Lever Guns Talk Thread

[RickOShea]

I had wanted a winchester, however the only place i can find used ones is in a city where they requred the gun shop to force you to be 21 to even be INSIDE the gun store, so i cant even buy long arms there. However the Big 5 can sell guns as normal. BS if you ask me

Waaaaaaay back when I was 19 -20 years old, the local Wal-Mart wouldn't sell me .44 magnum boolitz for my TimberWolf pump-rifle cause, as the manager put it, "the .44 is for pistols and you have to be 21 to buy pistol ammo".

[Gun_Nut_2k1]

Waaaaaaay back when I was 19 -20 years old, the local Wal-Mart wouldn't sell me .44 magnum boolitz for my TimberWolf pump-rifle cause, as the manager put it, "the .44 is for pistols and you have to be 21 to buy pistol ammo".

Wait! So are you saying they had Wal-Marts in the Revolutionary War????

[RickOShea]

Waaaaaaay back when I was 19 -20 years old, the local Wal-Mart wouldn't sell me .44 magnum boolitz for my TimberWolf pump-rifle cause, as the manager put it, "the .44 is for pistols and you have to be 21 to buy pistol ammo".

Wait! So are you saying they had Wal-Marts in the Revolutionary War????

I'm starting to feel like it was.

[ninja-elbow]

Signs up in my local Wally's (Holgate/East Plaza ... the craziest and trashiest Walmart ever!!) say: rifle ammo 18 and over - pistol ammo 21 and over. I never bought no ammo at "MILF Walmart" aka Johnson Creek so I have no idea what they say.

[ninja-elbow]

I guess i did a fair bit of rambling in that post. The main question was if anyone had any better suggestions than the 336 or if the 336 would be a good choice for a first lever/hog huntin rifle

You'll be pretty happy with a 336. Since it is hard to find a used 94 in your area, get a 336 if you can.

[xLionx]

Waaaaaaay back when I was 19 -20 years old, the local Wal-Mart wouldn't sell me .44 magnum boolitz for my TimberWolf pump-rifle cause, as the manager put it, "the .44 is for pistols and you have to be 21 to buy pistol ammo".

Should have offered to bring your rifle in to show them you were in fact trying to buy it for your rifle

[MVegas]

I had wanted a winchester, however the only place i can find used ones is in a city where they requred the gun shop to force you to be 21 to even be INSIDE the gun store, so i cant even buy long arms there. However the Big 5 can sell guns as normal. BS if you ask me

There certainly are things about the '94 that recommend it. Namely, IMHO, it's ergos. Those damned things just dance around in your hands like little else can. I have one, in 30-30, and I'll never give it up. I just love shooting it too much. However for me, the complexity of the action, and fewer/poorer possible sight and/or optics options relative to the 336, puts it behind the Marlin for field use. YMMV.

[austin93906]

yeah, ive decided to have my manager track down a 336 and get it sent to my store.

the only '94 ive used was my buddies .30-30, and i loved it, so thatll be the next thing i hunt down

[UndeadInfidel]

I've had a 30-30 since I was 11. It was my first gun. I still have it today and it fires true with years of neglect behind it.

[RickOShea]

There certainly are things about the '94 that recommend it. Namely, IMHO, it's ergos. Those damned things just dance around in your hands like little else can. I have one, in 30-30, and I'll never give it up. I just love shooting it too much. However for me, the complexity of the action, and fewer/poorer possible sight and/or optics options relative to the 336, puts it behind the Marlin for field use. YMMV.

My Old Man had a Win. 94 Trapper in .44 mag. One time he short-stroked it or something, and bent the lifter and rendered it useless until he had the local 'smith fix it.

I've short-stroked my Marlin '94s several times, but I've never bent or broken anything, just worked the lever fully forward and back again and everything was kosher.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the Winchester using the same receiver for pistol and rifle length cartridges, while Marlin uses two different length receivers?

I'm not trying to start a "versus" thing, just wondering.......

[RickOShea]

Waaaaaaay back when I was 19 -20 years old, the local Wal-Mart wouldn't sell me .44 magnum boolitz for my TimberWolf pump-rifle cause, as the manager put it, "the .44 is for pistols and you have to be 21 to buy pistol ammo".

Should have offered to bring your rifle in to show them you were in fact trying to buy it for your rifle

I offered to show it to him, but he was having none of it. "Policy, policy, policy".

It didn't matter, the assistant manager of the grocery store I worked part-time at carried a .44 mag revolver in a shoulder holster under his blue manager's vest, so I just got him to pick me up a couple boxes everytime he bought more ammo....... And don't try to rob that grocery store, that man was surgical with that hand-cannon.

[MVegas]

There certainly are things about the '94 that recommend it. Namely, IMHO, it's ergos. Those damned things just dance around in your hands like little else can. I have one, in 30-30, and I'll never give it up. I just love shooting it too much. However for me, the complexity of the action, and fewer/poorer possible sight and/or optics options relative to the 336, puts it behind the Marlin for field use. YMMV.

My Old Man had a Win. 94 Trapper in .44 mag. One time he short-stroked it or something, and bent the lifter and rendered it useless until he had the local 'smith fix it.

I've short-stroked my Marlin '94s several times, but I've never bent or broken anything, just worked the lever fully forward and back again and everything was kosher.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the Winchester using the same receiver for pistol and rifle length cartridges, while Marlin uses two different length receivers?

I'm not trying to start a "versus" thing, just wondering.......

Agreed! The last thing I'd do too. The last thing we need is a lever gun cake vs. pie d**k bump!

As to that issue, I really just haven't got an educated enough opinion to attempt explanation, but your take sounds perfectly plausible to me. Hell, a 30-30 case is longer than a .44 mag cartridge. They had to make up for an awful lot, there.

ETA- Oh, and let me know if you ever want to unload that Timberwolf! I'll give you......twice what you paid when you were 19!!!

[Gun_Nut_2k1]

There certainly are things about the '94 that recommend it. Namely, IMHO, it's ergos. Those damned things just dance around in your hands like little else can. I have one, in 30-30, and I'll never give it up. I just love shooting it too much. However for me, the complexity of the action, and fewer/poorer possible sight and/or optics options relative to the 336, puts it behind the Marlin for field use. YMMV.

My Old Man had a Win. 94 Trapper in .44 mag. One time he short-stroked it or something, and bent the lifter and rendered it useless until he had the local 'smith fix it.

I've short-stroked my Marlin '94s several times, but I've never bent or broken anything, just worked the lever fully forward and back again and everything was kosher.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the Winchester using the same receiver for pistol and rifle length cartridges, while Marlin uses two different length receivers?

I'm not trying to start a "versus" thing, just wondering.......

Agreed! The last thing I'd do too. The last thing we need is a lever gun cake vs. pie d**k bump!

As to that issue, I really just haven't got an educated enough opinion to attempt explanation, but your take sounds perfectly plausible to me. Hell, a 30-30 case is longer than a .44 mag cartridge. They had to make up for an awful lot, there.

ETA- Oh, and let me know if you ever want to unload that Timberwolf! I'll give you......twice what you paid when you were 19!!!

I am gonna go out on a limb here, but considering Ricks age (Rev war and all that) I would offer 3 times what he paid for it! LOL

When I sold ammo at my store I had ki.. ahem young men try to buy pistol ammo for rifles. I checked with my agent and he said if it was for a rifle then I could. I would ask the young man what kinda rifle and some specifics, if all he could say was "um the long kind" I would pass on the sale.

[RickOShea]

"Holy priceless collection of Etruscan snoods, Batman!" A guy on Gunbroker wanted $1900.00 for a .44 TimberWolf a couple months ago.

[KentsOkay]

Holy jeez!

How mucho grandioso is a .44mag out of a lever gun than 357?

[roscoe]

How mucho grandioso is a .44mag out of a lever gun than 357?

(from their website):

Buffalo Bore .357 :
5. 18.5 inch Marlin 1894
a. Item 19A/20-180gr. Hard Cast = 1851 fps
b. Item 19B/20-170gr. JHC = 1860 fps
c. Item 19C/20-158gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 2153 fps
d. Item 19D/20-125gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 2298 fps

Buffalo Bore .44 Mag 240 grain +P
1. 1935 fps -- Marlin 1894 20 inch
2. 1897 fps -- Marlin 1894 18 inch
3. 1871 fps -- Marlin 1894 16.5 inch

[MVegas]

Yeah a .44 carbine is making copious amounts of energy (for a handgun caliber) at the muzzle. You pay for it both in $ and a fair bit more percived recoil but at close range its nasty.

[ninja-elbow]

I've typed it before and I'll type it again: pistol carbine lever action rifles are at ridiculous prices.

Is this a new thing or has it always been such? I was never in the market for one until 2009 so I never knew what the prices were.

ETA: and yes, the issue with the 94 stated above probably had a lot to do with the difference in bullet size and action. Winchester always had some reputation for that. Back when I had my 94 I took some kids (18-19 yo) out to shoot and they kept short stroking the 30-30 and my Dad said Winchesters always had that issue.

To supercede any pie v. cake - Marlins are heavy as fuck if you carry one all day long. Winchester are nice and light. Perfect truck gun ... and why I wish I had not sold mine.

[12_Gauge_Chimp]

A family friend who has long since passed away had a few original Winchester lever rifles. I don't remember exactly what models they were, but I do know they were pretty old at the time.

I think one of them was a Winchester Model 1892 in .44-40 or .45 Colt, but I could be wrong.

[FrANkNstEin]

Does anyone of you Leverholics happen to have an SBR´ed .44mag? (Or Rossi Ranch Hand?)

I´m thinking about getting a Rossi in .44 and cut the barrel back somewhere between 12 and 14" . That´d be vicious.

Since there are no SBR laws here, it will still be a normal Rifle as long as i keep the min. OAL in mind. Thoughts and input?

[Dooms]

The only real downside to cutting the barrel down is that you also have to cut the tube magazine down as well. So you end up loosing a bit of capacity. In the case of the ranch hand, it only holds 6 rounds in the tube. Otherwise, you don't loose much velocity going from an 18-20" barrel to a 12" barrel, as .44 mag typically sees the most gains within the first 12" of the barrel.

A buddy looked at a Ranch Hand, but decided he would just be better off owning a quality .44 magnum revolver instead. The latter having a few distinct advantages (stronger design, easier to find holsters/accessories, faster to reload, ect)

With that said, I'm not sure if you guys can own handguns in Oesterreich, so cutting down a rifle may be the way to go.

[FrANkNstEin]

Thx for the information, it comes in handy!

We can own handguns, but you have to have a gun permit for handguns (and semi auto rifles/shotguns). The permit is initially restricted to 2 handguns/rifles or whatever you want and depending on which area you live in, it´s very hard to get more then 2 slots on the permit anyway. (my area for example )

A cut down manual repeating rifle however can be had by anyone who´s 18 and passes a background check.(1 per gunshop if they don´t know you, not per gun!) And as many as you want. So yeah, it´s quite the way to go if you don´t want to jump all the loops to get a gun permit or happen to have no empty slots left. (Unfortuneately, with shotguns that´s not the case and we have the same min. OAL as you guys, but Rifles can have a min. OAL somewhere around 23" and everything over that OAL is still considered a rifle by law)

Hope that explains a bit why such a gun would make sense to me. (mainly for Home Defense and as a Range Toy too)

Yes, it´d be quite an unwieldy sixshooter compared to a revolver, but it´s more of a toss up between: this six shooter, or no six shooter. (i´ll probably decide on a barrel length were i could still fit 6 rounds into the mag)

Funny gunlaws are funny.

[mk_ultra]

The first year I went deer hunting in Wi. I used my Great Uncle's 1866 Winchester Yellowboy . I believe it was .44-40 . It had a full octagonal barrel , engraved receiver and a tangent sight .

Had no idea what it was or what it was worth at the time . Sadly it vanished when he died .

Growing up in my neck of the woods the popular opinion is that Winchester 94s were the leveraction and Marlins were kinda crappy . Funny that the worm has turned on that and Marlins have the better reputation these days .

[Dooms]

Winchester 94's are still top quality lever actions, they've just slowly become harder to obtain and more expensive. For a while, there weren't even any new ones being made, and now that they're back, they're extremely expensive new.

Personally, I like Marlins specifically because of the side eject (vs the top eject of the Winchesters). Many of them already come drilled and tapped for optics, so it's real easy to mount a scope, red dot, or whatever. Between good optics and modern ammunition (like Hornady's Leverevolution rounds) you can really get some exceptional performance out of the old .30-30 cartridge. Sure, it's not as authentic to the old west or whatever, but I'm sure the cowboys of 'ole would have used them too if they had 'em.