them for food" thing, but how the fuck can I do that if I can't buy any canning jars? I'm prepping for doomsday and the prep goes sour if the stores can't even keep jars. Just wait until the shit REALLY starts hitting the fan, where will one find jars then? I know we can all raid the zombie-infested cities to find jars, but here in the real world I have an immediate problem.
Just some thoughts.

[Chantrea]

Well, now you know that the best time to pick up free or low cost canning supplies is before or after peak harvest season. Winter is actually a great time to ask on freecycle if there's anyone interested in getting rid of that hugeass canner that they used for a few times and then it's been taking up space in their cabinets (or on the floor or shelf) ever since or canning tools or jars. So yep, add the jars to your stockpile list and/or buy a few more boxes than you think you might use. Though at least next year you will have your empties, if you eat as you go!

I've noticed a lot more people getting interested in canning, I think because of economic factors. With this many noobs getting into it, maybe there will be a new botulism scare or a bunch of people killed by eating rotten tomatoes and then you can scoop up the windfall as everyone dumps their jars out of fear!

I stockpile wide mouth lids, since about this time of year it seems like all the stores have left are the regular ones.

You might still be able to find jars (though you might have competition) for the asking on freecycle or other community lists you're on even now though. In my experience a LOT of people start out gung ho, get a bunch of boxes of jars, and then after spend 1 or 2 afternoons doing huge batches they don't even want to look at the second half of their box.

That doesn't help you with right-now-ripe tomatoes though. Perhaps you can make some sauce and freeze it? Obviously, problems there with storage that's independent of electricity BUT at least they won't go to waste if you don't think you'll eat them all before they go bad.

[GeneralDiscontent]

I wouldn't worry too much - it's probably that we're just hitting the beginning of peak demand for canning supplies (everyone's gardens are starting to produce). On top of that, my wife & I have both noticed that Wal-Mart & other stores are stocking less canning supplies in general, and they aren't stocking them year-round - probably because fewer and fewer people are canning nowadays (I remember my Mom & most of my friend's mothers canning every year when I was a kid, but I am the only person I know among my friends & co-workers who is doing any canning).

Places I've had luck finding jars:

Big Lots - this is where I bought the bulk of my new jars this year. $2 cheaper per dozen than Wally World.

Farm-oriented / hardware stores - TSC, The Andersons, etc.. We picked up some small jelly jars at The Andersons last weekend, and they had all their canners & jars on sale, displayed right at the front entrance of the store. I think I've seen canning supplies at some hardware stores (ACE Hardware, maybe? They closed our local ACE, so I'm not sure...)

Craigslist - search for "canning" or "mason jars". Most of the ads I saw were too expensive, IMHO (most people were asking $5/dozen for jars only, vs. $7/dozen for new jars w/ lids & bands). But, if you need jars RIGHT NOW, I guess it's better than nothing.

Salvation Army / thrift stores - can be hit-or-miss, but I've seen at least a dozen or so jars at every one I've been to. There are 4 or 5 thrift stores within 20 minutes of my house, so I could scrounge up 50 or so jars pretty quick with $20 and an afternoon of driving.

Garage sales - Obviously, these are the most hit-or-miss. Check the ads on Craigslist and in your local paper to see if they mention "canning supplies". If you have friends or family members who hit a lot of garage sales, put the word out to them that you'll reimburse them + a couple of bucks for their trouble if they pick up any jars they see at xxx price. It can take a while, but sometimes you can get a big score:



...as I mentioned earlier tonight in the canning thread, we got 100 jars for ten cents apiece. This was because one of my wife's co-workers is a garage sale fanatic, and asked us if we wanted her to be on the lookout for anything - we told her "canning jars", and she said "How much do you want to pay?" We told her "25 cents apiece or less". She called today and said "Come pick up your jars - you might wanna empty your trunk first..."

[Bubba Enfield]

...as I mentioned earlier tonight in the canning thread, we got 100 jars for ten cents apiece. This was because one of my wife's co-workers is a garage sale fanatic, and asked us if we wanted her to be on the lookout for anything - we told her "canning jars", and she said "How much do you want to pay?" We told her "25 cents apiece or less". She called today and said "Come pick up your jars - you might wanna empty your trunk first..."

Great score. In addition to garage sales, ask around to your older relatives and friends, if they or their friends have any jars they don't want anymore. They may be willing to part with them for free or cheap, if they're unable to can nowadays, and they know someone is going to use them.

[GeneralDiscontent]

Great score. In addition to garage sales, ask around to your older relatives and friends, if they or their friends have any jars they don't want anymore. They may be willing to part with them for free or cheap, if they're unable to can nowadays, and they know someone is going to use them.

Very true - my Mom quit canning after all the kids were out of the house, she gave all her supplies away or sold them at garage sales. My wife's mother passed away a few years before we started canning; my father-in-law gave away HUNDREDS of jars (you know the plastic racks that they store bread on in the stockroom of grocery stores? She had four stacks of those, six feet high, filled with jars). We were talking with my wife's aunt last week about canning, and she said, "Oh, do you need a pressure canner? All I do anymore is water bath, so I have an extra one..." Unfortunately, we just bought one this year (although my wife said she might take it so she can have two going at once.)

[herbalpagan]

I haven't had any problems finding canning jars...even the grocery stores have them. However, don't try and look for them, you have to ask, as the stores haven't figured out that people are canning again. I did have a huge issue trying to find a stupid jar lifter! lol
I went to this site to get what I needed, and I notice that they have canning jars. http://www.canningpantry.com/
However, I'd go through all the older people you know first.
A quick tip to finding out how many jars you will need: if you are canning for you main food, you will need a minimum of 365 jars (pint) and an assortment of quarts and jelly jars. It sounds like a HUGE amount, but remember that all you need to do after the first year is replace the lids. I am slowly building up my supply again, after years of not canning. I used to have over 600 jars.

[bonanacrom]

Go to Lehmans web site and get a catalog,you can order all the jars you want.And they have a lot of other stuff you will like

[dug]

You may run across the tip that mayonaise jars can be found that have the same size and mouth as a quart mason jar. Growing up we canned hundreds of jars every year and tried the mayo thing when we were running low. The failure rate was ridiculous, so I'd steer clear of that unless the EOTW had already happened.

[MoGrrrl]

Every year we have a difficult time finding jars; we're always behind the curve. I am picking up some freebies tonight via craigslist. I actually posted in the barter topic, and a woman contacted me saying I could have them for free.

When putting out the word that you are looking for jars, you might mention if you are willing to take them with food. It might be a heck of a cleanup project, but if there are no jars to be had it might be a good solution.

Without enough jars, you could also freeze or dehydrate tomatoes, and most other produce. I've seen a pasta sauce recipe that uses dehydrated, pulverized tomatoes. You could make tomato leather.

[MyrnaTheMinx]

If you have an Ace hardware store near you, check the Ace hardware online site. They will ship the jars to your local store for free, if they have them; however, their price is not the best.

Not as cheap as locally bought or craigslist, but here a couple of other sites with canning jars, a little more pricy and shipping charges.

http://www.fillmorecontainer.com/dept.asp?deptID=1

http://www.goodmans.net/get_dept_1051.htm

[Trioxin]

Thanks for all the input guys. I'll keep looking.

[Trioxin]

Thanks for all the input guys. I'll keep looking.

[LD!]

Could you make clay jars that would be suitable for canning?

[Chantrea]

You can get ceramic pickling and potting crocks, and also use those to salt-preserve things.

With modernish canning though you need to be able to submerge them in boiling water and have something that can get an air tight vaccuum seal. So for mason-jarish canning, no.

But you COULD make pickling crocks! Or crocks for making potted meat, though those would not be as 'safe' as modern canning jars, people have done it for centuries.

I assume that for a total societal reset/apocalypse type of situation we'd need to accept a certain amount of backsliding as far as sanitary tolerance goes.

[Vindex]

Heh, I sort of cleaned out the local thrift store of 4 boxes of mason jars w lids coupla weeks ago. Lotsa spaghetti sauce jars are actually mason jars, so if you're into spaghetti, keep'm.

[dug]

Did the thrift store have new lids? The rings are re-usable but the lids not so much. Another issue with canning PAW.

Do the spaghetti jars work better than the frequent-fail mayo jars? If you're canning scores of jars too high a failure rate gets more expensive than buying real canning jars.

[Chantrea]

Yeah, you have to be careful with mayo and commercial spagetti sauce jars. One would think that the commercials would be even hardier, but for some reason they're not. The only time I have ever had jars explode in the canner is when I have tried 'just this once' to reuse a non home canning jar. :/ So for me personally I don't waste my time on them normally since I can to be economical. If we're talking PAW though, you take and try what you can get.

It's not a great idea to reuse lids (but if you can get them to work PAW why the hell not). However, you can get a small box of lids at just about any grocery store's 'baking' aisle for super cheap. Since it's just lids it's compact as well. I think the most I have paid is $3 for a spankin' brand new box.

[MoGrrrl]

If you really want to reuse, you can take used lids and worn out (rings) and use the commercial jars for storage of spices, noodles, etc.

[herbalpagan]

I've tried this and it's note worth doing. I use my spagetti and mayo jars for storing my herbs and sometimes leftovers.

[ZombieGranny]

Old mayonnaise jars were much thicker than they are now. Manufacturers started making them thinner back in the 1970s and it seems each year they get thinner.

The stated 'shelf life' of unused lids is 5 years. After that, the seal can get brittle or gummy.

[IceWing]

The stated 'shelf life' of unused lids is 5 years. After that, the seal can get brittle or gummy.

One of the things I've tried to figure out is a good way to store spare lids, in bulk, so that they'd be good a few years down the road. So far, the best (untried) solution I've been able to come up with is to use the food-saver and vac seal them before storing in a cool dark place. Anybody have any thoughts? Storage of canning jar lids and long term storage of fishing line has been something I've wondered about for a while.

Ice

[LowKey]

What about the "European" style canning jars I was in a Lehman's catalog a few years back? I think they use a separate thick rubber gasket(sort of like a grolsch bottle). That should seriously reduce the need for new jar lids in the PAW.

[Ufdyixcaff]

If push REALLY comes to shove, you can always dry whatever you want to save. Alternately, you can pickle most veggies, which doesnt require hermetically sealing the jars... which means you can reuse old pickle jars if you want.

[AgentBlack]

i'm sure the run on jars is just a local fad. let it pass.
or.....
http://www.canningpantry.com/canning-jars.html
http://theconsumerlink.com/FreshPreserving/list/fpballreg/100
http://www.sks-bottle.com/CanningJars.html
http://www.kitchenkrafts.com/category.asp_Q_c_E_140100
http://www.pressurecooker-outlet.com/canningjars.htm