Bullets to Zeds per city.

[ApolloFrost]

So here's a question, or more like a random musing. My home city has 152,000 people. I have over 2k rounds. There has to be at least 100 other people with as much ammo, if not more. If there were a zombie incident people like me would hang out on our rooftops popping Zeds till the undead population was thinned then search and destroy the rest. I can't help but think that there are just too many bullets to people for a zombie incident to really wipe out society.

[MaconCJ7]

Going with the assumption that the only non-zeds are you and your 100 other guys. Round numbers are easy, so let's say and even 100 of you guys because one guy fell off his roof. You guys kick back and redead the 151,900 zeds in the city. Or, for funsies, you 100 folk, plus 100 significant others, plus 2 kids each. There's 400 of you now. Say 600 other folks magically didn't turn. There is now 1000 of you. 0.6% of your town lived. I think that counts as society being wiped out. But, for the sake of argument and because it's likely more accurate, your town of 152,000 has roughly 45% homes with guns. So for the sake of easiness, lets say that 45% of households equals 45% of the population. So there's 68,400 gun wielding defenders of freedom. Law of statistics says well over 90% of those will have no formal firearms training, much less move and shoot. That 90% will shoot themselves or each other because that's what the left says will happen. The remaining 6,840 will fight the good fight. Averaging most zombie movies, 10 people will live. All those other numbers were really just for fun and games. So, 10 people out of 152,000 live through the outbreak. At least initially. 0.006% survival rate. Society is dead.

But pretend for a minute that the 68,400 armed citizens were all John Rambo and trained up for shoot move communicate, and the rest of the town picked flowers hugged each other. That's an automatic 55% loss. Society may not be wiped out, but it will forever be changed with a scar so deep, that it can't honestly be described as the same society anymore.

The sad honesty is that if a biological war of large scale was played out in any country in the world, the initial death rate would be so high that society in of itself would collapse so quickly that you thought hell really had frozen over. Now, if that biological war was of a scale as to have a mutating virus that was no longer able to be contained, infection could possibly spread fast enough to bring the plague to an international level. And it could do it quickly. Especially if the incubation period was several months and there were no signs of carrying the virus while simultaneously transmitting it to those you came in contact with. By the time folks started getting sick, it would be too late for a vaccination because everyone would already be carriers. Then we all die.

To summarize, wash your hands before each meal.

[SaikoPureya]

Well I have come to a conclusion that I will be hanging out with OP in the soon to be zombie armageddon.

[AUA]

So here's a question, or more like a random musing. My home city has 152,000 people. I have over 2k rounds. There has to be at least 100 other people with as much ammo, if not more. If there were a zombie incident people like me would hang out on our rooftops popping Zeds till the undead population was thinned then search and destroy the rest. I can't help but think that there are just too many bullets to people for a zombie incident to really wipe out society.

You might have 2k rounds. A decent amount of gunowners shoot recreationally, and only have about 500 rounds on tap. And like Macon said, most of those are, in turn, untrained.

At the same time, people 'like you' who have prepared are unlikely to actively expend ammunition in a communal fashion; I put a WWYD scenario up, with all the preps necessary for ZS-level survival, and pretty much every answer was, 'leave the stragglers to their own devices'. Not saying that that's wrong, but that's what it comes down to.

You're also not accounting for zombie response to gunfire; not everyone who owns a gun gets a $200 tax stamp for a silencer (much less the cost of the silencer itself). With more inexpensive guns, the cost of registering and purchasing a silencer can actually exceed the cost of the actual firearm and some amount of ammunition. If zombies swarm anyone firing a gun in their immediate area, only the most fortified locations would have people sniping at them.

And, you're also not accounting for runoff; your city and surrounding area might have just enough ammunition to handle its population, but what about other areas that have been completely overrun, like say, your district?

If your district were completely done for, retaking your city wouldn't mean much, because eventually, more zombies would simply move in to replace them, with no ammo replenishment; once you've handled the next 50,000 (assuming that all 100 are trained and are willing to expand all ammunition for zed disposal, even any reserves that would normally be used for social work), that's it.

Even if you assume 3k or 4k, there's millions of people, cumulatively, in each state.

[Doctorr Fabulous]

Do I stock ammo? Yes. I also stock food, water, and other supplies. You can't eat bullets. Also, in my experience, avoidance is a better plan than letting yourself be enseiged.

[RickOShea]

Get a fall arrest harness that you can attach to a strong point on your roof, some good ear-pro, food, water, toilet paper, shelter from the elements and adequate clothing for the season, so you can get some rest and nourishment between "duck shoots".

Your hit percentage is going to go down drastically if you're fatigued.

[Braxton]

Well I have come to a conclusion that I will be hanging out with OP in the soon to be zombie armageddon.

Wrong attitude to have,

You want to be the guy that HAS all the preps in place before SHTF. Not a mooch that need to hang with better prepared people.

This means Food and water, medical supplies as well as guns and ammo.

[ApolloFrost]

Gunfire draws zombies? I'm counting on it. It draws them to me and away from unarmed people. I'm really more worried about them piling up against the walls of my house and the rest of the horde climbing over them like steps.

As for most people only having 500 rounds, even if they only made 1 out of 5 count they would still kill 100 zombies. If they get killed their guns and ammo are still available to the next schmuck. You also might underestimate the sheer quantity of ammo that some people in the area have stockpiled, scary people who know how to shoot and move. Not that you would really need to move much. What with zombies being such slow moving targets and the accuracy of modern firearms. I know that my friends and I bought up everything we could afford when we were afraid that AB962 was going to ban all mail ordering of handgun ammo in Cali.

If people made an effort they could wipe out the zombies in a matter of days. Besides, in a typical one bite and you're dead scenario gun owners would start shooting zombies well before they even infected a quarter of the population. Hell, we would have fun doing it. We would make it into a competition. Movies assume that nobody has ever heard of zombies and the average shooter only has one box of ammo. In this modern age it would just take one tweet or text message and it would be game on. The zombie apocalypse would never reach critical mass. We would be playing mop up before the utilities shut off.

+1 on Braxton's comment. Water filtration, food, medicine are much more important things to spend your money on than guns and ammo. Still buy guns, because guns are awesome. But in SHTF I'd trade any one of my weapons for a stove and a water filter. But I won't have to, because I've already got them.

[ApolloFrost]

Well I have come to a conclusion that I will be hanging out with OP in the soon to be zombie armageddon.

Hey man, if you happen to be in Cali when SHTF I'd be glad to have you. You load while I shoot and we'll switch off. I've got a pretty killer portable grill we can drag up with us. Nothin like fun in the sun.

[nathat]

Gunfire draws zombies? I'm counting on it. It draws them to me and away from unarmed people. I'm really more worried about them piling up against the walls of my house and the rest of the horde climbing over them like steps.

As for most people only having 500 rounds, even if they only made 1 out of 5 count they would still kill 100 zombies. If they get killed their guns and ammo are still available to the next schmuck. You also might underestimate the sheer quantity of ammo that some people in the area have stockpiled, scary people who know how to shoot and move. Not that you would really need to move much. What with zombies being such slow moving targets and the accuracy of modern firearms. I know that my friends and I bought up everything we could afford when we were afraid that AB962 was going to ban all mail ordering of handgun ammo in Cali.

If people made an effort they could wipe out the zombies in a matter of days. Besides, in a typical one bite and you're dead scenario gun owners would start shooting zombies well before they even infected a quarter of the population. Hell, we would have fun doing it. We would make it into a competition. Movies assume that nobody has ever heard of zombies and the average shooter only has one box of ammo. In this modern age it would just take one tweet or text message and it would be game on. The zombie apocalypse would never reach critical mass. We would be playing mop up before the utilities shut off.

Indubitably, my good sir and/or madam. on Braxton's comment. Water filtration, food, medicine are much more important things to spend your money on than guns and ammo. Still buy guns, because guns are awesome. But in SHTF I'd trade any one of my weapons for a stove and a water filter. But I won't have to, because I've already got them.

"All aboard the fantasy train! CHOO CHOO!"

I can understand you enjoy shooting, and the thought of getting to shoot zombies seems fun to you. But you're being very unrealistic here and silly. Of course, we're talking about zombies so who am I kidding .

[polliedes]

Certain areas will have more trained and prepared people than others. In my AO there are definitely way more guns than people, but like was mentioned before, most gun owners have no real training. Also remember that all misses go somewhere and modern dwellings offer about as much protection as a newspaper. Then, all of those people would need to have other supplies to back up their ammo. Food is not as big as issue as water. The average household can make their food last for 30 days, but will be lucky to have 2 days of water. This creates a case where you may become a target for other survivors.

And most importantly, we can not forget how fragile society really is.

[TacticalZombieTeam]

You do of course have to consider that most if not all of your friends and you might not be trained with a firearm. And when you have a big group of people, most of them have the tendency to hide bite marks or any sign of infection thus putting you all in danger.

[wamba]

And when you have a big group of people, most of them have the tendency to hide bite marks or any sign of infection thus putting you all in danger.

And that is why I'm trying to start up a gun club/nudist colony. Careful of the hot brass.

[polliedes]

And that is why I'm trying to start up a gun club/nudist colony. Careful of the hot brass.

LOL

[Sckitzo]

And when you have a big group of people, most of them have the tendency to hide bite marks or any sign of infection thus putting you all in danger.

And that is why I'm trying to start up a gun club/nudist colony. Careful of the hot brass.

Stealing this idea for when I become king of my trashpile.

[Mstrkage]

After you expend all that ammo killing zeds what do you have left to fend off those who didn't prep? After the breakout you'll probably wish you had saved a few rounds to help with maintaining order in what might be a very lawless community. One 2k round dump into the heads of a bunch of zombies might be a hell of an afternoon. But having nothing left to defend yourself in the months or years to come is going to suck.

[ApolloFrost]

Who said anything about expending all my ammo? The 2k is just what I have on hand in 5.56 FMJ, which if I had to bug out I'd be leaving behind anyways. I can only comfortably carry 200rds of 5.56, so why bother with my least effective round?

That's all a moot point because we're assuming that everyone except our friends has magically been turned into a zombie. Patient zero bites someone, patient zero gets brought down. Patient zero's victims turn and bite people, patient zero's victims get brought down. How long before someone puts 2 and 2 together and tweets that it's zombies we're dealing with? Not very long. We're not talking about thousands of zombies at ground zero, we're talking about hundreds.

But it's all fantasy. In real life I'm just a Buddhist recreational shooter that likes to buy in bulk. I don't even hunt. That's why I've got a fantasy zombie plan and several realistic earthquake, flood, terrorist attack emergency plans.

[RickOShea]

In The Walking Dead graphic novels everyone has the virus. You don't have to "get bit" to turn. Everyone who dies, except from brain trauma, is reanimated.

So put that in yer pipe and smoke it.

[nathat]

Who said anything about expending all my ammo? The 2k is just what I have on hand in 5.56 FMJ, which if I had to bug out I'd be leaving behind anyways. I can only comfortably carry 200rds of 5.56, so why bother with my least effective round?

That's all a moot point because we're assuming that everyone except our friends has magically been turned into a zombie. Patient zero bites someone, patient zero gets brought down. Patient zero's victims turn and bite people, patient zero's victims get brought down. How long before someone puts 2 and 2 together and tweets that it's zombies we're dealing with? Not very long. We're not talking about thousands of zombies at ground zero, we're talking about hundreds.

But it's all fantasy. In real life I'm just a Buddhist recreational shooter that likes to buy in bulk. I don't even hunt. That's why I've got a fantasy zombie plan and several realistic earthquake, flood, terrorist attack emergency plans.

yeah, but unlucky for you it started at the local gun rally and all the people with 2k + ammunition are the ones who were turned. Now there is hardly anyone left to fight. We all die.

[ApolloFrost]

Or... it could start at a Jersey Shore rally and the poor zombies die of starvation.

What can I say, I'm an optimist.

[AK47Heaven]

Ok here is my personal scenario, I live in a town with 5,000 zombies in it.Assuming I had 10k .22LR, and adequate food and water to survive for several months, couldn't I sit on my roof and pick off Zeds at my leisure and allow the gunfire to draw more?I would be inaccessible and in that caliber 10k is definitely realistic.Almost like the scene from Dawn of the Dead where Andy is shooting celebrity look alikes from his roof.Two or three people with scoped .22s putting in full days could eliminate hundreds even thousands.

Am I wrong?

[elricfate]

Ok here is my personal scenario, I live in a town with 5,000 zombies in it.Assuming I had 10k .22LR, and adequate food and water to survive for several months, couldn't I sit on my roof and pick off Zeds at my leisure and allow the gunfire to draw more?I would be inaccessible and in that caliber 10k is definitely realistic.Almost like the scene from Dawn of the Dead where Andy is shooting celebrity look alikes from his roof.Two or three people with scoped .22s putting in full days could eliminate hundreds even thousands.

Am I wrong?

You're not wrong. But your logic is flawed. You can put down as many as you want, but there are a few things you're not thinking of. One, they will pile up, and as they pile up, they will amble up the pile, putting themselves closer and closer to you. Two, without an inhibitor like pain, they constantly work at full strength, which means the walls of your home, even if poured concrete or block, will eventually shatter and break. Three, a .22lr is not a handy dandy dead as a doornail hit it in the head killshot like most would love for you to believe. Four, the sheer amount of chemicals and gasses given off by a single decaying body is enough to make you sick, but hundreds? Or thousands?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decomposition -- look at it. You'll see what I mean.

[AK47Heaven]

Ok here is my personal scenario, I live in a town with 5,000 zombies in it.Assuming I had 10k .22LR, and adequate food and water to survive for several months, couldn't I sit on my roof and pick off Zeds at my leisure and allow the gunfire to draw more?I would be inaccessible and in that caliber 10k is definitely realistic.Almost like the scene from Dawn of the Dead where Andy is shooting celebrity look alikes from his roof.Two or three people with scoped .22s putting in full days could eliminate hundreds even thousands.

Am I wrong?

You're not wrong. But your logic is flawed. You can put down as many as you want, but there are a few things you're not thinking of. One, they will pile up, and as they pile up, they will amble up the pile, putting themselves closer and closer to you. Two, without an inhibitor like pain, they constantly work at full strength, which means the walls of your home, even if poured concrete or block, will eventually shatter and break. Three, a .22lr is not a handy dandy dead as a doornail hit it in the head killshot like most would love for you to believe. Four, the sheer amount of chemicals and gasses given off by a single decaying body is enough to make you sick, but hundreds? Or thousands?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decomposition -- look at it. You'll see what I mean.

Yeah that would definitely smell like shit.

I guess the zombies win again.

[Malleolus]

OP, my argument to you is this: How many people are trained to shoot at as small a target as the head, much less for the fatal t area? Out of 100 rounds, you will possibly drop 5 zombies with fatal shots. People train to shoot center mass, where it could kill normal people to score a hit in the heart, liver, etc.

It's not a matter of people not knowing how to shoot, it the matter of people not knowing how to train to shoot. As aforementioned, you can easily scoot and shoot and with a little training and score most your hits center mass, because you training is centered at hitting as large a target as the human trunk. If people took the time to train at shooting as small a target as the head portrait at the range, rather than a portrait of a human, your statistics would fair much better. Most the US is good against human invaders, but not zombies.

On a related note, the reason the Japanese didn't head north and invade several of the harbors on the west coast of the US is for this very reason. They said, after the war, that they simply couldn't out gun the number of people who live on the west coast whom own guns. They'd have been wiped out well before they could do any serious damage.

Edit: That being WWII after their attack on Pearl Harbor