Arming a Group

General discussions regarding topics that aren't covered in one of the other sub-forums. NO DISCUSSION OF POLITICS!

Moderators: ZS Global Moderators, ZS Postal Match Officers

User avatar
Festus Hagen
* * * * *
Posts: 1540
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 7:56 pm
Location: New York

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Festus Hagen » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:06 pm

Yeah, don't underestimate the power of will- and a nearly endless supply of expendable labor.

Not that *I* would ever consider a human life "expendable"
p.s. Holy Derail!


Domino wrote:In the Vietnam war the U.S. lost some 60,000 men total in combat. Around 2 million North Vietnamese were killed. You decide who took an ass beating in that war.
wikpedia wrote:The war exacted a huge human cost in terms of fatalities, including 3 to 4 million Vietnamese from both sides, 1.5 to 2 million Laotians and Cambodians, and 58,159 U.S. soldiers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“What do you say we gather the camp elders; Be perplexed amongst friends?” – Al Swearengen (Deadwood)

User avatar
Brendan Sullivan
* * * *
Posts: 825
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 1:29 am
Location: Sacramento

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Brendan Sullivan » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:10 pm

Determined (especially armed) civilians can throw some heinous wrenches into the plans of military forces intent on occupying anywhere. Look at any civil war or any occupation in a third-world country in the last hundred years. No, civilians do not destroy military personnel on a one-for-one basis, but they sure as hell make things tough. The only casualties my unit took in the sandbox were from civilian IED's, not from a determined, trained army. That's not what this is about anyway. This is a survival discussion on a survival forum, not an anti-government forum.

Organisation and baby steps trumps the "I'm the baddest motherfucker" attitude any day. Remember what Admiral Yamamoto said about invading the mainland U.S. and give this guy his due props.

User avatar
Sig_Ocelot
* * * * *
Posts: 2526
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:53 pm

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Sig_Ocelot » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:13 pm

Kalash_NICH_ov wrote: You were with the most bad ass military around fighting a bunch of farmers. You cant compaire a bunch of camel headers to exmilitary, hunters, target shooters, ect. who are determined to defend their home and country. Im not trying to diss you or what your saying, but we're not going to be fighting armored vehicles and the like. A high point is plenty fine for your wife to put a hole in hostile
I don't know who I fought. I do know they lacked discipline, didn't know shit about tactics, had a hard time fighting and maneuvering (something which Marines kick serious ass at), they loved to bunch up into nice little groups (lollercoaster would soon follow), the command structure was non existent. In short, they were terrible, terrible fighters. They even sucked at setting up ambushes... something I think our survivalists would have trouble with also.

That said, all of the men I fought thought they were sticking up for their country and were doing the right thing. They were all well armed, better than most of our populace is. Some of the insurgents I fought were ex-military, some where taxi drivers, some where just kids. The Bedouins were pretty rare, most Iraqis live in cities, not camel herding groups of nomadic villages.

Lastly, APCs can show up when you least expect it. As can Cobras or Apaches, or a smart bomb. You don't choose when to fight them. It's a little trick we played all the time in '04, we'd go on patrol, and when things acted up, we'd call in artillery or an air strike. Problem solved.

An occupying force would also start to ask your neighbors what you do, where you are at all times of the days, etc. You'd get found out quickly. I used to hand out $5s to kids all the time, and they'd rat their neighbors out to me. Don't think the same thing won't happen if we ever got invaded.

Lastly, the Ewok nation is a mighty and proud people. They are very fearsome, just ask the Empire.
Rush2112 wrote: Somehow I see this phrase ending a lot of sentences in the future:

"...And that's how Sig lost his [eyesight/fingers]."

User avatar
Sig_Ocelot
* * * * *
Posts: 2526
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:53 pm

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Sig_Ocelot » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:19 pm

Domino wrote:In the Vietnam war the U.S. lost some 60,000 men total in combat. Around 2 million North Vietnamese were killed. You decide who took an ass beating in that war.

Must... resist... must be politically correct... .... .... don't post picture........ *click*

Image
Rush2112 wrote: Somehow I see this phrase ending a lot of sentences in the future:

"...And that's how Sig lost his [eyesight/fingers]."

User avatar
SMoAF
ZS Lifetime Member
ZS Lifetime Member
Posts: 4932
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:29 am
Location: Somewhere on the Eastern Seaboard

Re: Arming a Group

Post by SMoAF » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:52 pm

Kalash_NICH_ov wrote:Afghanistan is the 70's didnt turn out well for the Soviets. Vietnam didnt turn out well for the Americans. Besides.
Both the Afghanis and the North Vietnamese had a world superpower supporting them behind the scenes with highly advanced weaponry, and I'm not talking SMLEs and AKs. They both basically had sanctuaries that were largely off limits for political reasons and that generally were not violated by the Americans and the Soviets. Even so, they took horrific losses, IMHO, FAR more horrific than it would take to turn neighbors against neighbors if it happened here.
"I can't take up my musket and fight'em now no more,
but I ain't gonna love'em, now that is certain sure,
and I don't want no pardon for what I was and am.
I won't be Reconstructed, and I don't care a damn."

ChristisKing
*
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:24 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Shawn of the Dead

Re: Arming a Group

Post by ChristisKing » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:56 pm

Ok we really need to start thinking about what we're saying here.

I think that the argument has gone from how are we doing as a group of 30 people to is a surplus bolt gun going to cut in the hands of a suvivalist against an invading force.

I think we can all agree on something here and that is train and get better with what you have. Also strive to always have better gear.
We kick butt in Iraq and Afghanistan not just because of air superiority (I know that helps) but because we are the greatest equiped and trained Military in the world hands down. Our soldiers have body armor that stops 7.62 ammo of all lengths. We have rifles with optics that tell you where the bullet will drop at 500 meters and we have men who know how to engage the enemy in force with a minimum loss of life. We have night vision the enemy doesn't. We have all sorts of advantages the enemy doesn't.

My point is this yes it is good that you have nagants, but you should always strive to aquire better equipment to give you even more of an edge.
My other point is if you have nagants then dog gone it be the best darn nagant shooters around and learn how to deploy them in force since you have 30 people. When the day comes that you upgrade to semi autos then learn how to use those too.

You guys are doing great just don't fall short of striving to be better equiped and better trained.

User avatar
Kalash_NICH_ov
*
Posts: 82
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 8:48 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Dawn of the Dead(remake), 28 Days & 28 Weeks later, Panic in Year Zero
Location: Yuma, AZ...Its hot as ****

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Kalash_NICH_ov » Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:29 pm

In the Vietnam war the U.S. lost some 60,000 men total in combat. Around 2 million North Vietnamese were killed. You decide who took an ass beating in that war.
Im saying anyone got as ass beating, just that simple people with simple weapons can fight and do damage
Determined (especially armed) civilians can throw some heinous wrenches into the plans of military forces intent on occupying anywhere. Look at any civil war or any occupation in a third-world country in the last hundred years. No, civilians do not destroy military personnel on a one-for-one basis, but they sure as hell make things tough. The only casualties my unit took in the sandbox were from civilian IED's, not from a determined, trained army. That's not what this is about anyway. This is a survival discussion on a survival forum, not an anti-government forum.

Organisation and baby steps trumps the "I'm the baddest motherfucker" attitude any day. Remember what Admiral Yamamoto said about invading the mainland U.S. and give this guy his due props.
Determined (especially armed) civilians can throw some heinous wrenches into the plans of military forces intent on occupying anywhere. Look at any civil war or any occupation in a third-world country in the last hundred years. No, civilians do not destroy military personnel on a one-for-one basis, but they sure as hell make things tough. The only casualties my unit took in the sandbox were from civilian IED's, not from a determined, trained army. That's not what this is about anyway. This is a survival discussion on a survival forum, not an anti-government forum.

Organisation and baby steps trumps the "I'm the baddest motherfucker" attitude any day. Remember what Admiral Yamamoto said about invading the mainland U.S. and give this guy his due props.
I don't know who I fought. I do know they lacked discipline, didn't know shit about tactics, had a hard time fighting and maneuvering (something which Marines kick serious ass at), they loved to bunch up into nice little groups (lollercoaster would soon follow), the command structure was non existent. In short, they were terrible, terrible fighters. They even sucked at setting up ambushes... something I think our survivalists would have trouble with also.

That said, all of the men I fought thought they were sticking up for their country and were doing the right thing. They were all well armed, better than most of our populace is. Some of the insurgents I fought were ex-military, some where taxi drivers, some where just kids. The Bedouins were pretty rare, most Iraqis live in cities, not camel herding groups of nomadic villages.

Lastly, APCs can show up when you least expect it. As can Cobras or Apaches, or a smart bomb. You don't choose when to fight them. It's a little trick we played all the time in '04, we'd go on patrol, and when things acted up, we'd call in artillery or an air strike. Problem solved.

An occupying force would also start to ask your neighbors what you do, where you are at all times of the days, etc. You'd get found out quickly. I used to hand out $5s to kids all the time, and they'd rat their neighbors out to me. Don't think the same thing won't happen if we ever got invaded.
Alright. So can we agree that 30 people armed with mosins can defend themselves from typical PAW threats (raiders, ZED, etc), but not a standing military force, even though if said group of 30 did participate in fighting an army, would be like having lice. IE, doesnt do much, but is a problem and can eventually be killed with hard work. (for the record. I have never had lice)
I been gone way too long

User avatar
Dave_M
* * * * *
Posts: 15976
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 2:30 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Dave_M » Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:36 pm

Kalash_NICH_ov wrote:Alright. So can we agree that 30 people armed with mosins can defend themselves from typical PAW threats (raiders, ZED, etc), but not a standing military force, even though if said group of 30 did participate in fighting an army, would be like having lice. IE, doesnt do much, but is a problem and can eventually be killed with hard work. (for the record. I have never had lice)
It all depends on 6 things:

-Luck
-Training
-Equipment
-Training
-Luck
-Luck
Image
Dave Merrill
Instructor for MilCopp Tactical LLC.

Rifle first. Rifle last. Rifle always.
Civilian Scout wrote:No one buys a Taurus because it's the best option available.

User avatar
Sounds
* *
Posts: 107
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2008 7:39 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Sounds » Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:22 pm

To the OP,

Good for you, working as a group you have IMHO huge advantages over someone who is flying solo.

Think about comms.

Regards, Sounds

User avatar
Paladin1
* * * * *
Posts: 4451
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 12:56 pm
Location: Central Ohio

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Paladin1 » Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:44 pm

Sig_Ocelot wrote:I've seen what a 'group of friends' armed with automatics & RPGs can do against a professional, trained army. The 'group of friends' can't hit shit, and they are quickly taken out. If a Russian, Chinese, or Ewok army ever rolled into the US, we'd all ready be f***ed. A group of thirty people who really don't know how to shoot accurately past 100 yards armed with Mosins would be slaughtered, even if they were armed with AKM's, RPG's, and SKS's.... I can't imagine the outcome being any different. An APC with a 25 or 30mm cannon would make short work of any group.

I can't help but shake my head listening to some peoples posts about arming their wives with Hi-Points in a PAW.
I don't know how this got turned from a PAW survival situation into combat against trained military units with armor :roll:

But you're certainly right, people with 9mm carbines, or anything else you have in your safe isn't going to prevail against the armor and air power of a trained army. So we probably shouldn't bother(?)

However, I don't beleive a mass invasion of APC's with 30mm cannons, tanks, gunships, etc. is the kind of scenario the OP (or me for that matter) are preparing for. I don't beleive (well, I hope not) anyone here is stupid enough to think they can successfully engage trained troops and armor with small arms.
WWSD?

User avatar
by-the-throat
* * * * *
Posts: 1200
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:46 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Dawn of the Dead (2004)
Dead Alive
Land of the Dead
Army of Darkness
Zombieland
Location: New Dunwich, Indiana

Re: Arming a Group

Post by by-the-throat » Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:09 pm

Taking on a professional military is a little beyond the scope of what our group can realistically accomplish, no argument here.

We are prepping more for "The Golden Horde" who are likely to be a disorganized, unruly and sporadically armed mob who figure they deserve what's in our deep larder. We train as often as budget and time allows, which is fairly often because group shooting tends to be our stress relief (nothing kills the workaday blues like a rolling volley against some inoffensive milk jugs) but we are a long way short of professional military, but many many many steps above Joe Sixpack and his gang banger pals. In the land of the blind, and all that.

I do stock some AP/Incendiary rounds for hard targets, although that is a personal choice on my part rather than SOP.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed
Last Call, Last Stand

User avatar
The Reaper
* *
Posts: 161
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:59 pm
Location: Southwest MS

Re: Arming a Group

Post by The Reaper » Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:56 am

Gatorfarmer wrote:
nihilist117 wrote: 3) With a group that big you may want to look into sharing the cost of an NFA license for a member so that you can acquire some heavy weapons. A couple of machine guns/grenade launchers/cannons would be an excellent deterrent against raids.
Cannons and grenade launchers are actually destructive devices. Unless of course one has a muzzle loading cannon, which isn't an NFA weapon at all. There's a 200 transfer tax on the weapon itself for D.D.s, and the same tax on each round of anti-personnel ammunition for one. The cheapest transferable Class III firearms meanwhile (some sort of Mac or Sten build POS probably) will cost as much as the 30 odd MNs. A good muzzle loading Napoleon and carriage meanwhile will cost about as much as a nice Audi. That might be reaching a bit given the stated income levels of the OP's group.
Not to mention NFA licenses open the door for snooping by .gov (any more than usually do).
This signature says more than most people say in their entire lives.

User avatar
Kalash_NICH_ov
*
Posts: 82
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 8:48 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Dawn of the Dead(remake), 28 Days & 28 Weeks later, Panic in Year Zero
Location: Yuma, AZ...Its hot as ****

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Kalash_NICH_ov » Sat Oct 18, 2008 1:52 pm

I don't know how this got turned from a PAW survival situation into combat against trained military units with armor [:roll:]

But you're certainly right, people with 9mm carbines, or anything else you have in your safe isn't going to prevail against the armor and air power of a trained army. So we probably shouldn't bother(?)

However, I don't beleive a mass invasion of APC's with 30mm cannons, tanks, gunships, etc. is the kind of scenario the OP (or me for that matter) are preparing for. I don't beleive (well, I hope not) anyone here is stupid enough to think they can successfully engage trained troops and armor with small arms.
I agree. nobody is saying to take on armor. Just that mosins are sufficient enough for this group to defend themselves with against raiders, zed, looters, etc
I been gone way too long

User avatar
BEar667
* * * * *
Posts: 1005
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:00 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Pick one
Location: Norwalk, Iowa
Contact:

Re: Arming a Group

Post by BEar667 » Sat Oct 18, 2008 2:03 pm

Here's my take:

To the OP, congratulations on your endevers! Work with what you have, become the best damn Mosin armed group that you can be. Upgrade when, and if you all can, and not one second before. I personally feel that you are doing more for your group than most of the people are going to be doing should TSHTF. Having said that, I want to say that I agree with NFA, get some .22 rifles and train with them, as money allows, have every one in you group (that is age appropriate) train with them.

Don't worry about ROF right now, just practice, practice, practice!

I agree that SKS's and Ak's are great ( I'm not a fan of the M-16 clones due to cost of upkeep, but that's personal) but for the "here and Now" you are doing fan-damn-tastic.
KØMRD General Class

NRA MEMBER

Parate Omnes Casus!

User avatar
SMoAF
ZS Lifetime Member
ZS Lifetime Member
Posts: 4932
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:29 am
Location: Somewhere on the Eastern Seaboard

Re: Arming a Group

Post by SMoAF » Sat Oct 18, 2008 2:54 pm

The Reaper wrote:Not to mention NFA licenses open the door for snooping by .gov (any more than usually do).
I used to be a lot more concerned about invasions of privacy WRT NFA weapons. Then I got an FFL/SOT, and stopped worrying so much.

The wonderful thing about America is that you can do damned near anything legally, provided that you do it the right way.
"I can't take up my musket and fight'em now no more,
but I ain't gonna love'em, now that is certain sure,
and I don't want no pardon for what I was and am.
I won't be Reconstructed, and I don't care a damn."

User avatar
MacAttack
* * * * *
Posts: 2992
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:11 am

Re: Arming a Group

Post by MacAttack » Mon Oct 20, 2008 12:17 am

As much as I dislike the SKS/AK family of weapons I can't find anything inherently wrong with a group standardizing to them.

I personally don't like like them. But I have an AK variant anyways. With 10, 30's, a 75rd drum, and a bayonet. Plus other important "spare" parts.
If it wasn't for the fact that my friends already had them I wouldn't have gotten one.

For the OP. Use those MN as long as possible. Save the brass to reload. And upgrade to a more standard firearm as soon as possible. As previously mentioned. SKS or AK as budget allows.
15 years ago I would have only standardized to .223/5.56 but now that there are so many AK variants around the US they fill the bill just fine.


Keep the MN around for trade or arming new recruits.



But for any distance weapon I would only look at .308's for any serious weapons. Again we are back to a good solid bolt action with a great scope. Remember to spend as much (if not way more) on the optics than you spend on the fire arm.
Anything in .308 with a solid frame or barrel mounted scope.
The AK family does come in .308 now so familiarity would then work for you. But a bolt gun is the best choice for your budget.
Actually at that point you could just worry about common calibers and let each 'sniper' worry about their own weapon choice.

As for pistol's, 9mm and .45 is the only way to go. With the 9mm winning out due to commonality of ammo.
Go with the statistically most common fire arm thats the quality you want in a group weapon and is still affordable.

Going with 9mm opens up the whole possibility of Subguns also. From the cheap stens or semi(mac) M11 (Get the ones using old cheap steal sten mags) to the expensive Uzi and HK's.


Stay away from plastics. Stick with metal and wood for your firearms as best as possible. Woods replaceable and metals last a hundred years.


As for shotguns stick to cheap pumps in 12 gage. Smooth bores only. You already have rifles for hunting longer then 50 yards. And if you go with long barrels you can always cut them down when needed. Or spend the cash and buy short barrels. (I cringe at that thought seeing as they are normally 1/2 to 2/3'rds the cost of a used gun.)



Once you have a weapons plan laid out for the future look into tools.
Tools for everything. Wood working,plumbing, and automotive to electronics and gun smithing. Don't forget a nice well rounded set of lock smith tools with automotive door jimmies.(most of these tools can be made at home following pictures) A little practice and you'll find very few locks you can't get into if you loose the keys.

Medical supplies are only useful if you have the people who know how to use them. Get those people in your group or just stick with the first aid stuff. You stand a good chance of killing someone doing anything more than just stitching up a small cut. Leave each members personal medication to each member. But keep the possibility open to buying that as a group in bulk also. Those members who need insulin might be able to buy as a group. The same with heart meds and such.
But we all know the sad limitations of that. Eventually those members will not be around when their needed meds run out.

Foods a given. Get all you can for the group in bulk and make sure members bring their perishables from home (if possible)when they rally at the compound. Its not like the zombies will need it.




Holy Cow! I wrote way to much. Sorry for the long read over things most people already know.

User avatar
Jamie
ZS Member
ZS Member
Posts: 9345
Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:06 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: DOTD04, Special Dead, Shaun of the Dead, 28 ______ Later
Location: Adirondacks, NY

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Jamie » Mon Oct 20, 2008 5:07 am

I was out with a group of ZSers this weekend, and got a chance to fire a mosin nagant for the first time...it was a hoot!

It was less boomy/hurty than I had anticipated...pretty much equivalent to my 30.06 and/or my 870 with hot ammo...

I found the bolt configuration to be a little odd, although I assume that I would get used to it...

I also put about 100 rounds through my SKS, and was able to reach out to shoot (stationary) shooting clays placed at roughly 50/75/100/120 yards from the standing position using the iron sights...with more practice, I assume that I could stretch this out to 150-200 yards of effective de-zombification...

Jamie
"I don't want to survive. I want to live. " - Captain B. McCrea

Image
My Blog and website, dealing largely with my writing projects...I've published two novels, "Here Be Monsters" and "Caretakers", along with a pair of eBooks, "Mickey Slips" and "Bound for Home"...check them out!

DeviantSaint
* *
Posts: 161
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 6:03 am
Location: Austin, Texas
Contact:

Re: Arming a Group

Post by DeviantSaint » Mon Oct 20, 2008 10:14 am

I've been reading this thread and here is my two cents.

Keep the Mosins, they're good for back-ups, distance work, and if your numbers swell beyond what you had originally planned for. (you meet stragglers or team up with other groups or individuals).
Instead of buying SKS's just get AKs. They're not that much more expensive, they are easier to handle and have tactical advantages that make them desirable.

If the choice is between buying a pistol or an AK, get the AK. There should be no choice between buying a pistol and a mosin, get both.

The real key here is to understand the limitations of the weapons you are using and to modify your tactics and strategy to suit them. Mosins are great for hunting and distance work. that's what you use them for. The ak-47 (and semi-auto clones) are robust, reliable, but have a limited range. That's not as much of a detriment as people think since commonly firefights happen at around or inside 200 meters.

When you're fighting at 200m or even less, it's fast handling that is going to make a big difference, that's where the AK has a distinct advantage over the SKS. I would also recommend upgrading the AK sights, if you can't afford a mojo peep sight, then just braze, weld, or expoxy a washer to the rear sight and you have a poor man's apeture sight.

I've been in three combat tours and when using my rifle (m16/m4) I have never gone off of Semi-Auto. I personally am more comfortable with more target control than having burst fire. My finger was plenty fast enough to get the rounds on the target and to even do light suppression work. So unless you've got a dedicated Squad Automatic Weapon (which in your situation may not be efficient or really useful) then don't worry about the class III purchases.

and practice practice practice.

there are also plenty of aftermarket parts and modifications for both the Mosin and the AK that will help modernize the weapon. Just don't think that you have to spend too much on gimmicks and stick to learning how to handle the weapon well.

Training overcomes equipment.

Also, right now as for pistols, I think you might want to look at Rock Island .45's. They are dirt dirt cheap and reliable, it might end up the way to go. You can find them for sale at centerfire systems. They also had really cheap Arcus 9mm's (a hi power knock off) but they sold out.

good luck.
"Information is Ammunition... LOCK AND LOAD!"

User avatar
MacAttack
* * * * *
Posts: 2992
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:11 am

Re: Arming a Group

Post by MacAttack » Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:02 pm

Are these HighPoint prices correct?


I've never used one and actually never heard of them.


But at those prices for 9mm pistols you almost can't go wrong if you want new.

Ufdyixcaff

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Ufdyixcaff » Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:08 pm

MacAttack wrote:But at those prices for 9mm pistols you almost can't go wrong if you want new.
Yes... Yes you can.

User avatar
Dave_M
* * * * *
Posts: 15976
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 2:30 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Dave_M » Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:14 pm

MacAttack wrote:But at those prices for 9mm pistols you almost can't go wrong if you want new.
Yes, yes you can. I suggest you go a little light research before coming to a conclusion based solely on price.

There are other, better options that do not cost an arm and a leg. The S&W Sigma is an example of this.

The Hi-Point carbines are pretty good with the exception they only accept 10 round mags.
Image
Dave Merrill
Instructor for MilCopp Tactical LLC.

Rifle first. Rifle last. Rifle always.
Civilian Scout wrote:No one buys a Taurus because it's the best option available.

User avatar
GuNs|iNgEr
ZS Lifetime Member
ZS Lifetime Member
Posts: 347
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2008 12:25 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Shaun of the dead
Location: DFW, Texas

Re: Arming a Group

Post by GuNs|iNgEr » Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:43 pm

I would go with the SKS.
ZS fleet number ZS-0168
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ YALL!
Image

User avatar
MacAttack
* * * * *
Posts: 2992
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:11 am

Re: Arming a Group

Post by MacAttack » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:03 pm

DavePAL84 wrote:
MacAttack wrote:But at those prices for 9mm pistols you almost can't go wrong if you want new.
Yes, yes you can. I suggest you go a little light research before coming to a conclusion based solely on price.

There are other, better options that do not cost an arm and a leg. The S&W Sigma is an example of this.

The Hi-Point carbines are pretty good with the exception they only accept 10 round mags.


I'll take anyones word on their quality.

Thats why I asked about the prices. That low can only mean one of two things. Stolen or crappy. And they are claiming they are new.
I just typed in cheap 9mm pistol and those came up first.

User avatar
Sig_Ocelot
* * * * *
Posts: 2526
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:53 pm

Re: Arming a Group

Post by Sig_Ocelot » Tue Oct 21, 2008 8:32 pm

Here's a volley of mosin nagant fire. I take back what I said, this might be pretty effective. I now it'd make me find some cover real fast.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcXVVlqT1W4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Rush2112 wrote: Somehow I see this phrase ending a lot of sentences in the future:

"...And that's how Sig lost his [eyesight/fingers]."

Post Reply

Return to “General Firearms Discussion”