Airsoft and muscle memory

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winter521
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Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by winter521 » Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:33 pm

I sort of started thinking about this after Regular Guys thread on practice. I'm 19 so pistols are a nogo right now but I can do airsoft pistols. What do you guys think about trying out different airsoft replicas, finding a comfy one, and using that to trian with and get pistol basics as well as muscle memory? I do already have an airsoft 1911 but its been more for mesing around with as its a springer. For this purpose I was consdering a real steel model with blowback for more realism and realistic round counts in the magazine. The only downside I see is the recoil wouldnt be there but it does give me almost two years to build muscle memory for handling. Any problems with any of this? Thanks

I also realize the durability of the gun factors in but I dont plan on being particulary rough or abusive with it. Sorry for the longish post
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by USMCSergeant » Sat Mar 24, 2012 11:15 pm

You could practice your stance, grip, draw, speed reload, and admin reloads.

Firing a real pistol will be completely different. Recoil obviously, trigger feel and weight, also I'm not sure if airsoft pistol triggers have a reset.

All of that said it couldn't hurt. Do you know any responsible 21+ year olds that will let you shoot their handguns? With airsoft practice and also occasionally shooting the real thing it could be helpful.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by rburch » Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:03 am

I just recently purchased the KWA Adaptive Training Pistol.

It's green gas blowback, and aside from recoil, trigger feel, and weight it operates almost exactly like a Glock 17.

To answer your question it does have trigger reset.

The slide locks back after the last round, it fits Glock 17 holsters, and an old XD paddle holster I had laying around.

As for training it would be good for presentation from the holster, and basic grip, sight alignment, etc.

But the lack of recoil limits it as the only form of practice.

The other place it comes in handy is letting you practice more advanced things like Unorthodox Shooting Positions, and Extreme Close Quarters Shooting. It lets you practice the techniques at much less risk than trying them for real.

If you have friends, it also allows you to do force on force. I'm hoping to run a few knife vs gun drills with my little brother myself.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by winter521 » Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:16 am

I would think the steel construction would handle the weight issue but maybe not quite. At the moment Ive got one friend who might let me shoot so Ill ask. Thanks for the input.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by FrANkNstEin » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:12 am

As for weight: You could see if you can get some lead in there to make it heavier and more close to original weight, although weight distribution might be off.

You are 19. You could always have a Family member GIFT you a handgun as far as i understand your laws.

It must be a Gift to you though, if you give, say, your dad the money to buy you a Glock 19, that´d be a straw purchase and that is illegal!!

But if he gifts you one for your birthday, that´d be ok AFAIK. You might or might not be able to purchase handgun ammunition in your state at your age though.


ETA: check your local laws though, maybe in a home state forum to make sure this is also true for Connecticut.

ETA2: Also check out your local laws for face to face purchases. The 21 years age limit might only matter if you purchase from an FFL but it could be legal for you to buy a pistol at age 19 from a private party.

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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by jackal556 » Thu May 31, 2012 7:30 pm

Years back, I bought the airsoft version of my P99 so that my friends and I could play around with them and destroy stuff in his living room. A couple of years ago, I dug out my airsoft pistol and sticky target and started playing with it in the garage. Then I started drawing, aiming, and taking quick shots. Before, I had been horrible at drawing and shooting. With the airsoft version, I became faster and more accurate. I was really impressed. Weight was different though.

Just my experience.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by RoneKiln » Sat Jun 23, 2012 7:18 pm

Near half a lifetime ago I got my CPL and practiced drawing from my holster for hours. I became quite comfortable with it and for some reason failed to keep up on that practice. Not too long ago I got a new holster as a gift that I prefer over my old one. Recently I decided to do some draw and fire exercises at the range. It was horrible. Between going for so long without practicing my draw and the slight difference in holster I couldn't effectively draw and fire in anywhere near the time I need to. If I don't have warning of a threat I will not be able to react quickly enough for my pistol to be of any use.

So don't be too down on the use of training with an airsoft gun. I highly recommend using it to practice your draw and getting on target quickly. That is an incredibly valuable skill that I am sorely missing right now.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by jeepinbandtrider » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:51 am

I use airsoft replicas of my rifle and pistol (M4 type all metal and KWA ATP pistol). I'm able to use the same gear I'd wear when using my real steel weapons and it's fun to boot. Generally you don't get to shoot back and forth at each other in a force on force type of engagement unless the training you are using is using airsoft or simunitions.

I'm involved with the North Texas Airsoft community and it's a great way to get out and get some trigger time and field time with you gear and find out how it's actually going to function.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by KentsOkay » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:26 am

Roughly the same boat as the OP, sadly any airsoft/bb/pellet versions of the gun I want (SP2022) seem to have an astounding lack of spare magazines. Screw that noise. I'm going to buy a $40 S&W M&P C02 BB gun that takes metal mags while I wait for a green gas/blowback/functions like the real thing Sig SP2022 comes on to the market. Or maybe not. Real Sig, $350, $40 mags. Green gas full metal airsoft Sig, $150, $40ish mags.

Who knows, maybe I'll fall in love with the feel of the M&P. I'm guessing most of the weight is in the grip? I want to add weight to mine to get it to a fully loaded weight.
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by Probie » Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:06 pm

OP what state are you in?

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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by jeepinbandtrider » Sun Jul 29, 2012 7:03 pm

OP's location is listed as being in Conneticut (SP?)

By the way what's up JMB? I'm Downs on DFWMustangs :awesome:
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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by Probie » Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:33 am

What's up man. The reason I ask is that at least in Texas you can legally own a handgun at 18, there are two ways it can legally be attained. Either gifted by a relative, or you can purchase in a private sale from a person without a ffl.

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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by Probie » Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:16 pm

Definitely not as much hazing here lol

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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by deadcrow » Sat Sep 01, 2012 5:43 am

Provided you're getting one that's equivalent, I think they're great. You can do all of your fundamentals with them, and it's a helluva lot cheaper than live ammo. :)

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Re: Airsoft and muscle memory

Post by Jsimmonsgr » Sat Sep 01, 2012 10:20 am

I don't know if anyone else posted this but....... There was a competetive shooter from Japan, Tatsuya Sakai, Won a shooting match after training with nothing but airsoft. Here is the article from Dillon Precision, the part about airsoft is in red.


Dillon's Blue Press -- January 2005
The big question all week was whether K.C. Eusebio would be able to repeat his spectacular last year’s win of the Steel Challenge match. Going up against the acknowledged masters of the speed-shooting world (Rob Leathem, Todd Jarrett, Doug Koenig, and Jerry Miculek, to name only a few) the fifteen-year-old wunderkind had blazed past everyone last year to claim the title. But you know how it is with boys - they get older. They lose their edge. They find girls. “So you’ve been practicing a lot?” “Nah,” he said. “Well, I shot a couple of rounds.”

Oh, sure. I play golf like that, too. No stress, no pressure. Just one little hole at a time.

The Steel Challenge has been around since Mike Dalton and Mike Fichman combined forces in 1981. Its format is deceptively simple: there are seven stages, each of which have five steel plates arranged on them in various configurations at distances from six yards to forty yards. All you have to do is shoot five timed runs at each stage. Five chances at each stage? Ayup. That’s not really very hard, and the judges will even help you improve your time by throwing out your slowest run. Of course, most of the people you’ll be shooting against chew bullets for breakfast, but don’t let that worry you.

K.C. wasn’t worrying. Part of that, I think, is because he’s been around this event since he was little. He began shooting the match in 1998, winning the Pre-Teen Division when he was only ten years old. Two years later, he was one of the “elite” shooters and has been placing handily ever since, so last year wasn’t really a fluke for him -- it was simply a combination of skill, luck, timing, and, although he wasn’t quite admitting it -- a whole lot of practice.

There were competitors from all over the continental U.S. this year, as well as from Canada, England, Australia, and Japan. The Japanese can’t have handguns, which is a drawback, but it’s turned out not to be an insurmountable problem. Think of it rather as an obstacle than a barrier. Do you see the boy in the picture with the unusual stance? That’s Tatsuya Sakai. Since he can’t have a handgun, Tatsuya spent the year training at home in Japan with an air pistol. He came over to California about a month before the match, and put in some time practicing with a real gun on the Steel Challenge ranges to good effect -- he ended up beating K.C.’s time this year by .59 seconds to become the new World Speed Shooting Champion. Yes, that’s point-five-nine, folks -- fifty-nine hundredths of a second. Before that, K.C. and a young man named J.J. Racaza had been neck-and-neck for first place. They ended up second and third, respectively, with only .05 seconds between them. To give you a notion of how fast everyone in the top group were shooting, Max Michel, Jr. was fourth with 68.63 seconds (that’s his total time for a counted score of four best runs at each of seven stages, or twenty-eight runs.) Todd Jarrett was fifth with 69.10 seconds, Rob Leatham had a measly 69.26, Doug Koenig was batting right in there with 70.39, Jerry Miculek was at 71.72, Michael Voigt had 75.03, James Ong had 75.15, JoJo Vidames was eleventh with 76.53, and Tatsuya came in twelfth with 77.26. Twelfth? Wait a minute, I thought Tatsuya was first. He was, yes. He shot the match twice, as many of the competitors did, testing themselves through the stages with two different guns. Tatsuya won the over-all Championship with what’s called an “Open” gun (fancy sights, ports, however you want to trick the gun up) and also came in twelfth with a “Limited” gun, so I think it’s safe to say that his fast shooting wasn’t pure luck! There were side matches, too, and plenty of prizes -- over $300,000 worth, donated by the major (and minor) gun companies. The prizes were split in a variety of ways, determined by category and shooter-ranking, and sometimes by the fickle hand of fate. There were raffles (one enterprising gentleman bought five hundred dollars worth of tickets and, not surprisingly, went home with a large assortment of goods) as well as several lucky-chance drawings. One such drawing I was glad to witness had a competitor from Japan, Takeo Ishii, whose name had been picked from the bowl to receive a handgun. It took Takeo only moments to return with the Japanese interpreter by his side to say that since he couldn’t own a gun in Japan, he wished to give something back to the Steel Challenge as a token of appreciation for the great time he’d had here, and so wanted to donate the gun to the last place competitor. That last place finisher was a man named Merle Ness, who’d been plagued by gun problems throughout the match, but had kept on, nonetheless. It was a very poignant moment -- true détente.

I made a point of talking with and taking pictures of the younger competitors, most there with their dads. Some had shot matches like this before and were already wearing sponsors’ shirts; some, as K.C. once had been, were there to see the famous shooters they’d heard about and admired, or to test their skills, to see if they even liked this type of competition. One of them, about eleven years old, fixed me with a very stern look: “Who do you write for?” “This article’s for the Blue Press.” “Oh, that’s good,” he said, nodding to his dad in approval, “we get that one.” I predict he’ll go far. (Just keep him away from the girls, eh, Dad, and have him shoot a couple of rounds now and then, right? ;)


The reason I use airsoft to train is its fun and I can do it in the house. Plus if you go play in a arena you can get some very mild force on force training without the massive welts and bruises of using Simunitions. Hell, if it works in competition agains the likes of Jerry and Rob? You can bet your ass it works as a training method.
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