SHTF- is there a role for SA pistols AND revolvers?

[foxx]

You can put a light on this one...http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/ ... rrorView_Y

[squinty]

My issue isn't with anyone choosing a revolver. Feel free to limit yourself to 6-8 rounds.

No.

[400 Grains]

You appear to be the troll. I speak from experience, which IS my proof.
From what experience do you speak Mr. Keyboard Warrior???

Well, Mr. 11 years of shooting experience...... I'm your Huckleberry....

40 years. Shooter, hunter, big city cop, multiple gunfight survivor, competitive PPC and IPSC shooter with a bookcase full of trophies, academy instructor, trainer, rangemaster, factory trained armorer for several companies including S&W and Ruger revolvers, long time member of several professional law enforcement weapons related and firearms collector associations, court recognized expert witness, paid consultant for major firearm and ammunition companies.

The best semi automatic pistols, will function longer, and under more adverse conditions, than the best revolvers. Unequivocally.

[Maverick299]

My question is why do you want a weapon mounted light on a handgun for home defense. It's a tactical disadvantage for you the way I see it. Chances are if you need the light it means someone has broken into your house at night while you're asleep. That means your eyes are already adjusted to the dark, you're on home turf and know your house very well, the intruder does not. Turning on a weapon light gives away your position and you forfeit that advantage. Carry a bright ass light in your non weapon hand and turn it on at that critical moment when you have to draw down on the intruder and blind the shit out of him. IMHO handgun mounted lights are completely wrong for home defense. Now mounting one on a shotgun with a pressure switch makes way more sense, quick on, quick off. But giving up your tactical advantage of night adjusted eyes and giving up your position on your home turf seems like a really bad idea to me. Just my opinion.

[squinty]

My question is why do you want a weapon mounted light on a handgun for home defense. It's a tactical disadvantage for you the way I see it. Chances are if you need the light it means someone has broken into your house at night while you're asleep. That means your eyes are already adjusted to the dark, you're on home turf and know your house very well, the intruder does not. Turning on a weapon light gives away your position and you forfeit that advantage. Carry a bright ass light in your non weapon hand and turn it on at that critical moment when you have to draw down on the intruder and blind the shit out of him. IMHO handgun mounted lights are completely wrong for home defense. Now mounting one on a shotgun with a pressure switch makes way more sense, quick on, quick off. But giving up your tactical advantage of night adjusted eyes and giving up your position on your home turf seems like a really bad idea to me. Just my opinion.

I think it has more to do with target ID. Shoot at a dark silhouette, then turn on the light to find it was your teenage son sneaking in or out past curfew = no bueno, and shit like that does happen. I know a lot of people still prefer a separate (non - weapon) light for reasons of muzzle discipline.

Most handgun lights come with "momentary on" capability, just like the tac light carried in the weak hand or mounted on a shotgun.

As far as tactical advantages, I might give up even more tactical advantage than I would by flashing a light. Before he ever gets to the room I'm in, I'd probably yell at the guy to GTFO, or yell that the police are on the way, and give away my position by doing so. If the person is only interested in property, or doesn't have the stomach for an encounter with an awake armed homeowner, with police already en route, then there's a fair chance that he'll bolt, and I'd rather see him do that than have to deal with the fallout from shooting him.

My hallway and foyer have motion activated lights, and so does the exterior of the house, so as long as the power's on there won't be total darkness.

[doc66]

Have you ever been on the wrong end of a light, even a cheap, plastic flash light? The momentary flash can disorient and cause vision loss to the person spotted and enable you as the guy on the other side to make some movement or actions against them in that moment of time. A light is more than just an illumination in the dark, when used correctly, it can also aid in defense.

Why, I ask, would having one on a shotgun be good, and a handgun be bad when they are use for the same purpose?

How much tactical advantage to you really have in your home once you realize that there's a boogie man inside your defenses?

Rethink this little train of thought.

[Florida_Tony]

You can put a light on this one...http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/ ... rrorView_Y

Fair enough, but I'm not going to spend $1200 on an 8-shot revolver.

My question is why do you want a weapon mounted light on a handgun for home defense. It's a tactical disadvantage for you the way I see it. Chances are if you need the light it means someone has broken into your house at night while you're asleep. That means your eyes are already adjusted to the dark, you're on home turf and know your house very well, the intruder does not. Turning on a weapon light gives away your position and you forfeit that advantage. Carry a bright ass light in your non weapon hand and turn it on at that critical moment when you have to draw down on the intruder and blind the shit out of him. IMHO handgun mounted lights are completely wrong for home defense. Now mounting one on a shotgun with a pressure switch makes way more sense, quick on, quick off. But giving up your tactical advantage of night adjusted eyes and giving up your position on your home turf seems like a really bad idea to me. Just my opinion.

Sorry, but I strongly disagree with your opinion. Here's a few reasons.

First of all, my light can flash on momentarily, or I can lock it on. Even just a quick flash is like the light of god in the dark. It blinds. Second of all, my hypothetical intruder also has night vision in your scenario. Third, I'm okay with giving away my position because I have a loaded, hi-capacity weapon trained on the person I suspect is an intruder. Fourth, giving away my position doesn't mean that I don't have cover or concealment.

[Maverick299]

Ok, I did that write that at 2:00 in the morning after a fair amount of drinking, but I'm trying to figure out where you guys got some things out of that?

1. I did not say to shoot at dark shadows
2. I did not say to not use a flashlight
3. I did say to use said flashlight as a weapon to blind the attacker
4. I said a flashlight with a momentary switch that is controlled with your non-trigger hand is better, not a flashlight on a shotty is better than a flashlight on a handgun
5. Most handgun lights are constant on or constant off, some are momentary. A momentary one would be fine, but I don't like the constant because it gives away your position and ruins your eyes that are adjusted to the dark.
6. Chances are the intuder will run at the sound of something moving around in the dark with a voice that says to GTFO, but if they decide to stay you have a huge advantage because that is your home, you know where the corner of the coffee table stops so you don't bang a knee on it, you know that your kid left a landmine of legos in the corner, etc, etc.
7. If you have cover in your house, by all means feel free to get behind and turn on your flashlight, I only have concealment in my house, dry wall and 2x4's are not bullet stoppers and I don't want to stand around a corner with a flashlight turned on and let them know my exact position.

I also stated a few times that it was my opinion only, I'm not asking any of you to change your plan or attempting to tell you it's wrong.

[smokestack]

do any of you guys remember "HARLEY DAVIDSON and the MARLBORO MAN? Mickey Rourke had a Ruger Blackhawk in 454 casull. he did pretty good with it against the the futuristic goon squad in the bullet proof trench coats...of coarse Don Johnson had a .50 cal Desert Eagle...show off.

[squinty]

1. I did not say to shoot at dark shadows

I'll 'splain myself:

If it's dark enough to give you a tactical advantage by hiding your position, it's dark enough to make target ID difficult by obscuring your targets features. In sufficient darkness your target will be a dark shadow or silhouette. Thus the value of a light - it helps you ID your target.

Most handgun lights do have "momentary on" capability, just like shotgun mounted lights with pressure switches or handheld tac lights. Hosing around with a constant beam would be a bad idea, you're right, but noone advocated that. You just assumed that's how someone would use a pistol mounted light.

My goal isn't necessarily to ambush or "get" the BG, it's to keep from getting myself or my dependents hurt. So in a home defense situation I might give up the tactical advantage, and reveal my position by calling out a threat or warning, since I think odds are good that doing so would induce him to leave. That's a situation sort of unique to home invasions, not tactically sound in other low light confrontations, but imo sound practice for the homeowner who hears a burglar rustling around downstairs. If I keep my tactical advantage by not revealing myself, and waiting for him to get to me, I may've increased the odds of getting into a fight. So, yeah, not giving away your position = good, but in a residential break - in situation, target ID and inducing the burglar to flee before he gets to you are worthwhile trade-offs.

BTW I know you were just stating an opinion, noone is mad at you for it. Other posters are just stating our contrary opinions, as part of the discussion. Since we have butted, please feel free to re-butt!

[PointBlank]

You appear to be the troll. I speak from experience, which IS my proof.
From what experience do you speak Mr. Keyboard Warrior???

Well, Mr. 11 years of shooting experience...... I'm your Huckleberry....

40 years. Shooter, hunter, big city cop, multiple gunfight survivor, competitive PPC and IPSC shooter with a bookcase full of trophies, academy instructor, trainer, rangemaster, factory trained armorer for several companies including S&W and Ruger revolvers, long time member of several professional law enforcement weapons related and firearms collector associations, court recognized expert witness, paid consultant for major firearm and ammunition companies.

The best semi automatic pistols, will function longer, and under more adverse conditions, than the best revolvers. Unequivocally.

Without mags?

[TDW586]

Maverick, I think you're just operating off bad information. Constant on handgun lights aren't at all common. The standard handgun lights like Surefire X200/300/400, Streamlight M3, M6, Insight TLR series, are all momentary on. I'd suggest you seek some training on using weapon lights.

PointBlank, I'm not getting involved in this one, but just give it up, bro. Your argument has been logically torn apart, and now, you just got told by 400 Grains. Gotta know when to quit.

[PointBlank]

Maverick, I think you're just operating off bad information. Constant on handgun lights aren't at all common. The standard handgun lights like Surefire X200/300/400, Streamlight M3, M6, Insight TLR series, are all momentary on. I'd suggest you seek some training on using weapon lights.

PointBlank, I'm not getting involved in this one, but just give it up, bro. Your argument has been logically torn apart, and now, you just got told by 400 Grains. Gotta know when to quit.

I don't see where anything has been torn apart, much less logically.. especially when those who address the issue fail to explain how they will find replacement mags for their autos when theirs wear out(in a PAW), which is what my point was to begin with...

Some DID say they were going to stock some and, I guess, carry them around everywhere with them.

However, I agree there's no point to continue feeding the issue any farther. At least I may have shed some light on an area that wasn't being discussed pertaining to the OP.

..or maybe the various mags I've used throughout the years didn't know there was a rule that they are supposed to function reliably more than 3-5 years.. or perhaps indefinitely, as some of the posters seem to believe..

[400 Grains]

You appear to be the troll. I speak from experience, which IS my proof.
From what experience do you speak Mr. Keyboard Warrior???

Well, Mr. 11 years of shooting experience...... I'm your Huckleberry....

40 years. Shooter, hunter, big city cop, multiple gunfight survivor, competitive PPC and IPSC shooter with a bookcase full of trophies, academy instructor, trainer, rangemaster, factory trained armorer for several companies including S&W and Ruger revolvers, long time member of several professional law enforcement weapons related and firearms collector associations, court recognized expert witness, paid consultant for major firearm and ammunition companies.

The best semi automatic pistols, will function longer, and under more adverse conditions, than the best revolvers. Unequivocally.

Without mags?

I intend to use magazines. Highly recommended.

[400 Grains]

Maverick, I think you're just operating off bad information. Constant on handgun lights aren't at all common. The standard handgun lights like Surefire X200/300/400, Streamlight M3, M6, Insight TLR series, are all momentary on. I'd suggest you seek some training on using weapon lights.

PointBlank, I'm not getting involved in this one, but just give it up, bro. Your argument has been logically torn apart, and now, you just got told by 400 Grains. Gotta know when to quit.

I don't see where anything has been torn apart, much less logically.. especially when those who address the issue fail to explain how they will find replacement mags for their autos when theirs wear out(in a PAW), which is what my point was to begin with...

Some DID say they were going to stock some and, I guess, carry them around everywhere with them.

However, I agree there's no point to continue feeding the issue any farther. At least I may have shed some light on an area that wasn't being discussed pertaining to the OP.

..or maybe the various mags I've used throughout the years didn't know there was a rule that they are supposed to function reliably more than 3-5 years.. or perhaps indefinitely, as some of the posters seem to believe..

Which poster seems to think mags function reliably indefinitely? I must have missed that.

Not sure what wrong with your magazines, but all of mine seem to continue to function far beyond "3-5 years". I was shooting some 65 year old ones just the other day. They functioned flawlessly. I have some hundred year old ones, +/-, that function fine.

Now if you mean 3-5 years of continuous use, well, I've worn some out sooner than that in competition and training guns firing thousands of rounds. But under SHTF, my defense magazines are not going to be in continuous use. They will continue to function well beyond 3-5 years, and I have spares for when they do eventually wear.

[400 Grains]

Maverick, I think you're just operating off bad information. Constant on handgun lights aren't at all common. The standard handgun lights like Surefire X200/300/400, Streamlight M3, M6, Insight TLR series, are all momentary on. I'd suggest you seek some training on using weapon lights.

Or even just borrow one and try it around the house or yard.

I can't imagine anyone that's used a handgun light, not understanding it's potential utility.

[jor-el]

do any of you guys remember "HARLEY DAVIDSON and the MARLBORO MAN? Mickey Rourke had a Ruger Blackhawk in 454 casull. he did pretty good with it against the the futuristic goon squad in the bullet proof trench coats...of coarse Don Johnson had a .50 cal Desert Eagle...show off.

I also remember the girl he walked out on at the beginning and the girl he picked up at the end

[JesterODX]

there is another advantage that a revolver has over the glock. if you do like they show on t.v. and in the movies, after you run out of ammo you just throw the gun at your opponent....the heavy ruger will hurt a lot more than the plastic gun ha ha just joking...but it would.

I'd rather pistol whip someone with a Glock than a revolver. I don't want to bend my ejector rod or knock the barrel out of alignment or screw up the timing...

My good sir, what ever revolver your pistol whipping people with, stop. At least untill you get a Super Black Hawk with a 10.5 inch barrel. Tough enough you can beat the hades out of throngs of people and gives you an excellent reach. (I miss my SBH... )

[2now]

There are some other advantages to a revolver that are often over looked, maximum grip modification for one. I have a friend who badly burned her right hand and has had several skin grafts around the gripping area of her hand. revolvers allow more flexibility for grip angel and material.

So why don't the military and police care about this? Well, seriously impaired soldiers and LEO's get a disability pension, instead of a revolver.

So let me ask what does a prepper's disability pension look like?

What does a one handed Failure to Fire drill look like?

[squinty]

There are some other advantages to a revolver that are often over looked, maximum grip modification for one. I have a friend who badly burned her right hand and has had several skin grafts around the gripping area of her hand. revolvers allow more flexibility for grip angel and material.

So why don't the military and police care about this? Well, seriously impaired soldiers and LEO's get a disability pension, instead of a revolver.

So let me ask what does a prepper's disability pension look like?

What does a one handed Failure to Fire drill look like?

Good point about the grip modification, but what does a one handed revolver reload look like? Doable, I bet, but awkward. A pistol has to reload less often, thanks to higher capacity, so if one handed reloading was equally awkward for both, the SA pistol would still have an advantage. It might be easier to let a mag drop free than try to bang the ejector rod against something to get the spent casings out of a revolver.

I find SA pistols a bit easier to shoot accurately one handed, all else being equal, because the recoil spring and slide motion absorb some of the recoil impulse. OTOH I've never "limpwristed" a revolver and caused it to jam.

Links to revolver "stress reload" and failure drills:
http://www.personaldefensenetwork.com/a ... ion-drill/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXUwI_d8JlA

It's an interesting question which set of drills would be more easily modified/manageable for a one handed person. Obviously "pull the trigger again" is the easiest thing to do one handed, so advantage revolver (and to a lesser extent, traditional DA/SA pistols like the Beretta or Sig.)

[lost_wreckage]

There will always be a role for my revolver. Why? I love to shoot it and have practiced a lot with it. I never have to worry about which ammo the gun likes. I can shoot either special or magnum rounds. Round capacity is not a big deal because if I have more than 5 people up close to me, chances are I'm a goner. That's what the shotgun is for. Don't get me wrong though, of course I would have my Sig by my side, but my Ruger is my favorite and I can hit more accurately with it than with my Sig.

[Philpot]

You appear to be the troll. I speak from experience, which IS my proof.
From what experience do you speak Mr. Keyboard Warrior???

Well, Mr. 11 years of shooting experience...... I'm your Huckleberry....

40 years. Shooter, hunter, big city cop, multiple gunfight survivor, competitive PPC and IPSC shooter with a bookcase full of trophies, academy instructor, trainer, rangemaster, factory trained armorer for several companies including S&W and Ruger revolvers, long time member of several professional law enforcement weapons related and firearms collector associations, court recognized expert witness, paid consultant for major firearm and ammunition companies.

The best semi automatic pistols, will function longer, and under more adverse conditions, than the best revolvers. Unequivocally.

Just scanning over what I've missed on this thread and saw this... Someone got burned xD good post sir.

[Talon04]

Heres my .02 on this subject. Got ammo for it? It has a place. No more no less

[TripleThreat]

Good luck to all