Apocalypse Shotgun - Single Shot Rossi - Completed Project

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Apocalypse Shotgun - Single Shot Rossi - Completed Project

Post by Red Dawn » Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:26 pm

UPDATE: Youtube Video of the shotgun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfXJdZI_ ... e=youtu.be" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I walked into a pawn shop I frequent today and walked out thirty dollars lighter and with a new (old) Rossi Single Shot in 12 gauge. Everything works fine except the hammer. I took it apart and did what I could with it. The hammer won't progress the seven to ten milimeters it needs to go to depress the firing pin and make the gun functional. Spring tension is good, nothing's jammed up in there. When I depress the trigger I can push the hammer all the way up to where it needs to be to push the pin. This has me stumped. I'm considering just tac welding a bit of steel to the hammer to just jump the gap and make it work. Anyone have any experience with these guys?

Here are some photos of it.

Image

This is me holding the hammer forward. The pin travels further than this, I just don't have three hands to take the pic.
Image

Nothing is caught down in there that I can see
Image

Image

I did want a new single shot for a Post Apocalyptic looking gun, now I have one. I just need to get it shooting.
Last edited by Red Dawn on Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:33 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by northernxposure » Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:35 pm

Check -

Does the trigger have full travel?
With the trigger at the rear of it's travel, can you actuate the hammer fully through it's motion?
Can you place the hammer into a cocked position on the sear?
Does this design have a half-cock position that the hammer is not clearing?

Look at this schematic:
https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufactur ... -41240.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

See part 23? Why is your's bent?

NXP

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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Red Dawn » Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:44 pm

Does the trigger have full travel?
Yes
With the trigger at the rear of it's travel, can you actuate the hammer fully through it's motion?
Yes
Can you place the hammer into a cocked position on the sear?
Yes
Does this design have a half-cock position that the hammer is not clearing?
not that I am aware of
northernxposure wrote:Check -

Look at this schematic:
https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufactur ... -41240.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

See part 23? Why is your's bent?

NXP
Well I'll be damned. I never noticed it was bent before and it's has enough of an angle to account for the missing milimeters. I think I may just need to order that part.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by TravisM.1 » Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:37 am

Are you sure it isnt supposed to be that way? Ive got a couple single shot shotguns, and they all do what you describe, but work fine. Its a transfer bar safety kinda deal, so you can drop the hammer safely after it disengages the sear, by simply removing your finger from the trigger.

Id take it out and try it before I tore it apart or did any welding, if I were you.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Confucius » Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:48 am

TravisM.1 wrote:Are you sure it isnt supposed to be that way? Ive got a couple single shot shotguns, and they all do what you describe, but work fine. Its a transfer bar safety kinda deal, so you can drop the hammer safely after it disengages the sear, by simply removing your finger from the trigger.

Id take it out and try it before I tore it apart or did any welding, if I were you.
^This^

It's a safety feature (at least on all the break action shotguns I've fired) otherwise you'd run the possibility of setting off the primer from dropping the hammer or just closing the action with the hammer down. Definitely try it out first.

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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by MacAttack » Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:11 am

Its supposed to be that way.

I believe its called a rebounding hammer and it was done that way so that you didn't accidentally hit the back of the hammer and fire the gun.
One of the first trigger/hammer safety blocks.

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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Red Dawn » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:03 am

Confucius wrote:
TravisM.1 wrote:Are you sure it isnt supposed to be that way? Ive got a couple single shot shotguns, and they all do what you describe, but work fine. Its a transfer bar safety kinda deal, so you can drop the hammer safely after it disengages the sear, by simply removing your finger from the trigger.

Id take it out and try it before I tore it apart or did any welding, if I were you.
^This^

It's a safety feature (at least on all the break action shotguns I've fired) otherwise you'd run the possibility of setting off the primer from dropping the hammer or just closing the action with the hammer down. Definitely try it out first.
MacAttack wrote:Its supposed to be that way.

I believe its called a rebounding hammer and it was done that way so that you didn't accidentally hit the back of the hammer and fire the gun.
One of the first trigger/hammer safety blocks.
TravisM.1 wrote:Are you sure it isnt supposed to be that way? Ive got a couple single shot shotguns, and they all do what you describe, but work fine. Its a transfer bar safety kinda deal, so you can drop the hammer safely after it disengages the sear, by simply removing your finger from the trigger.

Id take it out and try it before I tore it apart or did any welding, if I were you.
The rebounding part makes sense because that's exactly what it does. Guess I'll try it out first.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:07 am

It's a rebounding hammer. My H&R, Bay State, and FIE singles are all just like this.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Red Dawn » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:10 am

Well I'll be hornswaggled and a few other southern phrases.

It damn well worked. I cut apart a shell and removed the powder and shot then with only the primer fired it. Loud as a pop gun but it went off just fine. Thank you very much, I'd have messed it up by putting a piece of steel on it. Extractor won't function but it probably just needs a good cleaning or a replacement. Hot damn.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Red Dawn » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:14 am

Doctorr Fabulous wrote:It's a rebounding hammer. My H&R, Bay State, and FIE singles are all just like this.
My H&R does not have that, I don't recall if the others I've owned do. Well the owner and I both thought it was broken but it works. When I pull the trigger on my H&R the hammer stays on the pin until I release it.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:27 am

IDK how those extract/eject. When you take it apart, take some pics. Often the extractors/ejectors on those things are the first to go. I need to eventually do some welding on one of mine.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Red Dawn » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:29 am

Doctorr Fabulous wrote:IDK how those extract/eject. When you take it apart, take some pics. Often the extractors/ejectors on those things are the first to go. I need to eventually do some welding on one of mine.
Same way they do with the H&R. It's really hard to close because the extractor needs so much force against it to push it down. I think I'll punch that pin out and give it a good cleaning and put it back. That should fix it. Now I just need to modify it to look like it came from the nuclear wasteland.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by MacAttack » Tue Feb 05, 2013 10:46 am

I would make a Cheap cheap hand amateur made scrap leather scabbard for it to go on your back. Maybe from one leg of a goodwill pair of leather pants. Leave the waist band attached to go over one shoulder and under the other arm.
Maybe a sheet metal patch on the stock. Like the stock broke at some point and you needed to hold it together with sheet metal and small nails.
A miss fitting but pad from some other gun.
Put your name or the name of the gun in thumb tacks in the stock.
Grip tape or strap the front stock on.
An old leather belt for a shoulder strap.
A small wood block and duct tape to attach a flashlight to the barrel just in front of the hand grip.




Afterward just don't run around in chaps asking for Candalinies hand.

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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi (Question)

Post by Red Dawn » Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:59 am

MacAttack wrote:I would make a Cheap cheap hand amateur made scrap leather scabbard for it to go on your back. Maybe from one leg of a goodwill pair of leather pants. Leave the waist band attached to go over one shoulder and under the other arm.
Maybe a sheet metal patch on the stock. Like the stock broke at some point and you needed to hold it together with sheet metal and small nails.
A miss fitting but pad from some other gun.
Put your name or the name of the gun in thumb tacks in the stock.
Grip tape or strap the front stock on.
An old leather belt for a shoulder strap.
A small wood block and duct tape to attach a flashlight to the barrel just in front of the hand grip.
Afterward just don't run around in chaps asking for Candalinies hand.
I've taken some suggestions from friends and here's two pics that I think will settle what I have in mind. Some of your suggestions are in there also. Thinking about the patch, may or may not do the metal patch.

Here's the shotgun as is minus butt plate. I'm going to cut a new one from this old frying man and use the Karate belt for a sling.
Image

I think this sums it up nicely.
Image
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by nonamesaint » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:05 am

Looking good Daniel-son.

Is the stock hollow? Would make for a nice place for a mini BOB.

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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:06 am

1. Bailing wire, not dryer clamps
2. Pics of your muzzle doodad!
3. Old seatbelt instead of karate belt, with the bucles as a "QD"
4. Don't forget the heatshields made of beercans and some 550 cord on the barrel.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by TravisM.1 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:09 am

:?
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by Red Dawn » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:11 am

nonamesaint wrote:Looking good Daniel-son.

Is the stock hollow? Would make for a nice place for a mini BOB.
It's not but I was thinking about that. My H&R has a hollow stock I keep a survival kit in. I'm going to get around 8" insert for 30-30 winchester since I have a lot of shells for that caliber and use that as a partial rifle.
Doctorr Fabulous wrote:1. Bailing wire, not dryer clamps
2. Pics of your muzzle doodad!
3. Old seatbelt instead of karate belt, with the bucles as a "QD"
4. Don't forget the heatshields made of beercans and some 550 cord on the barrel.
I wanted to use copper wire with solder but I decided against it. The grip is a snap off and if I want to take off the barrel I can do that easily with the clamps. With wire i'd have to bend it out and bend it back. The karate belt is what I'm set on simply because it's what I bought. That and it's thick enough to take a lot of abuse. 550 cord on the barrel of my survival H&R partially melted after 50 quick birdshot rounds. Granted that was a lot of heat in a short time not typical of what I'd actually use on the shotgun but I wanted to see what repeated firing would do to my shoulder with the light stock on that gun. I don't want any 550 cord on this because its suppose to look pieced together from what was available instead of purpose built for survival. The heat shield may be an idea. I'll keep that in mind.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by Red Dawn » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:17 am

TravisM.1 wrote::?
I have long wanted a gun that looks like it was repaired and pieced together in the wasteland. This gun is half there already. No one expected it to work. The shop owner was thinking about junking it until I bought it. I could do the gentlemanly thing and restore it to full condition or I could do what I want to do and really give it some back woods lovin.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by MacAttack » Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:16 am

Why does everyone cut the barrel back to the legal limit?

What advantage does it give you over a 20 inch barrel or a 24 inch?

90% of the time you will not be using the weapon in tight confined spaces and a single is the last weapon you want in that situation.

Plus its a .410 wouldn't you want as much barrel as possible to keep that little shot wad as tight as possible for as long as possible? Or at least the longer barrel for better long range(50 yard) slug accuracy?


If it was a 12guage double I can see cutting it back and making it a room clearing fire spitting hell broom.


If your going to cut the barrel back as far as possible I would cut the stock back as far as possible also.

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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by Red Dawn » Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:59 am

MacAttack wrote:Why does everyone cut the barrel back to the legal limit?

What advantage does it give you over a 20 inch barrel or a 24 inch?

90% of the time you will not be using the weapon in tight confined spaces and a single is the last weapon you want in that situation.

Plus its a .410 wouldn't you want as much barrel as possible to keep that little shot wad as tight as possible for as long as possible? Or at least the longer barrel for better long range(50 yard) slug accuracy?


If it was a 12guage double I can see cutting it back and making it a room clearing fire spitting hell broom.


If your going to cut the barrel back as far as possible I would cut the stock back as far as possible also.
I did it on my Survival Shotgun so that I could tie it to my pack and have a lot fewer inches sticking out. I'm doing it to this one because I want it shortened up. I've killed Rabbits and Doves with my Survival Shotgun up to 25 yards no problem. The cut barrel does increase spread. Cutting the stock down also is not recommended in my opinion. Firing S&B 12 pellet 00 buck loads puts a hell of a hurt in recoil on your hand and shoulder in a light shotgun. Off the shoulder they damn near broke my wrist in my Survival Shotgun. On the shoulder it was still a load to bear. This weapon will weigh slightly more but it's still going to be a pain in the ass with recoil. The stock length is good for me right now.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by TravisM.1 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:57 am

Pretty much once the choke is cut off, that extra length isnt gonna do anything, so it might as well be as short as possible.

ETA1- Yeah, light, short PGO shotguns shooting heavy loads arent as much fun as they sound. I shot a 3" magnum 00buck load out of a sawed off H&R a buddy of mine had, on a dare once. Without a doubt, the worst hand-held recoil Ive ever experienced. Worse than any rifle-cartridge contender handgun Ive shot.

ETA2- Dont forget theres a legal minimum length requirement, too. And on a single shot or other break-open,you dont have the receiver length to factor in. So with the barrel cut to 18-19", the stock might be damned near full length. You dont want to be the next Randy Weaver.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:35 pm

TravisM.1 wrote:Pretty much once the choke is cut off, that extra length isnt gonna do anything, so it might as well be as short as possible.

ETA1- Yeah, light, short PGO shotguns shooting heavy loads arent as much fun as they sound. I shot a 3" magnum 00buck load out of a sawed off H&R a buddy of mine had, on a dare once. Without a doubt, the worst hand-held recoil Ive ever experienced. Worse than any rifle-cartridge contender handgun Ive shot.

ETA2- Dont forget theres a legal minimum length requirement, too. And on a single shot or other break-open,you dont have the receiver length to factor in. So with the barrel cut to 18-19", the stock might be damned near full length. You dont want to be the next Randy Weaver.
1. Aguila/Centurion shorty shells.
2. nah. 18.5" barrel mean you only need 8" of stock. With nost singles and doubles, you get a good 12-16" or stock on them.

I will say that changing a break action to a pistol grip requires some serious work. You have to reengineer the system that holds the stock on.
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Re: Reparing a Single Shot Rossi/Apocalypse Shotgun

Post by TravisM.1 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:23 pm

I will say that changing a break action to a pistol grip requires some serious work. You have to reengineer the system that holds the stock on.
Definitely. The shape of the grip on the stocks most of them have doesnt lend itself to being shortened very well, not if you want effective recoil control, anyway.
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