Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by woodsghost » Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:11 pm

JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:00 pm
Just wanted to say I do NOT like the Arsenal 106, it was maybe 5 moa at a 100 yards, wouldnt feed reliably with some ammo. Overall, it was not quite as reliable as my AR15 ,it was not anywhere near as accurate as my AR15 and the finish was crap. It felt more like a commie mini 14 than a quality hard use rifle unlike a lot of AKs(no offense meant towards mini-14 owners, I hear the newer ones are nice). Anyways, I was not a fan. If I decide I need an AK it will be chambered in a commie round. Thanks for the help though ,guys.
Good to hear your experience. Please note: experience with 1 rifle does not mean all rifles are like that. But that is a pretty souring experience. Remember there are some sucky AKs chambered in commi rounds. A lot of the time it is sucky ammo that gives poor accuracy (4-6 moa) and the bi-metal bullets wear out barrels faster. But good barrels and good ammo will usually give you good accuracy. Picking up any random AK will not always produce good results. And check around, some AKs have really poor reputations.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:35 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:11 pm
JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:00 pm
Just wanted to say I do NOT like the Arsenal 106, it was maybe 5 moa at a 100 yards, wouldnt feed reliably with some ammo. Overall, it was not quite as reliable as my AR15 ,it was not anywhere near as accurate as my AR15 and the finish was crap. It felt more like a commie mini 14 than a quality hard use rifle unlike a lot of AKs(no offense meant towards mini-14 owners, I hear the newer ones are nice). Anyways, I was not a fan. If I decide I need an AK it will be chambered in a commie round. Thanks for the help though ,guys.
Good to hear your experience. Please note: experience with 1 rifle does not mean all rifles are like that. But that is a pretty souring experience. Remember there are some sucky AKs chambered in commi rounds. A lot of the time it is sucky ammo that gives poor accuracy (4-6 moa) and the bi-metal bullets wear out barrels faster. But good barrels and good ammo will usually give you good accuracy. Picking up any random AK will not always produce good results. And check around, some AKs have really poor reputations.
Fair enough, Arsenal has a good reputation though and they have military contracts for these rifles so QC should be better. Not to mention im not the only one to be having these issues.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by delarey » Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:39 pm

Not sure about the twist rate on the Arsenals...but results may have been affected if you ran too heavy ammunition through it. 77gr will not produce wonderful results in a 1/12 barrel.
Sorry to hear you didn't like it though. Arsenal has always had a solid reputation.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:39 pm

JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:35 pm
Arsenal has a good reputation though and they have military contracts
What military contracts does Arsenal have?
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:53 pm

JeeperCreeper wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:39 pm
JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:35 pm
Arsenal has a good reputation though and they have military contracts
What military contracts does Arsenal have?
Bulgaria, supposedly. Im trying to find sources besides other random forums but not much pops up. There are pics of Bulgarian troops carrying them though.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:57 pm

JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:53 pm
JeeperCreeper wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:39 pm
JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:35 pm
Arsenal has a good reputation though and they have military contracts
What military contracts does Arsenal have?
Bulgaria, supposedly. Im trying to find sources besides other random forums but not much pops up. There are pics of Bulgarian troops carrying them though.
I think Arsenal in Vegas gets Bulgarian kits... I thought it was the other way around. Plus, there's that Arsenal firearms in Italy I believe that does the Russian Strike one version and the double barrel 1911.

But I could be mixing all that up.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by moab » Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:25 pm

I know a little bit about this. And I had never walked down the rabbit hole that is 5.56 AK. Until just recently. When I owned an - albeit used - Arsenal 106 for a grand total of two weeks. Long story short? Avoid it. Unless you get a Galil. I joined a 5.56 AK only group on facebook. Just to get a feeling of what owners were experiences with their rifles. It has a long name. I'm sure it's the only one though. lol. AFter joining that group and talking to fellow builders. 5.56 in AK's just doesn't run reliably. I can't tell you why. They just always have feed issues. Even in a large group of 5.56 Ak owners. The amount of feed issues discussed. Was enough for me to be turned off to what should be the most reliable platform there is. So I would avoid a 5.56 unless it's the Galil. A Galil will run anything very very well. So believe it or not my vote is stick with an AR in 5.56. But a Galil would be a nice addition. Not sure about commonality in a paw though.

Why not an actual 7.62 AK? Any AKM will be interchangeable with any other AKM. And probably 70-80 percent of the AKs in the US are probably AKM. So you can have Polish, Romanian, East German, Bulgarian etc. etc. and you'll be able to swap parts. It's also easiest to find aftermarket items for things ike furniture.

Yugo's are a different story. They take different furniture. So it's not as easy (it is doable) to make it tactical. And they used to come as kits with non chromelined barrels (not enough chromium in Yugoslavia) that were usually shot out or filled with rust. So many older builds have not so great barrels. Nowadays you can't import kits with barrels and they've for the most part dried up for manufacturers. So kits are built with much better US Yugo chromelined barrels. (But don't be fooled. US barrels aren't the best for AKM's. I've been building on Polish hammer forged chromelined barrels for a while now. And they are much better than anything offered stateside. Or at least that is the more than general consensus.

I have both AK's and an AR. Speaking purely from a paw point of view. If you had to choose it would be AR. Because of the amount of sheer parts and ammo in the US already. Far outpaces the AK. But if you've got a stockpile of ammo. And plenty of parts. I'd pick the AK all day. More reliable. And that's not a slight on the AR. The AK pays for being more reliable. Tolerances aren't as tight. So it's not a tac driver like an AR can be. But it's accurate enough for the vast majority of combat distances one might find themselves in. And a lot more accurate than you might hear. I just saw a video someplace where a guy took an Arsenal 107 out to 200 or 300 yards and was hitting 2 moa? Don't quote me on that. But it was a lot more accurate than you might think. Certainly accurate enough to be combat effective. They both have their place though. And in the end I don't think everyone or their guns are going to make it in a paw. So I think, they'll be plenty to pick up along the way. In that case I pick an AK. It always works. No matter what. And you don't have time to tear down and clean an AR in the middle of a zombie fight. ;) I carried one in the Corps. And it's not nearly as easy to deal with as an AK. A 5 yr old could keep an AK running. And many probably have.

So have you considered the 7.62 AK? Or were you hoping to simply add another arm in 5.56? It's a very good idea. I mean the reliability of the AK with the commonality of the 5.56 round. It's attractive. But unfortunately not well executed.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by moab » Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:39 pm

JeeperCreeper wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:57 pm
JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:53 pm
JeeperCreeper wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:39 pm
JF89 wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:35 pm
Arsenal has a good reputation though and they have military contracts
What military contracts does Arsenal have?
Bulgaria, supposedly. Im trying to find sources besides other random forums but not much pops up. There are pics of Bulgarian troops carrying them though.
I think Arsenal in Vegas gets Bulgarian kits... I thought it was the other way around. Plus, there's that Arsenal firearms in Italy I believe that does the Russian Strike one version and the double barrel 1911.

But I could be mixing all that up.
Arsenal has some US Special Forces contracts. I've seen a public document posted someplace a few years ago. Yes. They get all their kit parts from Bulgaria. Right now they are the most respected production type AK on the market. Especially the 107 series. It usually retails for around $800. Followed by the WASR $700. There is of course Krebs and Rifle Dynamics. But I see those as private companies that build for individuals. And are on the very high end.

Arsenal makes great guns. And they have a reputation for a very good warranty program. I was going to mention this to Jeepercreeper. Because for another $100 over the RH10 or WASR you were looking at. You could have an Arsenal 107. But then I noticed Kvar is out of them. And their new price - or maybe it's their normal price and when they get them in stock mark them down to $799 - is $899. But I would check gun deals for sure. a lot of other places sell arsenals. And an Arsenal 107 is a hell of a lot better than a WASR or an RH10. I mean one has Arsenal Bulgaria backing it up. The other has Century Arms International backing it up. lol. And CAI doesn't have a great track record. I know those are generalities. But an ARsenal is far and away better than a WASR. So for another 100 bucks I'd go with the arsenal.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by delarey » Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:02 am

I may have mentioned this before...
I owned 2 converted Saiga's in .223. They were very accurate and reliable...depending on magazines!
I think the major shortcoming of .223/ 5.56 AK's in the US, are magazines. I was about to start work on my Saiga's to accept Galil mags, when I realized I'm going to better off just sticking to AR15's.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by RickOShea » Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:28 am

moab wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:25 pm
They both have their place though. And in the end I don't think everyone or their guns are going to make it in a paw. So I think, they'll be plenty to pick up along the way. In that case I pick an AK. It always works. No matter what.
Well, yeah....so long as you stay away from wheelbarrows full of mud. :rofl:







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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:09 am

RickOShea wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:28 am
moab wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:25 pm
They both have their place though. And in the end I don't think everyone or their guns are going to make it in a paw. So I think, they'll be plenty to pick up along the way. In that case I pick an AK. It always works. No matter what.
Well, yeah....so long as you stay away from wheelbarrows full of mud. :rofl:







What does "P.A.W" stand for?

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:11 am

Ive considered building a tactical wheelbarrow to carry my guns , I dont see the issue?

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:42 am

moab wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:25 pm
I know a little bit about this. And I had never walked down the rabbit hole that is 5.56 AK. Until just recently. When I owned an - albeit used - Arsenal 106 for a grand total of two weeks. Long story short? Avoid it. Unless you get a Galil. I joined a 5.56 AK only group on facebook. Just to get a feeling of what owners were experiences with their rifles. It has a long name. I'm sure it's the only one though. lol. AFter joining that group and talking to fellow builders. 5.56 in AK's just doesn't run reliably. I can't tell you why. They just always have feed issues. Even in a large group of 5.56 Ak owners. The amount of feed issues discussed. Was enough for me to be turned off to what should be the most reliable platform there is. So I would avoid a 5.56 unless it's the Galil. A Galil will run anything very very well. So believe it or not my vote is stick with an AR in 5.56. But a Galil would be a nice addition. Not sure about commonality in a paw though.

Why not an actual 7.62 AK? Any AKM will be interchangeable with any other AKM. And probably 70-80 percent of the AKs in the US are probably AKM. So you can have Polish, Romanian, East German, Bulgarian etc. etc. and you'll be able to swap parts. It's also easiest to find aftermarket items for things ike furniture.

Yugo's are a different story. They take different furniture. So it's not as easy (it is doable) to make it tactical. And they used to come as kits with non chromelined barrels (not enough chromium in Yugoslavia) that were usually shot out or filled with rust. So many older builds have not so great barrels. Nowadays you can't import kits with barrels and they've for the most part dried up for manufacturers. So kits are built with much better US Yugo chromelined barrels. (But don't be fooled. US barrels aren't the best for AKM's. I've been building on Polish hammer forged chromelined barrels for a while now. And they are much better than anything offered stateside. Or at least that is the more than general consensus.

I have both AK's and an AR. Speaking purely from a paw point of view. If you had to choose it would be AR. Because of the amount of sheer parts and ammo in the US already. Far outpaces the AK. But if you've got a stockpile of ammo. And plenty of parts. I'd pick the AK all day. More reliable. And that's not a slight on the AR. The AK pays for being more reliable. Tolerances aren't as tight. So it's not a tac driver like an AR can be. But it's accurate enough for the vast majority of combat distances one might find themselves in. And a lot more accurate than you might hear. I just saw a video someplace where a guy took an Arsenal 107 out to 200 or 300 yards and was hitting 2 moa? Don't quote me on that. But it was a lot more accurate than you might think. Certainly accurate enough to be combat effective. They both have their place though. And in the end I don't think everyone or their guns are going to make it in a paw. So I think, they'll be plenty to pick up along the way. In that case I pick an AK. It always works. No matter what. And you don't have time to tear down and clean an AR in the middle of a zombie fight. ;) I carried one in the Corps. And it's not nearly as easy to deal with as an AK. A 5 yr old could keep an AK running. And many probably have.

So have you considered the 7.62 AK? Or were you hoping to simply add another arm in 5.56? It's a very good idea. I mean the reliability of the AK with the commonality of the 5.56 round. It's attractive. But unfortunately not well executed.
Im more of an AR15 type of guy, If I lube it up properly it run and runs. I dont clean my AR15 either my Colt is around 7k with no cleaning just lube every couple hundred rounds.
I just wanted an AK just to have another platform in 5.56. I would like a 7.62 AK one of these days but it would not be my "goto" rifle. The AR is not nearly as unreliable as some people claim and the AK isnt not nearly as inaccurate as other people claim.

PWS has an interesting piston AR15 that uses a long stroke piston similar to the AK, maybe I will get one of them when I decide I need something different again.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by woodsghost » Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:23 pm

JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:42 am

The AR is not nearly as unreliable as some people claim and the AK isnt not nearly as inaccurate as other people claim.
In my experience ARs start failing when steel cased ammo with no cleaning. From what I've read, it seems ARs can run pretty reliably if one consistently uses quality ammo. I"d be interested in what ammo you are using. In my experience, using the wrong lubricant in cold temps also causes ARs to stop working.

AKs seem to run pretty reliably without much regard to quality of ammo. When I get together with friends and do big shoots, I can count on some ARs going down. Always. I never seek AKs go down, though I know they do. I have had 4 malfunctions in 8k+ rounds. In one, I'd stuffed too many rounds in the mag. In the other, the bullet went off slightly as it stripped from the mag and impacted the side of the barrel rather than entering the barrel. The other two I was using steel Tantal mags in a Bulgarian -74 and they stripped wrong and went wild. So now I only will trust -74 mags in a -74. I wonder if the Tantal is slightly different or if those mags were just very worn.

Actually, I had about 20 malfunctions with some Korean mags. But I don't count those, and don't ever use them now.

But those are my reactions to your experiences.
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:09 am

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by woodsghost » Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:28 pm

moab wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:25 pm
But if you've got a stockpile of ammo. And plenty of parts. I'd pick the AK all day. More reliable. And that's not a slight on the AR. The AK pays for being more reliable.
I'm with you when considering quality AKs. There are some less well made AKs I would not touch or carry into a PAW. I know you know which ones I"m talking about. But I know some less educated buyers can make mistakes in that department.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:42 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:23 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:42 am

The AR is not nearly as unreliable as some people claim and the AK isnt not nearly as inaccurate as other people claim.
In my experience ARs start failing when steel cased ammo with no cleaning. From what I've read, it seems ARs can run pretty reliably if one consistently uses quality ammo. I"d be interested in what ammo you are using. In my experience, using the wrong lubricant in cold temps also causes ARs to stop working.

AKs seem to run pretty reliably without much regard to quality of ammo. When I get together with friends and do big shoots, I can count on some ARs going down. Always. I never seek AKs go down, though I know they do. I have had 4 malfunctions in 8k+ rounds. In one, I'd stuffed too many rounds in the mag. In the other, the bullet went off slightly as it stripped from the mag and impacted the side of the barrel rather than entering the barrel. The other two I was using steel Tantal mags in a Bulgarian -74 and they stripped wrong and went wild. So now I only will trust -74 mags in a -74. I wonder if the Tantal is slightly different or if those mags were just very worn.

Actually, I had about 20 malfunctions with some Korean mags. But I don't count those, and don't ever use them now.

But those are my reactions to your experiences.
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:09 am

What does "P.A.W" stand for?
Post Apocalyptic World.
I run 62 gr American eagle, 77 gr Blackhills and I ran 2k of Tula through my Colt 6920. My Colt 6920 runs cheap ammo just fine, ymmv. Ive got nothing against AKs but I dont like 5.56 AKs. I was running mostly 62 gr stuff through the Arsenal and tried 77 grain but the rifle didnt like it.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by woodsghost » Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:10 pm

JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:42 pm

I run 62 gr American eagle, 77 gr Blackhills and I ran 2k of Tula through my Colt 6920. My Colt 6920 runs cheap ammo just fine, ymmv. Ive got nothing against AKs but I dont like 5.56 AKs. I was running mostly 62 gr stuff through the Arsenal and tried 77 grain but the rifle didnt like it.
Good information. Thanks.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:27 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:10 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:42 pm

I run 62 gr American eagle, 77 gr Blackhills and I ran 2k of Tula through my Colt 6920. My Colt 6920 runs cheap ammo just fine, ymmv. Ive got nothing against AKs but I dont like 5.56 AKs. I was running mostly 62 gr stuff through the Arsenal and tried 77 grain but the rifle didnt like it.
Good information. Thanks.
Out of curiosity, what ammo was your AR having issues feeding?

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by woodsghost » Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:02 pm

JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:27 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:10 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:42 pm

I run 62 gr American eagle, 77 gr Blackhills and I ran 2k of Tula through my Colt 6920. My Colt 6920 runs cheap ammo just fine, ymmv. Ive got nothing against AKs but I dont like 5.56 AKs. I was running mostly 62 gr stuff through the Arsenal and tried 77 grain but the rifle didnt like it.
Good information. Thanks.
Out of curiosity, what ammo was your AR having issues feeding?
I don't have an AR. I"m saving for one. I have been a stalwart AK guy since I got into rifles.

My experience comes from carbine class, shooting friend's ARs, and being around at big shoots where people bring their ARs. I have seen a LOT of ARs go down, and I have seen very few AKs malfunction. Some of that is likely because I have seen more ARs, period. That skews data if you are counting raw numbers. I"ve been paying more attention lately and I think most AR malfunctions are due to poor ammo or poor quality mags.

The ammo I most often see ARs choking on is steel cased Russian stuff and American Eagle. That may be a sign of quality, or a sign those ammos are cheaper and therefore those are what people buy when going to a class or big shoot. I don't know. Just my observations.

I"M reacting to the idea that "AKs are more reliable than ARs." This is repeated over and over. The US government has studies which argue otherwise. Youtube tests cast doubt, but at events I consistently see 1, often several, ARs go down with a malfunction. I just rarely (never in a group setting) seek AKs experience a malfunction. I think it has something to do with ammo and tolerances. Otherwise, I don't know how to explain my own experiences and the experiences of a lot of other people.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:34 pm

JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:27 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:10 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:42 pm

I run 62 gr American eagle, 77 gr Blackhills and I ran 2k of Tula through my Colt 6920. My Colt 6920 runs cheap ammo just fine, ymmv. Ive got nothing against AKs but I dont like 5.56 AKs. I was running mostly 62 gr stuff through the Arsenal and tried 77 grain but the rifle didnt like it.
Good information. Thanks.
Out of curiosity, what ammo was your AR having issues feeding?
I think the AK is slightly more reliable than a properly lubed AR15 and probably more robust due to having fewer and larger parts. The AR15 is sealed up though so less debris gets in but other then that I think A quality AK is slightly more reliable. I like both. Theres an article on AR15.com on high round count firearms that goes over both platforms.
One thing I like is the ammo availability, if shtf then quality 5.56 will be abudent due LE and Military use. Even without them 5.56 is pretty popular for competitive shooting and .223 is popular for hunting.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by woodsghost » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:02 pm

JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:34 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:27 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:10 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 12:42 pm

I run 62 gr American eagle, 77 gr Blackhills and I ran 2k of Tula through my Colt 6920. My Colt 6920 runs cheap ammo just fine, ymmv. Ive got nothing against AKs but I dont like 5.56 AKs. I was running mostly 62 gr stuff through the Arsenal and tried 77 grain but the rifle didnt like it.
Good information. Thanks.
Out of curiosity, what ammo was your AR having issues feeding?
I think the AK is slightly more reliable than a properly lubed AR15 and probably more robust due to having fewer and larger parts. The AR15 is sealed up though so less debris gets in but other then that I think A quality AK is slightly more reliable. I like both. Theres an article on AR15.com on high round count firearms that goes over both platforms.
One thing I like is the ammo availability, if shtf then quality 5.56 will be abudent due LE and Military use. Even without them 5.56 is pretty popular for competitive shooting and .223 is popular for hunting.
I know people say "ammo will be available because of mil & LEO." I just don't know if that is true. How much ammo do police departments stock? Per rifle? I bet not more than a few hundred rounds, though I bet academies stock it deep. But I bet they buy close to qualification time and don't sit on a lot of ammo between qualification cycles. I suspect most police departments are the same.

What about military units? How much do they stock? I have not been in any NG or other military armories. I bet they have more than LE, but I bet the military keeps most of it's ammo near whatever conflict zones are erupting. As I understand most people who qualify with rifles in Army units only get 60 rounds every ...year? Not a lot of ammo needs to be on hand to manage that.

I am starting to think the mountains of 5.56 exist only in select places, like military bases with frequent deployments. And if the world went nutty, I expect most of the ammo would be used by those local military units and their friends. Kinda the "don't bother raiding Walmart, someone bigger and badder will beat you to it." I don't think much of that ammo would make it into the hands of us little people. But it is a popular argument, so maybe it is valid. I don't know. I just started questioning it a few days ago.


Oh, and miltary (Army?) tests said the AK goes 1000 rounds between stoppages, while the AR goes 2000+ rounds between stoppages. So supposidly the AR is more reliable. But people I know who shoot a lot feel the AK is super reliable and some argue firecly that the AK has the edge. Others are not so convinced.

And we throw around qualifiers such as "quality AK, quality AR." I don't know. I'm still figuring it out.
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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by JF89 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:28 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:02 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:34 pm
JF89 wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:27 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:10 pm


Good information. Thanks.
Out of curiosity, what ammo was your AR having issues feeding?
I think the AK is slightly more reliable than a properly lubed AR15 and probably more robust due to having fewer and larger parts. The AR15 is sealed up though so less debris gets in but other then that I think A quality AK is slightly more reliable. I like both. Theres an article on AR15.com on high round count firearms that goes over both platforms.
One thing I like is the ammo availability, if shtf then quality 5.56 will be abudent due LE and Military use. Even without them 5.56 is pretty popular for competitive shooting and .223 is popular for hunting.
I know people say "ammo will be available because of mil & LEO." I just don't know if that is true. How much ammo do police departments stock? Per rifle? I bet not more than a few hundred rounds, though I bet academies stock it deep. But I bet they buy close to qualification time and don't sit on a lot of ammo between qualification cycles. I suspect most police departments are the same.

What about military units? How much do they stock? I have not been in any NG or other military armories. I bet they have more than LE, but I bet the military keeps most of it's ammo near whatever conflict zones are erupting. As I understand most people who qualify with rifles in Army units only get 60 rounds every ...year? Not a lot of ammo needs to be on hand to manage that.

I am starting to think the mountains of 5.56 exist only in select places, like military bases with frequent deployments. And if the world went nutty, I expect most of the ammo would be used by those local military units and their friends. Kinda the "don't bother raiding Walmart, someone bigger and badder will beat you to it." I don't think much of that ammo would make it into the hands of us little people. But it is a popular argument, so maybe it is valid. I don't know. I just started questioning it a few days ago.


Oh, and miltary (Army?) tests said the AK goes 1000 rounds between stoppages, while the AR goes 2000+ rounds between stoppages. So supposidly the AR is more reliable. But people I know who shoot a lot feel the AK is super reliable and some argue firecly that the AK has the edge. Others are not so convinced.

And we throw around qualifiers such as "quality AK, quality AR." I don't know. I'm still figuring it out.
Checkout Henderson Defense's high round count thresds over on arf.com, the AK seems to be slightly more reliable.

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Re: Anyone have experience with 5.56 AKs?

Post by delarey » Tue Dec 25, 2018 10:16 pm

I have seen AK's in terrible condition and they still fired. They were chambered in 7.62 though. That tapered case has a lot to do with the AK's reliability. Then add to that, the fact that AK's are heavily over gassed and you have a gun that will cycle yogurt...
.223 AK's are interesting and if anyone ever made one that I can trust and that used reliable magazines, I'd consider it. About the only .223/ 5.56 AK I'd trust, is a Galil and I'm not spending that kind of money!
AR's and reliability. Here's what I've encountered in my time around AR's. AR's start going down because:
1. Too small gas port or too little dwell time
2. Really crappy, underpowered ammo (and usually only in middy guns)
3. Crappy magazines (tapco, etc)

Someone mentioned his 6920 running anything he feeds it...well because the 6920 is pretty much over gassed - like just about any AK out there.
I don't like carbine gas AR's, because they are so over gassed, but I can't deny the fact that it makes for one helluva reliable AR. There's a reason the 6920 is the gold standard!
I'm in the process of putting together a 12.5" mid length AR pistol. I'm a bit apprehensive. I'm pretty sure I'm going to have issues getting it to run cheap ammo.

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