NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

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NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by ultra magnus » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:35 pm

I know a lot of people don't like these tiny guns, but what do you think is a better use of space? 5 rounds of 22mag vs 2 rounds of ?. I Imagine the darringer is faster to reload, and you can use shot in some of them. Anyone have any caliber recomendations for a darringer?

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Johnny Bones » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:40 pm

ultra magnus wrote:I know a lot of people don't like these tiny guns, but what do you think is a better use of space? 5 rounds of 22mag vs 2 rounds of ?. I Imagine the darringer is faster to reload, and you can use shot in some of them. Anyone have any caliber recomendations for a darringer?
Depends, what are you going to use it for?

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by ultra magnus » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:43 pm

Johnny Bones wrote:
ultra magnus wrote:I know a lot of people don't like these tiny guns, but what do you think is a better use of space? 5 rounds of 22mag vs 2 rounds of ?. I Imagine the darringer is faster to reload, and you can use shot in some of them. Anyone have any caliber recomendations for a darringer?
Depends, what are you going to use it for?

The lady is thinking about something super small to carry in her purse. I'd like to have something very pocketable as well. I've fired a darringer once that I belive was a .25, but that is all the experience I have firing the smallest of guns. I also like to always consider the usefullness of a weapon in the PAW or survival scenario though, which is why I mentioned shot.

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Johnny Bones » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:50 pm

Have you looked into any small hammerless .38/.357 revolvers? If its for self defense I would definitely avoid a .22. A derringer is definitely small enough for what you'd want, but I've heard they're hard to shoot. I don't have any personal experience with one, so take that with a grain of salt, it may have been comfortable for you to shoot. If you do go the derringer route, I'd suggest something larger than the .25.

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by AKFTW » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:50 pm

ultra magnus wrote:
Johnny Bones wrote:
ultra magnus wrote:I know a lot of people don't like these tiny guns, but what do you think is a better use of space? 5 rounds of 22mag vs 2 rounds of ?. I Imagine the darringer is faster to reload, and you can use shot in some of them. Anyone have any caliber recomendations for a darringer?
Depends, what are you going to use it for?

The lady is thinking about something super small to carry in her purse. I'd like to have something very pocketable as well. I've fired a darringer once that I belive was a .25, but that is all the experience I have firing the smallest of guns. I also like to always consider the usefullness of a weapon in the PAW or survival scenario though, which is why I mentioned shot.
Kel-Tec PF9 with the best hollowpoints you can get. Any less IMO is REALLY REALLY pushing it, and as we have so recently seen, even a 9mm (FMJ i would guess) headshot is survivable. The PF9 is as thin as you can get for an autoloader, and at least it is in the minimum defensive caliber. Give it a look, it is a far better option than a derringer or mini .22lr revolver that you probably can't even aim with it's so small.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by olbaid_dratsab » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:58 pm

I had a Davis derringer in 9mm. I currently have a NAA in 22wmg.

The derringer was noticably heavier and bigger. Even in 9mm, it hurt to shoot. The thing would pretty much jump out of my hand, I never finshed a shot with the same grip as when I started the shot. The trigger was the worst I've ever felt. Maybe it was just mine, but it had to be like 20lbs.

I really really like my NAA. I run with it in the IWB holster tucked into my underwear with my gym shorts tied over top. Like I'll knock out 8-10 miles like this, no shirt and its still concealed. The little $18 slide over rubber grip is great for what the gun is. I wouldn't run with a 9mm derringer like this. The 22 derringers might be on par with weight, but shit, why not just go for the Mini if you're going that small? The mini gives great confidence when I run where dogs may be a problem, and they are mean dogs.

I hate NAA Guardians, but their minies are the heat. I've had three.
1 in 22lr=too weak of a bullet
Black Widow in 22wmg=too big for carrying in situations where IU carry a mini.
Current one in 22wmg is perfect for what I use it for; running gun, gym shorts gun, augment to another gun-gun.

The only complaint I have is when I shoot 22lr out of it (I have 2 cylinders). I get A LOT of light stikes. This has never happened with 22wmg though so thats what I carry in it.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by ultra magnus » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:05 pm

AKFTW wrote:
ultra magnus wrote:
Johnny Bones wrote:
ultra magnus wrote:I know a lot of people don't like these tiny guns, but what do you think is a better use of space? 5 rounds of 22mag vs 2 rounds of ?. I Imagine the darringer is faster to reload, and you can use shot in some of them. Anyone have any caliber recomendations for a darringer?
Depends, what are you going to use it for?

The lady is thinking about something super small to carry in her purse. I'd like to have something very pocketable as well. I've fired a darringer once that I belive was a .25, but that is all the experience I have firing the smallest of guns. I also like to always consider the usefullness of a weapon in the PAW or survival scenario though, which is why I mentioned shot.
Kel-Tec PF9 with the best hollowpoints you can get. Any less IMO is REALLY REALLY pushing it, and as we have so recently seen, even a 9mm (FMJ i would guess) headshot is survivable. The PF9 is as thin as you can get for an autoloader, and at least it is in the minimum defensive caliber. Give it a look, it is a far better option than a derringer or mini .22lr revolver that you probably can't even aim with it's so small.
One of the reasons I am looking this small is I live in Illinois. The only way to carry is unloaded and in a case. When you add a full case to even something as small as the PF9 or LCP it bulks up quite a bit. Anything I carry is going to be ineffecient because I am going to have to uncase it and load it.

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by pyratemime » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:38 pm

If you go the derringer route have you looked at the Bond Arms .45LC option? They are a good chunk of metal but may be worth looking into.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by yossarian » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:59 pm

If you have to start out with a reload then I'd pass on the NAA. I'm sure there's some way to carry the cylinder seperate and scotch tape the rounds in place so they fall out in your pocket but thats about the only solution I could think of.

Stuffing loose rounds two at a time into a derringer isn't my idea of a good time either. The Davis derringer I've handled were just below Hi-points in workmanship. The Bond Arms guns are well made but weigh about as much as larger, more useful guns.

Were I in your position I would opt for a J-frame with speed loader(s) or a small semi-auto with a slide lock. There are very small, thin cases that should hold an LCP or similar with the slide open. Loaded mag goes into the pocket, unloaded gun goes in case and into a fanny pack/purse/maxpedition etc.**

**Disclaimer: It is my understanding that this method is technically legal in Illinois but has not been tested in court.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by tireiron » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:12 pm

What he ^ said.

Unloaded, cased, mini-revolver or two shot derringer in the bottom of a purse is a recipe for fail.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by olbaid_dratsab » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:13 pm

Woe. Yeah that changes everything. I would go for a small magfed. Does the case have to be locked?
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by ultra magnus » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:01 pm

olbaid_dratsab wrote:Woe. Yeah that changes everything. I would go for a small magfed. Does the case have to be locked?
No it does not have to be locked. I don't want to use a fanny pack, or maxpedition or anything along those lines. Dead give away that you are carrying in here in Illinois imo. I spot the old guys carrying this way all the time. I appreciate the suggestions to carry something bigger/better and fully intend to when we move to Colorado in a year or two, but right now these to options are better than nothing to me. Due to the way Illinois forces me to carry I'm not getting a weapon into action very quickly no matter what, I'm not overly concerned about the extra 5 or 10 seconds it would take me to load one of these as opposed to a mag fed gun.

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Fire » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:35 pm

What situation where you need a gun defensively outside your home are you going to have 5-10 extra seconds anyway....
I hate to say this, but in any case where she is going to need a gun, she is screwed, and the bad guy gets a shiny new gun out of the deal- Being able to get the weapon into action is vital, and under these restrictions, I doubt that it is possible, or even likely- It will provide a false sense of security, but that is about it.... Instead, look into anything that is legal, even less than lethal solutions if they are available, because a weapon you can actually USE on a bad guy is generally going to be better than the one that is still in your purse.....There is likely no equal to a firearm, and I am not going to say that there is, but in this case a firearm is possible, but really not viable.... Training with whatever will also be a must, as once again, carrying whatever you go with will not guarantee your safety in any fashion....
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by olbaid_dratsab » Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:25 pm

^yeah. I'd say carry both if feasable. Gun and alternate means.

The fact that you would have to take the time to unzip or whatever would make me care that much more about the extra 5-10 seconds comparing a Mini to magfed in loading.

What I would do is look into getting a custom pocket holster with an easily accessable zipper top. Would that make it considered a case? Shit, I dunno, practice loading then?
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by AKFTW » Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:43 pm

Fuck, that's worse than California! I would say get a Taser honestly. Fumbling with unlocking, unzipping, and loading a handgun will just make the mugger LAUGH at you. If that isn't legal I would try bear spray, or maybe a can of Axe and a lighter. Seems like it would be more effective. :roll:
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Fire » Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:03 am

the problem is that illinois is ridiculously restrictive- IIRC, mace and a taser may not be any more legal than a firearm- though IIRC, wasp and hornet spray is still legal, and WORKS.... though you may want either some documentation or a legit allergy to stings, or some reason for carrying such- if its legal, then don't worry about defending its carry, but its in the courtroom after using it that this may become an issue....
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by AKFTW » Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:06 am

Fire wrote:but its in the courtroom after using it that this may become an issue....
But (insert tired survival cliche here) :wink:
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Jeriah » Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:10 am

I'm pretty sure the Kel-Tec P32 is smaller than many Derringers, and is probably slimmer than an NAA revolver. Have you considered this option?
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by ultra magnus » Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:35 am

Pepper spray is already carried. I also carry a small fixed blade knife, though I know in most scenarios a blade will not do a lot of good. I wouldn't even try to access a cased and unloaded handgun mag fed or not in case of a mugging. There are cases I can think of where it would be nice to have a firearm available even if it is going to take a me 20 seconds to get it into action.

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by tid » Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:57 am

I have a NA Arms .22 mag with the gee whiz fold out grip that covers the trigger when closed. Out of all the pistols I own, this one goes with me about 95% of the time. With the gee whiz fold out grip I can stick in my trouser pocket with only the clip showing, don't have to worry about wearing a shirt or coat over it. In the summer, it works just as well with shorts.

From my experience shooting it at the range, hitting anything with it over 10 yards is pretty wishful. Its a weapon of last resort, and that works for me.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Jeriah » Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:03 am

Will someone please tell me why the COP .357 Derringer is no longer made? That thing seemed sweet as hell.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by gelgoog » Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:03 pm

Jeriah wrote:Will someone please tell me why the COP .357 Derringer is no longer made? That thing seemed sweet as hell.
they had QC problems, were overly heavy and bulky and had a horrible DAO trigger. But they did look sweet :)

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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by Jeriah » Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:46 pm

gelgoog wrote:
Jeriah wrote:Will someone please tell me why the COP .357 Derringer is no longer made? That thing seemed sweet as hell.
they had QC problems, were overly heavy and bulky and had a horrible DAO trigger. But they did look sweet :)
I wonder if someone could make a better, modern version, mechanically maybe a new design but filling the same role. Seems like a job for Kel-Tec.
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Re: NAA 22mag mini revolver vs darringer

Post by 1 With A Bullet » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:56 pm

Jeriah wrote:Will someone please tell me why the COP .357 Derringer is no longer made? That thing seemed sweet as hell.
Having shot one a few years ago, I can tell you that:
1. accuracy was not ideal (difficult to regulate four barrels)
2. the trigger seemed about 18-20 lbs (the owner told me it was considered a 'safety feature' at the time)
3. the grip was designed in such a fashion that the recoil from .38 Specials was tolerable but shooting .357 Magnum [in my case: 158 gr Federal Hi-Shok] was akin to laying your hand palm up on an anvil and pounding it with the round end of a ball peen hammer.

But it did look sweet in Blade Runner and in the Matrix.

As for carrying a derringer for self-defense, the only one that I would ever contemplate carrying would be the Bond Arms. The Bond derringers have rebounding hammers and positive hammer block safeties. Other brands of derringers have safeties that automatically disengage when the hammer is retracted. Yes, that would seem faster but it doesn't take but a small bump on the hammer to cause the auto-disengage safeties to jump out of the way and then (without a rebounding hammer) the hammer rests directly on the firing pin. Another slight bump and you may have an unwanted hole to patch.

Also take into account that derringers are inherently dangerous to load. Because of the hinged action most people hold the derringer completely open by the frame with the barrels on top, pointed down and away to ease loading. Once the chambers are loaded, the tendency is to flip the barrels closed onto the frame. The problem comes when the barrels that were pointed away swing 180 degrees onto the frame only to be pointed at the shooter's head. Without a rebounding hammer, the firing pin protrudes into the frame [unless it's pulled back to the fragile 'safety notch']. If the barrels swing into place with enough force, the pin hits the primer and, again, an unintended hole can appear.
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