Firearms CHAT: [2020 - Year of the Squib]

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by NT2C » Sat Oct 24, 2020 11:12 pm

Phil wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 8:37 pm
NT2C wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 5:48 pm
Phil wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 5:36 pm
Now I know that I have to have a clone of a BM59 or a BM62

Phil Forrest
Oh? Have you tried one? If not, c'mon down to Virginia and let's go shooting. :mrgreen:
Nope. Got the chance to shoot an M14 back when I was qualifying to man the aft starboard .50 mount on the carrier I was stationed on. I've wanted an M14 or M1A ever since. Now that I see Beretta made a shortened Garand in 7.62 Nato, with a magazine, I figure it's exactly the rifle I want.
Nice length, nice furniture, no pistol grip/s, not all ugly and tricked out with everything. The bipod is a bit much but It's designed with the rifle, so I'll let that slide. You put a 10rd magazine on that thing and people would think it's a proper hunting rifle. Not "scary". Then again, anytime a weapon is pointed at me, with intent, it's scary. I don't like being hit by BB guns, nor does anyone. No one ever questions the "scariness" of my Model 1917 "Enfield" in spite of the power of .30-06, but folks cry "assault rifle" if they see a .22LR with a pistol grip and an extended magazine. I'll get off my high horse now.

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I still need to get a bayonet for it but here's mine: viewtopic.php?f=107&t=2833&p=2748501&hi ... 9#p2748501
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by Phil » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:32 am

NT2C, that is really nice looking. Now to only find one...

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by NT2C » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:47 am

Phil wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:32 am
NT2C, that is really nice looking. Now to only find one...

Phil Forrest
If you ever make it down to my AO there's a good range about 2 hours west of me in Gore, VA that has reasonable rates for their 100 yd range and higher rates for their long-distance (600yd) range but that requires booking in advance. The 100 yd is $20 day and no advance booking. Last time I was there I may or may not have burned through a couple thousand rounds (gawd that hurts to think about at today's prices).
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by Phil » Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:03 pm

I can't imagine shooting a few thousand rounds these days. Last time I expend that much ammunition, it was at the request of one of my battalion's Gunnery Sgts, 16 years ago. I have a feeling it was typical Navy fiscal policy where we had to spend out our yearly budget in order to receive more money. We went to the "range" (it was just a berm) at Camp Fallujah, and burned through a few thousand 5.56 as well as a lot of 7.62. I shot my M16 until it jammed, which was probably the whole reason we were put through that evolution. After that it was Gunny yelling at us to clear our stoppages faster and faster. I got to the point where the rifle was a single shot and I was smacking hot stovepiped brass out of the ejection port with every shot. That was before the "Push" and taught me that I needed to be ready after a few minutes of sustained fire. Unfortunately, I was also AR2 in my squad, as well as the MEG photographer (not assigned to COMCAM.) It's why and how I learned to piece together AK parts picked up off the street while on patrol.
I have no idea what a thousand rounds of 7.62 Nato would run now, or where it could even be found. It's hard enough to find decent .30-06 which is remotely affordable. I only have a few hundred and I'm always actively looking for bulk amounts at a decent price.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by boskone » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:01 pm

MPMalloy wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 5:39 pm
bos: How many Thousands of $$$$ would this be? Maybe just one, minus the cost of the rifle?

Maybe not?
A custom rifle? Several thousands. :D

Maybe if I won the lottery I'd actually do it. Or stumbled into a good set of machining tools and got around to taking some machining classes, and DIYed.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by boskone » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:06 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 9:41 pm
For PCC optics, it's a perfect use case for a LPVO with a bullet drop compensator. I've got a 1-6x Vortex Strike Eagle mounted on my Ruger PC Carbine right now and if I zero it at 100 with 115gr ammo, I can use the drop compensator for ammo with more drop, like 147gr and steel case 115gr. It's handy in a practical sense, I've got a notecard with it that reminds me what dot to use for whatever ammo I have on hand.
If I got a PCC, I was thinking about something like one of the PA prismatics. The ACSS reticle seems well-received, they're compact, and 2x-3x seems like enough magnification for a pistol caliber?

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by NT2C » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:07 pm

Phil wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:03 pm
I can't imagine shooting a few thousand rounds these days. Last time I expend that much ammunition, it was at the request of one of my battalion's Gunnery Sgts, 16 years ago. I have a feeling it was typical Navy fiscal policy where we had to spend out our yearly budget in order to receive more money. We went to the "range" (it was just a berm) at Camp Fallujah, and burned through a few thousand 5.56 as well as a lot of 7.62. I shot my M16 until it jammed, which was probably the whole reason we were put through that evolution. After that it was Gunny yelling at us to clear our stoppages faster and faster. I got to the point where the rifle was a single shot and I was smacking hot stovepiped brass out of the ejection port with every shot. That was before the "Push" and taught me that I needed to be ready after a few minutes of sustained fire. Unfortunately, I was also AR2 in my squad, as well as the MEG photographer (not assigned to COMCAM.) It's why and how I learned to piece together AK parts picked up off the street while on patrol.
I have no idea what a thousand rounds of 7.62 Nato would run now, or where it could even be found. It's hard enough to find decent .30-06 which is remotely affordable. I only have a few hundred and I'm always actively looking for bulk amounts at a decent price.

Phil Forrest
That visit was two years ago and I went through, IIRC, a full case of 9mm FMJ, 5 boxes of 9mm HST, most of a case (250 rnd) of 12 ga slugs, about 1,000 rnds of .22lr, maybe 400 rnds of .45 ACP FMJ, and 100 rnds of .380 ACP FMJ

It was a fun day. :rofl:

That was the day I got my Ruger PC9 and the same day I first setup my steel plates (pic below) and everybody wanted to shoot them. I borrowed a couple of 33 rnd Glock mags from a neighboring shooter and everyone got a chance to play with it. Between that and my CZ clone with its 17 rnd mags we burned through 9mm. Oh, and the guy next to me letting us play with his suppressed full-auto MP5 didn't help with conserving 9mm. But hey, 9mm was about $7.00 a box at the time, .45ACP was about $9.00 and 12ga slugs were about 20 cents each in bulk.

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Oh, and my former neighbor gifted me about 75 rounds of 30-06 handloads that I'd be willing to burn through at a range day.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by NT2C » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:09 pm

boskone wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:06 pm
PistolPete wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 9:41 pm
For PCC optics, it's a perfect use case for a LPVO with a bullet drop compensator. I've got a 1-6x Vortex Strike Eagle mounted on my Ruger PC Carbine right now and if I zero it at 100 with 115gr ammo, I can use the drop compensator for ammo with more drop, like 147gr and steel case 115gr. It's handy in a practical sense, I've got a notecard with it that reminds me what dot to use for whatever ammo I have on hand.
If I got a PCC, I was thinking about something like one of the PA prismatics. The ACSS reticle seems well-received, they're compact, and 2x-3x seems like enough magnification for a pistol caliber?
I run a cheap 2x Tru-Glo on mine. Works well enough for my needs.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:06 pm

NT2C wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:09 pm
boskone wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:06 pm
PistolPete wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 9:41 pm
For PCC optics, it's a perfect use case for a LPVO with a bullet drop compensator. I've got a 1-6x Vortex Strike Eagle mounted on my Ruger PC Carbine right now and if I zero it at 100 with 115gr ammo, I can use the drop compensator for ammo with more drop, like 147gr and steel case 115gr. It's handy in a practical sense, I've got a notecard with it that reminds me what dot to use for whatever ammo I have on hand.
If I got a PCC, I was thinking about something like one of the PA prismatics. The ACSS reticle seems well-received, they're compact, and 2x-3x seems like enough magnification for a pistol caliber?
I run a cheap 2x Tru-Glo on mine. Works well enough for my needs.
I'm considering putting my TRS-25 on my PC9, but I've got a cheapo Axeon Trisyclon red dot that I may try as well.

Only issues I have with the Axeon optic is the housing is slightly canted and I hate the multi piece mount they use. If I decide I hate it too much, I can always sell it and get something else later on.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:59 pm

Anyone else getting a big security warning from Armslist whenever they try to access the site ?

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:32 pm

boskone wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:06 pm
If I got a PCC, I was thinking about something like one of the PA prismatics. The ACSS reticle seems well-received, they're compact, and 2x-3x seems like enough magnification for a pistol caliber?
All depends on your use case. For home defense and short range work a red dot is great. For a bug out gun or longer target gun Primary Arms is a great choice I think. I just put that 1-6 Strike Eagle on it because I had it lying around. It was on an AR that I put a nicer scope on, so I had it surplus. It's pretty large for the gun and I don't need 6x for anything I use it for, but it does make spotting holes in the target easier than a lessor powered scope.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Mon Oct 26, 2020 2:17 pm

And Armslist may have borked themself on this move. I'm happy to pay a reasonable fee for a service, but when I tried setting up the payment for a premium membership it failed to process, using two different cards and two different browsers on two different computers. I wanted to rule out a possible issue on my side by eliminating technical factors. Super annoying.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:20 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 2:17 pm
And Armslist may have borked themself on this move. I'm happy to pay a reasonable fee for a service, but when I tried setting up the payment for a premium membership it failed to process, using two different cards and two different browsers on two different computers. I wanted to rule out a possible issue on my side by eliminating technical factors. Super annoying.
Someone already found a loophole in posting ads on there.

Apparently, you can go back to an old ad, edit it to fit whatever you're selling now, reactivate it and you can bypass the payment thing. Whether or not it still works or if it's been patched by now is still unknown.

I've also noticed that the announcement of the "premium personal membership" has disappeared from Armslist's front page.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:21 pm

12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:20 pm
Someone already found a loophole in posting ads on there.

Apparently, you can go back to an old ad, edit it to fit whatever you're selling now, reactivate it and you can bypass the payment thing. Whether or not it still works or if it's been patched by now is still unknown.

I've also noticed that the announcement of the "premium personal membership" has disappeared from Armslist's front page.
I saw that. However, if you want to contact a seller, you need a premium account now. So whether you are selling or buying, it seems they want their $4 a month. Which to me is reasonable, it's just frustrating that their payment processing isn't working to allow that to happen.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by NT2C » Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:40 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:21 pm
However, if you want to contact a seller, you need a premium account now. So whether you are selling or buying, it seems they want their $4 a month. Which to me is reasonable, it's just frustrating that their payment processing isn't working to allow that to happen.
I'm not seeing that as reasonable at all unless you're making a business. Seriously, if I want to go on there shopping for a firearm I need a premium account to make any contacts, and that's reasonable at $4.00, but why does it have to be an automatic recurring monthly payment? How often do they think the average shopper is going to want to make a purchase? Me, I'd make maybe one or two a year but that's not worth maintaining a $48 yr. membership for IMHO.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:46 pm

NT2C wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:40 pm
I'm not seeing that as reasonable at all unless you're making a business. Seriously, if I want to go on there shopping for a firearm I need a premium account to make any contacts, and that's reasonable at $4.00, but why does it have to be an automatic recurring monthly payment? How often do they think the average shopper is going to want to make a purchase? Me, I'd make maybe one or two a year but that's not worth maintaining a $48 yr. membership for IMHO.
As you know running a website takes resources, the users are going to pay for it in cash or they are going to pay for it some other way. I greatly prefer the business model where I pay for what I use rather than the Facebook / Google business model where the cost isn't as obvious, but ends up being much greater.

Maybe they've decided they aren't a website for the casual user and want to be more of an enthusiast site. Maybe it's to minimize legal risk- cut out the people who decide to buy a gun on a lark that are more likely to be a lawsuit problem in the future. Or maybe they found that 90% of their transactions come from 15% of their user base. Hard to say what drove their choice to do it. If people stop using their service because of it it opens up a market opportunity for a competitor.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by NT2C » Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:52 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:46 pm
NT2C wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:40 pm
I'm not seeing that as reasonable at all unless you're making a business. Seriously, if I want to go on there shopping for a firearm I need a premium account to make any contacts, and that's reasonable at $4.00, but why does it have to be an automatic recurring monthly payment? How often do they think the average shopper is going to want to make a purchase? Me, I'd make maybe one or two a year but that's not worth maintaining a $48 yr. membership for IMHO.
As you know running a website takes resources, the users are going to pay for it in cash or they are going to pay for it some other way. I greatly prefer the business model where I pay for what I use rather than the Facebook / Google business model where the cost isn't as obvious, but ends up being much greater.

Maybe they've decided they aren't a website for the casual user and want to be more of an enthusiast site. Maybe it's to minimize legal risk- cut out the people who decide to buy a gun on a lark that are more likely to be a lawsuit problem in the future. Or maybe they found that 90% of their transactions come from 15% of their user base. Hard to say what drove their choice to do it. If people stop using their service because of it it opens up a market opportunity for a competitor.
Seems to me that charging the advertisers, those placing ads, a small fee for the listing (call it the eBay model) and keeping the doors open to anyone who wants to buy makes more sense. But, their site, their business, their rules. I don't have to shop there after all.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:59 pm

NT2C wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:52 pm
Seems to me that charging the advertisers, those placing ads, a small fee for the listing (call it the eBay model) and keeping the doors open to anyone who wants to buy makes more sense. But, their site, their business, their rules. I don't have to shop there after all.
It's possible they ran those numbers and it wasn't enough to cover looming legal bills and operating costs. Or they will find out that the internet generation demands services for "free" and they go under or change to a different model.

They are one of the last remaining classifieds remaining today, after Facebook and Craigslist banned firearms ads. I'm willing to spend some money to keep them alive. Maybe other people are as well.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:04 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:21 pm
12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:20 pm
Someone already found a loophole in posting ads on there.

Apparently, you can go back to an old ad, edit it to fit whatever you're selling now, reactivate it and you can bypass the payment thing. Whether or not it still works or if it's been patched by now is still unknown.

I've also noticed that the announcement of the "premium personal membership" has disappeared from Armslist's front page.
I saw that. However, if you want to contact a seller, you need a premium account now. So whether you are selling or buying, it seems they want their $4 a month. Which to me is reasonable, it's just frustrating that their payment processing isn't working to allow that to happen.
Sellers are thinking of that too. They're starting to add their phone numbers to the ads. Not sure how Armslist's algorithm misses them, but I'm seeing more ads pop up with phone numbers in them than I was prior to their announcement.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:10 am

For people looking for a Ruger PCC, PSA has them in stock for (barely) less than msrp.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/ruger-p ... ampaign=cl
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by boskone » Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:43 pm

Damnit, Pete...I don't need to be spending $600+tax and FFL. Nor thinking about finding a new FFL, since my usual one isn't available at work anymore.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by PistolPete » Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:00 pm

boskone wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:43 pm
Damnit, Pete...I don't need to be spending $600+tax and FFL. Nor thinking about finding a new FFL, since my usual one isn't available at work anymore.
:lol:
If I have learned anything about PSA, it's if they offer something on sale one week, just wait a month or 3 and they'll have it on sale again. Unless weird things happen with the election. Also, if they got some that means other people did as well, so the demand must be dropping. There are only so many buyers out there, we just had a burst of new buyers this year.

On another front, talk me out of a Remington 783 Varmint. I'm looking to replace a 243 and that seems to offer what I'm looking for, but I know Remington's low end models have been pretty junky in years past. If I was looking for a 243 with a 24" or 26" barrel with a sturdy stock is there anything I should be considering over that? I've got a Thompson-Center 243 now that's fine, it's just not a pleasure to shoot. As I age I enjoy more of the finer things in life.

You can't be that cheap Thompson-Center though, for a hunting gun you're going to knock around in the woods and expect to make an accurate shot it's great. It's a solid tool, it's just now joyful in my hands if that makes sense.
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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:11 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:00 pm
boskone wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:43 pm
Damnit, Pete...I don't need to be spending $600+tax and FFL. Nor thinking about finding a new FFL, since my usual one isn't available at work anymore.
:lol:
If I have learned anything about PSA, it's if they offer something on sale one week, just wait a month or 3 and they'll have it on sale again. Unless weird things happen with the election. Also, if they got some that means other people did as well, so the demand must be dropping. There are only so many buyers out there, we just had a burst of new buyers this year.

On another front, talk me out of a Remington 783 Varmint. I'm looking to replace a 243 and that seems to offer what I'm looking for, but I know Remington's low end models have been pretty junky in years past. If I was looking for a 243 with a 24" or 26" barrel with a sturdy stock is there anything I should be considering over that? I've got a Thompson-Center 243 now that's fine, it's just not a pleasure to shoot. As I age I enjoy more of the finer things in life.

You can't be that cheap Thompson-Center though, for a hunting gun you're going to knock around in the woods and expect to make an accurate shot it's great. It's a solid tool, it's just now joyful in my hands if that makes sense.
Is the 783 the one with the friction fit barrel or is that the 770 ?

I had a guy offer me a 770 in .30-06 for my old Chevy Silverado one time. I politely declined, mostly because I had no use for one and I needed a new laptop more.

What about the Savage Axis rifles ? I think there's a wood stock model now.

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Re: Firearms CHAT: [insert chat title here]

Post by boskone » Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:48 pm

PistolPete wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:00 pm
boskone wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:43 pm
Damnit, Pete...I don't need to be spending $600+tax and FFL. Nor thinking about finding a new FFL, since my usual one isn't available at work anymore.
:lol:
If I have learned anything about PSA, it's if they offer something on sale one week, just wait a month or 3 and they'll have it on sale again. Unless weird things happen with the election. Also, if they got some that means other people did as well, so the demand must be dropping. There are only so many buyers out there, we just had a burst of new buyers this year.
Maybe. That'd be nice, I wouldn't mind picking one up locally.
On another front, talk me out of a Remington 783 Varmint. I'm looking to replace a 243 and that seems to offer what I'm looking for, but I know Remington's low end models have been pretty junky in years past. If I was looking for a 243 with a 24" or 26" barrel with a sturdy stock is there anything I should be considering over that? I've got a Thompson-Center 243 now that's fine, it's just not a pleasure to shoot. As I age I enjoy more of the finer things in life.

You can't be that cheap Thompson-Center though, for a hunting gun you're going to knock around in the woods and expect to make an accurate shot it's great. It's a solid tool, it's just now joyful in my hands if that makes sense.
If y'all have Academy sporting goods in your area, their deals on Savage Axis with glass are hard to beat. I guess it depends on how you feel about chunky stocks. Dad's got 2 (.223 and 6.5 Creedmoor), and the only thing "wrong" with them is that they're not sexy; everything's at least good except aesthetics. I'd take one over any recent-construction Remington, at least until they've re-proven their quality and QA. (I'm not sure what Roundhill will do with the Remington brand and IP.)

But you know what you actually want is a Henry Long Ranger. Well-chosen wood, good fit and finish, nice trigger, detachable box mag...

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