Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Forum dedicated for rifles and shotguns from basic to tactical.

Moderator: ZS Global Moderators

CaptainRW
* * * *
Posts: 955
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 2:19 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Zombieland
Location: Cheshire County NH
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by CaptainRW » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:39 am

AKFTW wrote:They will NEVER replace the AK series. Even if they try to. There are just TOO many of them :mrgreen:
They will replace it sometime, years from now... when beam weapons get light enough...
TTFN
Richard
NH Zombie Defense Team Leader.

FYI... Federal Reserve Notes are NOT money, dollars or real currency, they ARE Fiat Notes or Currency, with no value except what the Fed says, So I now call them Federal Reserve Fiat Notes. Better to call things as they really are...

User avatar
zombie_mike
* * * * *
Posts: 1284
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:57 am
Location: Columbia, MO

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by zombie_mike » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:42 am

Boris wrote:I know next to nothing about the AK platform, but is there something inherently wrong about moving the rear sight back to the end of the receiver? Seems like this would help with accuracy. I've always thought it was too far forward.

Put a rear sight on a removable and often loose receiver cover? Not exactly a plan that would improve accuracy.
June 26th, 2008---The Day Gun Prohibition Died!
crypto wrote:
rodka wrote: It feels like an orgasm in the hand
So, uh, do you mean it's all sticky, or what?
I prefer pistols that dont feel like they're jizzing on me, thanks.

User avatar
AKFTW
* * * * *
Posts: 4176
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 11:49 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Shaun of the Dead, Dawn of the Dead (remake), Land of the Dead, 28 Days Later, and Zombieland!
Location: VT
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by AKFTW » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:46 am

CaptainRW wrote:
AKFTW wrote:They will NEVER replace the AK series. Even if they try to. There are just TOO many of them :mrgreen:
They will replace it sometime, years from now... when beam weapons get light enough...
Oh at that point they will just have laser AKs like in Firefly :lol:
docdredd wrote:those pandas need to harden the fuck up
Image

Image

User avatar
AUA
* * *
Posts: 395
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:26 pm

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by AUA » Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:29 pm

Did that article say "German G-1"? As in the FAL, which is Belgian?

Image

Because Fox News doesn't know shit.

Also, isn't the US running that one Carbine competition to replace the M4, or is it going to go the way of the XM8 and 3+ other failed projects? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Carbine

User avatar
Paladin1
* * * * *
Posts: 4451
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 12:56 pm
Location: Central Ohio

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by Paladin1 » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:02 pm

I don't think they will dump the platform anytime soon. I think they will go through a major revision first.

They should buy a Sig in X39 and then copy it. :D
WWSD?

User avatar
pyratemime
* * * * *
Posts: 2916
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 1:07 am
Location: College Station, TX
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by pyratemime » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:10 pm

Russia is already in a big twist about the Chinese reverse engineering the Su-27. Given they are trying to gather support to hold them accountable for violating the licensing agreement and international IP law I don't think they will be copying anyone else's weapon tech and shooting their argument to hell.
Image

"It wouldn't hurt you people to think like a serial killer every now and again. You know just for the sake of prevention!" - Foamy the Squirrel
DaJoker wrote:In regards to us "normal" humans... well that's why its best to follow pyratemime's advice.

User avatar
Paladin1
* * * * *
Posts: 4451
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 12:56 pm
Location: Central Ohio

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by Paladin1 » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:13 pm

Then they will be the only country who dosen't.
WWSD?

User avatar
pyratemime
* * * * *
Posts: 2916
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 1:07 am
Location: College Station, TX
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by pyratemime » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:30 pm

Or not. You tend to have major trade issues when you buy some samples and then start producing the item wholesale domestically. Russia has suspended several arms deals to China over the Su-27 copies. With Russian need to buy larger weapon systems, like the Mistral, one of the last things they want to do is establish a reputation for copying and producing designs. This will either drive the price and/or quantity required for sales deals or close off certain counties/advanced designs that they would be interested in.
Image

"It wouldn't hurt you people to think like a serial killer every now and again. You know just for the sake of prevention!" - Foamy the Squirrel
DaJoker wrote:In regards to us "normal" humans... well that's why its best to follow pyratemime's advice.

KnifeStyle
* * *
Posts: 527
Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 8:33 pm

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by KnifeStyle » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:45 pm

Well, Christmas shopping just got a lot easier...


How many dictators and rebel groups are rubbing their hands right now? I can't imagine Russia having the full intent to switch over between funding and pride, but a million more AKs spread around the world is something worth sighing about. Curious if anyone steps in to monitor where they end up this time around, its infamy by now may warrant supervision.
jamoni wrote:Zombie Squad, the things you have experience with scare me.

User avatar
squinty
* * * * *
Posts: 5753
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:11 am
Favorite Zombie Movies: night of the living dead, shaun of the dead, pre-opening credit scenes from 28 weeks later and dawn of the dead remake

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by squinty » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:09 pm

Russia's Defense Minister, Anatoly Serdyukov, set off a firestorm of debate in Russia after saying that his military's pride and joy, the Kalashnikov and Dragunov SVDs sniper rifles, are "morally outdated" and that he's considering a plan to buy foreign-made small arms.
What does "morally outdated" mean, exactly?

I understand a rifle being technologically up to date or technologically outdated.
I can even see a case for some types of weapons - like mustard gas or smallpox spores - being "morally outdated" in that most people have just agreed not to make'em anymore for ethical reasons.

But what could make one rifle more "morally up to date" compared to some other rifle? The morality of deploying a rifle would seem to inhere in where it's pointed, at whom and for what reason, not the variety of mechanism that launches the bullet.
George Orwell wrote:Power is not a means; it is an end. One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution; one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship. The object of persecution is persecution. The object of torture is torture. The object of power is power.

CaptainRW
* * * *
Posts: 955
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 2:19 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Zombieland
Location: Cheshire County NH
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by CaptainRW » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:21 pm

squinty wrote:
Russia's Defense Minister, Anatoly Serdyukov, set off a firestorm of debate in Russia after saying that his military's pride and joy, the Kalashnikov and Dragunov SVDs sniper rifles, are "morally outdated" and that he's considering a plan to buy foreign-made small arms.
What does "morally outdated" mean, exactly?

I understand a rifle being technologically up to date or technologically outdated.
I can even see a case for some types of weapons - like mustard gas or smallpox spores - being "morally outdated" in that most people have just agreed not to make'em anymore for ethical reasons.

But what could make one rifle more "morally up to date" compared to some other rifle? The morality of deploying a rifle would seem to inhere in where it's pointed, at whom and for what reason, not the variety of mechanism that launches the bullet.
I'm guessing it's the "bad reputation" it has, not in a reliability way, but that "bad guys" are usually the ones using them... I mean, example, what does UBL carry and have as a prop in his videos...
TTFN
Richard
NH Zombie Defense Team Leader.

FYI... Federal Reserve Notes are NOT money, dollars or real currency, they ARE Fiat Notes or Currency, with no value except what the Fed says, So I now call them Federal Reserve Fiat Notes. Better to call things as they really are...

User avatar
phil_in_cs
ZS Member
ZS Member
Posts: 11424
Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:18 pm
Location: central tx

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by phil_in_cs » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:27 pm

I am surprised one of you AK fan boys didn't post this in Disasters In Current Events.
Don't confuse a belligerent and aggressive attitude with the strength, training, and conditioning needed to prevail in a fight. How do you know you have the Will To Win, if you don't even have the will to train?

User avatar
Biggin
* * * * *
Posts: 3282
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 9:03 am
Location: Baton Rouge, LA

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by Biggin » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:36 pm

phil_in_cs wrote:I am surprised one of you AK fan boys didn't post this in Disasters In Current Events.
I laughed.... loudly. The forum needs a "like" button.

User avatar
Stercutus
* * * * *
Posts: 13938
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:16 pm
Location: Safe On Base

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by Stercutus » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:39 pm

phil_in_cs wrote:I am surprised one of you AK fan boys didn't post this in Disasters In Current Events.
Oh, I toyed with a few hyperbolic titles: "Stalin Spins in Grave", "End Times Approach for Russia", etc....
You go 'round and around it
You go over and under
I go through

User avatar
MaxRite
* * * * *
Posts: 1373
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:35 pm
Location: VA

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by MaxRite » Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:08 pm

squinty wrote:
Russia's Defense Minister, Anatoly Serdyukov, set off a firestorm of debate in Russia after saying that his military's pride and joy, the Kalashnikov and Dragunov SVDs sniper rifles, are "morally outdated" and that he's considering a plan to buy foreign-made small arms.
What does "morally outdated" mean, exactly?
Its a literal translation of a Russian idiom that is stupid to begin with. But at least if you speak the language you know what it means and that it has nothing to do with actual morals or morality. The interpreter assumed that English has same idiom with similar meaning and translated verbatim.


-----------------

On topic: There is nothing unusual with Russia looking for foreign weapons to fit the necessary niche. We are all used to Soviet Russia not buying weapons abroad, but Imperial Russia never had issues with foreign-made weapons. As of today Russia already uses dozens of foreign made weapons and components: diesel engines, FLIR, light helicopter engines, pistols, sniper rifles, radios, optics, etc. Along with purchase of 2 Mistrals and license to build two more, Russia is considering buying Iveco armored vehicles, Thales targeting pods and already purchased Israeli UAVs.

Professional soldiers in various SpN, SOBR and CT teams want professional grade equipment. And they want it now, not when Russian industry manages to cough something up. And evil baby-eating drunken Serdyukov is doing something no other MO minister done before - giving the fighting troops what they want.

Russian military as a whole will not get away from the AK-74 family for few decades, but I am willing to bet, we will see FSB, MVD and hopefully VDV fighting with new assault rifles soon enough. And its a good thing.
Image Image

User avatar
pyratemime
* * * * *
Posts: 2916
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 1:07 am
Location: College Station, TX
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by pyratemime » Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:13 pm

squinty wrote:
Russia's Defense Minister, Anatoly Serdyukov, set off a firestorm of debate in Russia after saying that his military's pride and joy, the Kalashnikov and Dragunov SVDs sniper rifles, are "morally outdated" and that he's considering a plan to buy foreign-made small arms.
What does "morally outdated" mean, exactly?

I understand a rifle being technologically up to date or technologically outdated.
I can even see a case for some types of weapons - like mustard gas or smallpox spores - being "morally outdated" in that most people have just agreed not to make'em anymore for ethical reasons.

But what could make one rifle more "morally up to date" compared to some other rifle? The morality of deploying a rifle would seem to inhere in where it's pointed, at whom and for what reason, not the variety of mechanism that launches the bullet.
A previous poster mentioned that this might well be a problem in translation from Russian to English. I also think that "morally outdated" may be more a reference to the move from a large conscript army to a professional contract army like we have here in the US and other western States. Given the audience that the statement was made to, internal government types not the media at large, and the push to modernize their equipment I would go so far as to say this is more a term of art for his speech rather than a true critique of the rifle.
Image

"It wouldn't hurt you people to think like a serial killer every now and again. You know just for the sake of prevention!" - Foamy the Squirrel
DaJoker wrote:In regards to us "normal" humans... well that's why its best to follow pyratemime's advice.

User avatar
RickOShea
ZS Lifetime Member
ZS Lifetime Member
Posts: 9215
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:24 pm
Location: Gulf Coast, AL

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by RickOShea » Sat Jan 22, 2011 4:14 pm

Maybe the Russkies just want something that has a better cheekweld for their EOTechs. :)
whisk.e.rebellion wrote: It's not what you say anymore. It's how you say it.

Image ............................................................................................................................................................................................Image

User avatar
ei8htx
BANNED
Posts: 1175
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:29 pm
Location: PDX

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by ei8htx » Sat Jan 22, 2011 4:50 pm

You AR fanboys can all kiss my ass

Fox News - U.S. Military Reconsiders Army's Use of M4 Rifles in Afghanistan
CNN - Key lawmakers express concern over combat gear in Afghanistan

Anyway, it'll never happen. It's just one non-military BG Prime Minister spewing shit he doens't know about. Plus I wouldn't take that article seriously as it stated the AK-47 was made in WWII, that it was the first assault rifle made, nor did it mention that the '47 hasn't been built in decades.

I can see them upgrading the AK platform, with chrome barrels, rails, a caliber around 6.8, etc. The platform certainly isn't dead, and with such upgrades could be on par in accuracy with your typical AR. I'm betting the 74's are already pretty damn close.

User avatar
AKFTW
* * * * *
Posts: 4176
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 11:49 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Shaun of the Dead, Dawn of the Dead (remake), Land of the Dead, 28 Days Later, and Zombieland!
Location: VT
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by AKFTW » Sat Jan 22, 2011 5:01 pm

I have to say the ultimate assault rifle would probably be an AK-74M with an AK-200 top cover system, along with a flash hider, semi-full-3rd burst trigger group, small diameter tritium front sight post, and chambered in 6.5 Grendel. That would embody MASSIVE amounts of win. Seriously though, I think an up-chambering of the 5.45 rifles for a 6.something X39 and addition of an AK-200 style top rail would take the system to it's absolute full potential for not a lot of dough.
docdredd wrote:those pandas need to harden the fuck up
Image

Image

User avatar
ei8htx
BANNED
Posts: 1175
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:29 pm
Location: PDX

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by ei8htx » Sat Jan 22, 2011 5:09 pm

AKFTW wrote:I have to say the ultimate assault rifle would probably be an AK-74M with an AK-200 top cover system, along with a flash hider, semi-full-3rd burst trigger group, small diameter tritium front sight post, and chambered in 6.5 Grendel. That would embody MASSIVE amounts of win. Seriously though, I think an up-chambering of the 5.45 rifles for a 6.something X39 and addition of an AK-200 style top rail would take the system to it's absolute full potential for not a lot of dough.
I just had an orgasm

CaptainRW
* * * *
Posts: 955
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 2:19 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Zombieland
Location: Cheshire County NH
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by CaptainRW » Sat Jan 22, 2011 5:27 pm

ei8htx wrote:
AKFTW wrote:I have to say the ultimate assault rifle would probably be an AK-74M with an AK-200 top cover system, along with a flash hider, semi-full-3rd burst trigger group, small diameter tritium front sight post, and chambered in 6.5 Grendel. That would embody MASSIVE amounts of win. Seriously though, I think an up-chambering of the 5.45 rifles for a 6.something X39 and addition of an AK-200 style top rail would take the system to it's absolute full potential for not a lot of dough.
I just had an orgasm
TMI... way TMI.... :-)
TTFN
Richard
NH Zombie Defense Team Leader.

FYI... Federal Reserve Notes are NOT money, dollars or real currency, they ARE Fiat Notes or Currency, with no value except what the Fed says, So I now call them Federal Reserve Fiat Notes. Better to call things as they really are...

User avatar
Gingerbread Man
ZS Lifetime Member
ZS Lifetime Member
Posts: 10834
Joined: Mon May 17, 2010 10:05 am

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by Gingerbread Man » Sat Jan 22, 2011 6:53 pm

AKFTW wrote:I have to say the ultimate assault rifle would probably be an AK-74M with an AK-200 top cover system, along with a flash hider, semi-full-3rd burst trigger group, small diameter tritium front sight post, and chambered in 6.5 Grendel. That would embody MASSIVE amounts of win. Seriously though, I think an up-chambering of the 5.45 rifles for a 6.something X39 and addition of an AK-200 style top rail would take the system to it's absolute full potential for not a lot of dough.
Win!
Shrapnel wrote "nobody is trying to be a dick and give out warnings for every little thing" :|
Image
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DS1icEssOUM

User avatar
Kutter_0311
* * * * *
Posts: 6135
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:44 am
Favorite Zombie Movies: too many to get into...
Location: Frozen Tundra, WI

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by Kutter_0311 » Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:16 pm

Got a kick out of this chart, since a local paper had a pic of one of our cops in New Orleans.

Caption cited widespread mayhem evidenced by AK mag our cop was holding up, like terrorists were active post-Katrina.

Our cop was holding an issue M16 mag, most likely dropped by NG/LE...
AUA wrote:Image
Because Fox News doesn't know shit.

Also, isn't the US running that one Carbine competition to replace the M4, or is it going to go the way of the XM8 and 3+ other failed projects? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Carbine
While weapon design will advance, the big players won't buy unless they profit from buying, like selling more than they use themselves. Otherwise, a catastrophic upset of the field, like shoulder-fired beam weapons in use by a militarily aggressive country, would require others to upgrade to beam guns, too.
JAYNE COBB wrote: Well, what you plan and what takes place ain't ever exactly been similar.
TravisM.1 wrote:If a rifle is an option, a rifle is usually the answer.
minengr wrote:I've said it numerous times, a quality rig is only as good as it's weakest link. Which usually is the nut behind the butt.

User avatar
pyratemime
* * * * *
Posts: 2916
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 1:07 am
Location: College Station, TX
Contact:

Re: Russia Considering Replacing Ak-47 With Imported Rifle

Post by pyratemime » Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:24 pm

I am just curious why everyone thinks that a Minister who was appointed by Vladimir Putin and has worked for him with the express mission to modernize the military is a man who is 1. speaking out of his ass and 2. speaking without the approval of the only opinion that matters in Russian politics anymore, Prime Minister Putin his very own self?
Image

"It wouldn't hurt you people to think like a serial killer every now and again. You know just for the sake of prevention!" - Foamy the Squirrel
DaJoker wrote:In regards to us "normal" humans... well that's why its best to follow pyratemime's advice.

Post Reply

Return to “Longarms - Shotguns and Rifles”