lockpicks

Other provisions not covered above that may make survival easier if your life is tossed out of the norm. This section is for discussing everything from arc welders to underwear.

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TheFreakinBear
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Re: lockpicks

Post by TheFreakinBear » Sun Jul 19, 2009 6:10 pm

No no I'm sorry. I read it wrong. I see what you are saying now.

It would be a lot faster to break down the door or knock out a window instead of lock picking. If it's somewhere you want to get into to be safe it would make more sense to pick the lock so you don't have to worry about boarding anything up immediately.
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Re: lockpicks

Post by crypto » Sun Jul 19, 2009 6:14 pm

Yeah but picking something thats not yours is just as illegal, so thats a moot point.

The point people are trying to make here is that walking around with lockpicks is a bad fucking idea, its a skill with no practical applications that dont involve breaking the law, because leaving your home with your pickset is already illegal, before you even do anything.

Like I said, google for lockpicks. theres a ton of places online that will sell them to you if you want them. You will most likely not find anywhere local that sells them to people who arent locksmiths, since those people will be breaking the law when they leave the store.
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elricfate
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Re: lockpicks

Post by elricfate » Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:45 am

Anyhow.

Here in Ohio, where TFB is, it's perfectly legal to own a set of lock picks. Or twenty sets.
They're not Criminal Tools unless they're being used in the commission of a crime, ACTIVELY. If a cop rolls up and you have them in your front seat, they're not criminal tools, they're just tools. I know, this having come up exclusively in class.
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Re: lockpicks

Post by Brendan Sullivan » Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:59 am

I think OP is a Virginian. :lol:

VA - Virginia Code of Virginia - Section 18.2-94 - Possession of burglarious tools, etc. If any person have in his possession any tools, implements or outfit, with intent to commit burglary, robbery or larceny, upon conviction thereof he shall be guilty of a Class 5 felony. The possession of such burglarious tools, implements or outfit by any person other than a licensed dealer, shall be prima facie evidence of an intent to commit burglary, robbery or larceny.



Edit: I love the version for my home state (tl:dr version - don't possess any non-ethereal items if you're in a situation where they can pin intent on you).

CA – California California Penal Code – Section 466-469. Burglarious And Larcenous Instruments And Deadly Weapons. 466. Every person having upon him or her in his or her possession a picklock, crow, keybit, crowbar, screwdriver, vise grip pliers, water-pump pliers, slidehammer, slim jim, tension bar, lock pick gun, tubular lock pick, floor-safe door puller, master key, ceramic or porcelain spark plug chips or pieces, or other instrument or tool with intent feloniously to break or enter into any building, railroad car, aircraft, or vessel, trailer coach, or vehicle as defined in the Vehicle Code, or who shall knowingly make or alter, or shall attempt to make or alter, any key or other instrument named above so that the same will fit or open the lock of a building, railroad car, aircraft, vessel, trailer coach, or vehicle as defined in the Vehicle Code, without being requested to do so by some person having the right to open the same, or who shall make, alter, or repair any instrument or thing, knowing or having reason to believe that it is intended to be used in committing a misdemeanor or felony, is guilty of a misdemeanor. Any of the structures mentioned in Section 459 shall be deemed to be a building within the meaning of this section.

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Re: lockpicks

Post by HHaase » Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:25 pm

So, just to get things back on track, let me see if I can put the various viewpoints into a single post here.

Many folks here consider it a fascinating trade to learn, and a valuable skill to have in some legitimate emergency situations. They also highly recommend only learning said skills through proper methods.

BUT, it comes with a significant caveat in that there are some very significant legal pitfalls that vary by where you live. Enough that some folks here are uneasy having the topic discussed. Olaf's post on the matter would be an excellent resource to discuss, which I will look for (and link to plus edit here to make sure I am correct). To sum it up, he was a properly documented apprentice locksmith who just happened to have his tools with him at the wrong time. He's now a convicted felon due to a crappy turn of events that had no apparent ill intent.

I think I caught everything there. Just to add my own nugget of wisdom..... I'd recommend discussing this with folks from a local trade school who know the laws of your area. They would be able to give you the proper guidance to do it properly, with much more accuracy than pretty much anybody on this forum could hope for.

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Re: lockpicks

Post by Kabong30 » Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:18 am

TheFreakinBear wrote:
Kabong30 wrote:
TheFreakinBear wrote:Maybe we're asking because we are looking at possibly becoming an apprentice for this and need some advice?

I can't speak for the OP but the father of a good friend of mine is a locksmith and always asks if I want to apprentice. He loves it and buys a variety of locks just to unlock them with his tools. Says it's a lot of fun and wants someone to compete against in terms of racing to unlock a series of different locks, in order. The have local competitions in some areas just apparently not by him.
How convenient for you. I'd say pursue that avenue and be careful discussing it here? Just a thought.
And why don't you get a fucking life and not jump to conclusions. Are you an idiot? Do you really think that I, having been here so long am dumb enough to talk about something if it was illegal? If this topic is illegal than I apologize for my naivete but as far as I know there is nothing illegal about asking about a decent lock picking kit for someone who wants to apprentice.

Again, I can't speak for the other guy but, unlike you, I can assume he's got good intentions as well. Don't make me ban you.
I never did get your PM. I think OP's question has been adequately addressed and the only thing I was really trying to say was that I would not go discussing things that could be considered illegal. It's in the rules of the board and the reminders are plentiful. As far as the life I have, I'd say trolling the ZS forum for reasons to get pissed or dredge up threads that are multiple years dead must be so much more rewarding. Feel free to PM me anytime, friend.

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Re: lockpicks

Post by elricfate » Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:33 am

Kabong30 wrote:
I never did get your PM. I think OP's question has been adequately addressed and the only thing I was really trying to say was that I would not go discussing things that could be considered illegal. It's in the rules of the board and the reminders are plentiful. As far as the life I have, I'd say trolling the ZS forum for reasons to get pissed or dredge up threads that are multiple years dead must be so much more rewarding. Feel free to PM me anytime, friend.

X's and O's, Kabong.

The thing that irks me about that is this. What is illegal one place may not necessarily be illegal in another place. I was called out a year ago about a feral cat thread and given a warning because I advised that I had, in fact, shot feral cats(pretty much the reason I stopped giving a crap about regularly posting and being helpful). It was ASSUMED that I had done this in my current locale, where there were no such laws, but it was never ASKED. I just received a warning out of the blue on it because people had reported my post.

So just saying "That's illegal!" isn't good enough when it's not an across the board type thing. :?
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Re: lockpicks

Post by Kabong30 » Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:57 am

elricfate wrote:The thing that irks me about that is this. What is illegal one place may not necessarily be illegal in another place. I was called out a year ago about a feral cat thread and given a warning because I advised that I had, in fact, shot feral cats(pretty much the reason I stopped giving a crap about regularly posting and being helpful). It was ASSUMED that I had done this in my current locale, where there were no such laws, but it was never ASKED. I just received a warning out of the blue on it because people had reported my post.

So just saying "That's illegal!" isn't good enough when it's not an across the board type thing. :?

I totally understand what you're saying. I think for my own part I wouldn't WANT to discuss things that might be considered illegal within my jurisdiction simply for the fact that it could come around and bite me in the ass later on in the real world.

From the situation you described maybe your treatment was unfair, I don't know. But on this topic it's pretty clear that the majority of places frown on people toting lock-picking tools around and honestly, while it's fine to say "I want to pick my own locks" from a "cover your ass" perspective, and some people may really pursue it as a hobby, fine, awesome, but on THIS forum, in the context of the things that are normally discusses (PAW/ZPAW) the likelihood that these newly acquired skills/tools would only be applied to a hobby is probably very low, and in addition to their being a rule against the discussion of illegal activity, there is a rule against discussing looting, etc. and the methods thereof (right?)
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