Patriotism witch trials. Have to prove your love of country

Discuss those "what if" or "what would you do" scenarios you've been wondering about.

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Patriotism witch trials. Have to prove your love of country

Post by thepaleman » Sun Nov 23, 2008 10:57 am

Your pick the people conducting the trials. It can be anything from a Military coup to alien take over. The people asking the questions doesn't matter.

The facts are;
A police state has ensued with marshal law in place. There is a complete curfew. No-one is aloud to leave there homes.
You here the odd crack of rifle fire outside and you have seen bodies from your window. Or if you live remote enough you've seen house's torched. These events are all followed by loudspeaker announcements from helicopters, rooftops, humvees, etc declaring someone broke the curfew.
The means and methods of containment are unknown. The measures taken though are clearly excessive.
(lone wolf guys running about in the woods is great but not what I'm asking about here)
People who need medical attention are seen in there homes or taken away.
Food, water and other supplies are daily delivered by "trustees".
There's no means of outside communication, radios, cell, tv, etc are all inoperative.
The loudspeakers announce the upcoming trials.
No information is given on what happens if you pass or fail the test, but you know you need to pass.

Any rumors you hear through the walls or neighbors shouting across the road is backed up by other contradicting rumors.
You are in the dark as to what is happening. Your with your household.

I'm more interested in what you prepare to say to prove your patriotism. Not how you would dig a tunnel and hide out in the woods, I get that's a patriotic act.
I'm interested as to what people from other countries would say as well.

(If this is too political a thread then my bad, it's not meant to be.)
( I searched on this topic and didn't find anything sensible)
Soon I'll be asking the old old old often asked questions about pistols...USP, P226(very sexy), SR9 (sexy), Glock 17, 92fs, FN9 etc and ammo choice (but not caliber, I want a 9mm so I can practice more)....

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by AmirMortal » Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:33 am

I think that's the problem with witch trials, or inquisitions. How do you prove to someone who doesn't believe you from the outset, that you are _X_ (Patriot, Converted Christian, Gleeful Mormon, Gov. lap dog). I was born in this country, grew up here, was a boy scout here, live and work here, but I seem to have misplaced my "Paperz". The closest thing I can think of would be to present my Passport.

I somehow don't think that being a Vet with Military ID would even be a get out of jail free card.

Interestingly, I saw on the news recently where this senator decided that there needed to be an inquest to establish if her fellow senators "were actually Pro-America"....SCARY!


P.S. GIMMEE EAT!
Last edited by AmirMortal on Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Boris » Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:36 am

.45 ACP means never having to say you're sorry.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by AmirMortal » Sun Nov 23, 2008 12:24 pm

Joseph Heller - Catch - 22 wrote:Milo carefully said not hing when Major-deCoverley stepped into the mess hall with his
fierce and austere dignity t he day he returned and found his way blocked by a wall of
officers waiting in line to sign loyalty oaths. At t he far end of t he food count er , a group
of men who had arrived earlier were pledging allegiance to the flag, with trays of food
balanced in one hand, in order to be allowed to take seat s at the table. Already at the
tables, a group that had arrived still earlier was singing ’The Star-Spangled Banner’ in
order that t hey might use the salt and pepper and ketchup there. The hubbub began to
subside slowly as Major-deCoverley paused in the doorway with a frown of puzzled
disapproval, as though viewing something bizarre. He started forward in a straight line,
and the wall of officers before him parted like the Red Sea. Glancing neither left nor
right , he strode indomitably up to the steam counter and, in a clear , full-bodied voice
that was gruff with age and resonant with ancient eminence and authority, said:
’Gimme eat .’
Instead of eat , Corporal Snark gave Major-deCoverley a loyalty oath to sign. Major-deCoverley swept it away with mighty displeasure the moment he recognized what it was,
his good eye flaring up blindingly with fiery disdain and his enormous old corrugated face
darkening in mountainous wrath.
’Gimme eat , I said,’ he ordered loudly in harsh tones that rumbled ominously through the
silent tent like claps of distant thunder .


Corporal Snark turned pale and began to tremble. He glanced toward Milo pleadingly for
guidance. For several terrible seconds there was not a sound. Then Milo nodded.
’Give him eat ,’ he said.
Corporal Snark began giving Major-deCoverley eat . Major-deCoverley turned from
the counter with his tray full and came to a stop. His eyes fell on the groups of other
officers gazing at him in mute appeal, and, with righteous belligerence, he roared:
’Give everybody eat !’
’Give everybody eat !’ Milo echoed with joyful relief , and the Glorious Loyalty Oath
Crusade came t o an end.
Could it really be that easy? History doesn't seem to think so. I hope we never find out.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Wolfdude87 » Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:32 pm

I mean what could you really do? Just put on your favorite sports jersey and have a hotdog/apple pie in hand when they knock :lol: . But seriously, if they don't tell you what they're looking for then you don't know how to prepare. My strategy would be not to embelish anything or try too hard to impress them, if you're not what they're looking for they'll either see it and leave you be or they'll kill you no matter what.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Y.T. » Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:48 pm

puhleeze. The day I have to "prove" my patriotism is the day I either join the resistance or move to Australia.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by bae » Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:50 pm

thepaleman wrote: The facts are;
A police state has ensued with marshal law in place.
The fact is, it's spelled "martial" law. Learn why, go read Ex parte Milligan, then come back to us with your scenario...

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by thepaleman » Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:14 pm

I see none of you want to play along with this one then?
bae wrote:
thepaleman wrote: The facts are;
A police state has ensued with marshal law in place.
The fact is, it's spelled "martial" law. Learn why, go read Ex parte Milligan, then come back to us with your scenario...
The fact is I was thinking of Marshall law the character and made a spelling mistake. I read what it says in wikepedia/Brittanica about ex parte milligan/Martial law. Do I need to read more for you to consider the scenario?

The basic premise is you have to prove your patriotism, how would you do this. Simple enough.

I've had a few weird conversations with people about patriotism and wanted some other perspectives. So I wrapped it in a scenario.
Last edited by thepaleman on Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Soon I'll be asking the old old old often asked questions about pistols...USP, P226(very sexy), SR9 (sexy), Glock 17, 92fs, FN9 etc and ammo choice (but not caliber, I want a 9mm so I can practice more)....

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Ad'lan » Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:20 pm

I'm sorta, kinda in the army right now (TA Section B OTC, part time, and non deployable).

So I hope that helps. On the Other hand, I'm technically part of a minority which hasn't exactly been popular historically (hell, one of the major works of the Inquesition was ferreting out the Marrano's). And Although not Religious that way anymore, I didn't take my oath of alligence on the New testament (Someone did ask if they had a Physics Textbook ;) ).

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Pondo_Sinatra » Sun Nov 23, 2008 5:23 pm

When I read "Witch Trails" in the subject line, I initially thought it was like a ghost walk, and the "patriotism" reference confused me.

If my military service, always-carried copy of the Constitution, and clean criminal record aren't enough, I'm screwed.

My concern is that my ownership of firearms could be misconstrued by the "wrong" sort of people.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by bonanacrom » Sun Nov 23, 2008 5:37 pm

if your scenario played out exactly as you put it then my answer isn't what you would want. I would never make it to any trial, if I cant bug out like you put in the scenario then I would dig in and make them come in and take me out in a bag. Glorious Battle ! I don't have a family to worry about so I'd go out with some fun.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Chantrea » Sun Nov 23, 2008 6:09 pm

I guess it would depend on who's asking.

But to be honest, if someone's asking for "proof" to begin with, then they already have the answer in their mind and they're not going to let anything you say change it.

In general, "antipatriot-hunts" aren't about patriotism at all. Ever. It's about coming up with excuses for the state to eliminate people who it already sees as undesirable, and that's always going to be because of some OTHER reason than something as nebulous as whether or not you love your country.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by ironraven » Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:40 pm

I've never had to prove that I'm a patriot, and I'm not sure that one can. That is like proving a point about theology- you can't prove an intangible.

If someone is holding these witch hunts, they already have a list of the guilty and this is just a proforma before the concentration camp or the firing squad. We've seen them before. We'll see them again. Fuck it, there is nothing you can do if you are the list except decide if you want to kiss the "judge's" ass and go to a labor camp, or piss him off enough that he just liquidates you himself right there. And if someone wants you on the list, they'll find a reason.

Coincidentally enough, my car book right now is 1984, my work book is 451 Fahrenheit, and my bed book is Blacklisted by History, which is about the McCarthy inquisition.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by naegling62 » Sun Nov 23, 2008 8:02 pm

What date is it I'm thinkin' about......remember, remember the 5th of November, the gun powder treason and plot. I know of no reason why the gun powder treason should ever be forgot. :mrgreen:
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by thepaleman » Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:38 pm

I see I'm not the only one struggling with how do you prove patriotism. I agree with what a few of you said about the perspective of the questioner. If they want you to be guilty they'll ask the right questions.
ironraven wrote:I've never had to prove that I'm a patriot, and I'm not sure that one can. That is like proving a point about theology- you can't prove an intangible.
Coincidentally enough, my car book right now is 1984, my work book is 451 Fahrenheit, and my bed book is Blacklisted by History, which is about the McCarthy inquisition.
Have to guess you like Kurt vonnegut as well?

I think: am I patriotic because I pay taxes or if I try to screw the tax system,
if I help my fellow american or try to get them before they get me,
born here a better qualification than an immigrant who took a test,
the amouunt of flags I fly,
the type of car I drive,
my belief in the constitution,
........

Personally I belive in the American spirit but can barely define it without contradicting myself somewhere sooner or later. Then other things arn't so much patriotism as compassion or feelings that are common to us all, worldwide.
If I was put up there, then I'd have to state my absolute faith in the American spirit. I couldn't define it and I'm constantly confronted with things that challenge the whole notion but that's the best thing I could say.

Pretty ducking lame as well, if my life depended on it.
Soon I'll be asking the old old old often asked questions about pistols...USP, P226(very sexy), SR9 (sexy), Glock 17, 92fs, FN9 etc and ammo choice (but not caliber, I want a 9mm so I can practice more)....

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Wolfdude87 » Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:00 am

Different groups have had their patriotism challenged over time, I think we all remember what many middle eastern people went through after 9/11 just dealing with their fellow americans. The fact of the matter is if you're having to prove your patriotism then someone is challenging wether or not you have any. It's a bad situation to start with and if it got to the point where the government really made us all prisoners in our own homes as they went around "testing" our patriotism I'd probably jump the fence to mexico.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by MacAttack » Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:30 am

Bleed them!!!!



If its ALL true American Red blood then they are good. If not, then so what at that point.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Impus » Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:43 am

Y.T. wrote:puhleeze. The day I have to "prove" my patriotism is the day I either join the resistance or move to Australia.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by MJS8725 » Mon Nov 24, 2008 3:00 am

naegling62 wrote:What date is it I'm thinkin' about......remember, remember the 5th of November, the gun powder treason and plot. I know of no reason why the gun powder treason should ever be forgot. :mrgreen:
Indeed.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by DFWMTX » Mon Nov 24, 2008 3:59 pm

I'll just question the judges first.

"How do I know *you're* American enough? I haven't seen your driver's licesne, Social Security card, US passport, picture of you shaking hands with your state representitive, eating apple pie, etc...."
It can always get worse.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by andygates » Mon Nov 24, 2008 4:59 pm

At which point they lock you up for being a smartass.

And I salute you. And then join you.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by DFWMTX » Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:12 pm

Also, be prepared to come back with a retort if they do produce any of that stuff.

"You can buy fake driver's licenses, Social Security cards, US passports like any illiegal immigrant with $200."

"That's photoshopped. You just put your head on top of someone else's body."

and finally....

"How do I know that's apple pie? Let me taste some of that...."
It can always get worse.

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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by Abacus » Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:14 pm

By that time I hope I'll already have fled the country.

I refused to take the Pledge in school; rather than take the Oath to join the service, I was going to join the service of another country. I'm not a patriot, I never have been and I'm likely too old to change now.

So, my only choices are either have to have fled or be shot.
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Re: Patriotism witch trails. Have to prove your love of country

Post by TheGunslinger » Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:16 pm

Welp, speaking as a representative of this vast land down under - if it gets that bad, you're all welcome at my place.
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