Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

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Merovech
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Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Merovech » Mon Nov 16, 2015 9:39 pm

Please don't destroy this thread with AR vs Mini-14 wars, thats not the purpose here.

I am considering selling one of my AR-15s and my Mini-14 in favor of a Tavor.

The firearm would be used to fill the role of patrolling my AoO, and general defense.

I grew up on the Mini-14, I know the gun and I love the gun, I have factory magazines for it, the gun has never caused me problems, and is excellently accurate.

The AR I have, I got on accident. I have no attachment to it, I just kinda kept getting given parts and I had a lower and it kinda built itself over the past few years.

I'm looking at the Tavor in 556, it looks fun, Im told it is excellent in durability, accuracy and dependability (even with plastic parts which drive me nuts)... and takes standard AR-15 Magpul magazines.

What do you guys think? Talk me out of it? Talk me into it? I'm divided.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by flybynight » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:09 pm

I'd never trade two guns for one. Actually I never sell or trade any guns. Once I acquire them I never let them out of my possession.
If the mini works well and you have always liked it, why would you even think of getting rid of it for a gun that " looks like fun" but you don't even know if you will like it?
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by raptor » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:54 pm

I like mini 14s. I have owned three (2 blue and 1 SS). I still have the SS for a marine environment. That said the AR-15 has a key advantage here. The reason I say this is not to start an AR vs mini discussion but rather to make an observation.

The Tavor and the AR use the same magazines whereas the Mini uses a proprietary magazine. I would suggest selling the Mini 14 while keeping the AR. Then saving the balance of the needed funds to buy the Tavor. This way you will have two platforms that use the same magazines as well as the same caliber.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Merovech » Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:16 pm

raptor wrote:I like mini 14s. I have owned three (2 blue and 1 SS). I still have the SS for a marine environment. That said the AR-15 has a key advantage here. The reason I say this is not to start an AR vs mini discussion but rather to make an observation.

The Tavor and the AR use the same magazines whereas the Mini uses a proprietary magazine. I would suggest selling the Mini 14 while keeping the AR. Then saving the balance of the needed funds to buy the Tavor. This way you will have two platforms that use the same magazines as well as the same caliber.
My Mini-14 is also stainless. The main thing making me shy away from it is that I am pretty sure that it is chambered in 223 and not 556 which limits my Ammo for it a bit. I really need to check, because if its chambered in 556 the issue is moot. Until recently I was always buying 223 ammo and not 556 so it never mattered much.

I don't know the AR-15, the only reason we have one is my wife, its the rifle she knows and knows well. We would keep her's this other one is just 'extra'.

I like the mini over the AR ONLY because of the number of parts and durability. (Im starting to break my own rule so Ill shut up)

I am very much trying to streamline and get into ammo consistency, I guess that is my main goal here. The money is kinda a secondary concern.
flybynight wrote:I'd never trade two guns for one. Actually I never sell or trade any guns. Once I acquire them I never let them out of my possession.
If the mini works well and you have always liked it, why would you even think of getting rid of it for a gun that " looks like fun" but you don't even know if you will like it?
I'm also very much a part of the never sell crowd, but I have no problems with trading depending. I see this as more of a trade (in my mind). Mostly Im looking at the TAVOR for ammo consistency and its reputation, and its not an AR.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by raptor » Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:48 pm

Merovech wrote: My Mini-14 is also stainless. The main thing making me shy away from it is that I am pretty sure that it is chambered in 223 and not 556 which limits my Ammo for it a bit. I really need to check, because if its chambered in 556 the issue is moot. Until recently I was always buying 223 ammo and not 556 so it never mattered much.


Mine says .223 but the manual and a confirming phone call the the factory years ago confirmed the SS version I have would fire both .223 and 5.56mm. IIRC all 186 and later series can safely fire 5.56mm. Call the factory customer service line with your serial number to confirm if you have an older model.

I would note that the Ruger FAQ says
http://www.ruger.com/service/FAQs.html#Q132
Can I shoot 5.56 NATO ammunition in my Mini-14 or Ranch Rifle?
With the exception of the Mini-14 Target Rifle, which accepts only .223 Rem. ammunition, .223 Rem. and 5.56 NATO can be used in all Mini-14 rifles and Ranch Rifles.
Please note that "Military Surplus" 5.56mm NATO can vary greatly in its quality and consistency.

Based upon what you said I would suggest that you keep what you have.

Then buy a Tavor for the magazine and ammo commonality and just cuz. :D

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Mountainsquid » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:32 am

Por que no los tres?

I have a AR-15 and a Mini-14. I just ordered a Tavor from Atlantic Firearms.

I've never had any trouble putting 5.56 through my Mini-14.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by absinthe beginner » Tue Nov 17, 2015 10:56 am

A friend of mine has both Tavors and ARs, and much prefers the Tavor, not least because it's so easy to field-strip and maintain, and is more reliable than the AR under field conditions. Also likes the Israeli-made optic he bought to go with it.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by PistolPete » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:40 pm

The Tavor has a terrible trigger compared to the AR and Mini, if you haven't shot one I recommend you try it before you plunk your money down.

From a prepping standpoint, I'd say the AR is the better choice. The Tavor is really cool, but I'd only get one if it was augmenting my AR.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Mountainsquid » Tue Nov 17, 2015 10:12 pm

I've shot it. It's about what I expect from a Bullpup. If I find it too onerous I'll drop a new trigger in.

I'm really enamored with a SBR-length rifle without a NFA stamp.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Merovech » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:56 pm

So, turns out raptor is correct. Although stamped 223 Ranch Rifle, the manufacturer says that 556 (according to their website) is just fine and still warranties the rifle if you use 556. I'll admit it goes against the very fiber of my being to put 556 in a 223 rifle but given the paragraph of safety info that Ruger prints on their guns, I guess I can believe them?
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by JeeperCreeper » Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:04 am

I'd rather have an AR and a Mini over one Tavor.

If I were to be playing with that much money for a gun, I wouldn't get a bull pup (terrible triggers), I'd get a crazy piston AR, a SCAR, a Galil ACE, or even an ACR (do they even make those anymore)... I mean, it's only money, right??

But if you have a Jericho pistol and wanna get Israeli-Tac then go for it!!!!


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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by jor-el » Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:34 am

From a legal aspect I find it hard to want to own a rifle that costs as much as several rifles, unless it can do more than the other rifles combined.
Having been involved in shootings where the gun in question was entered into evidence, Would you want a two-three thousand dollar firearm getting bounced around an evidence room?
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Mountainsquid » Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:50 am

jor-el wrote:From a legal aspect I find it hard to want to own a rifle that costs as much as several rifles, unless it can do more than the other rifles combined.
Having been involved in shootings where the gun in question was entered into evidence, Would you want a two-three thousand dollar firearm getting bounced around an evidence room?

Which is why the Mini-14 is the HD weapon.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by brothaman » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:50 am

The AR's prevalence and commonality have turned my head from a lot of guns. I can get parts for my AR and stock them cheap. I'll never need a gunsmith to mod or repair my AR. If I want to go SBR, all I need is a Stamp and a barrel. If I want to go with a different caliber, all I need is some parts. I can make my AR as accurate as I want or can afford to. If there's something I don't like about my AR, I can change it with out help. That's all I've got.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by RickOShea » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:22 am

Merovech wrote:So, turns out raptor is correct. Although stamped 223 Ranch Rifle, the manufacturer says that 556 (according to their website) is just fine and still warranties the rifle if you use 556. I'll admit it goes against the very fiber of my being to put 556 in a 223 rifle but given the paragraph of safety info that Ruger prints on their guns, I guess I can believe them?
Both my old Mini and even older Colt SP1 we're stamped "Cal.223"......I can see where that may be confused as meaning ".223 Remington".
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by raptor » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:29 am

RickOShea wrote:
Merovech wrote:So, turns out raptor is correct. Although stamped 223 Ranch Rifle, the manufacturer says that 556 (according to their website) is just fine and still warranties the rifle if you use 556. I'll admit it goes against the very fiber of my being to put 556 in a 223 rifle but given the paragraph of safety info that Ruger prints on their guns, I guess I can believe them?
Both my old Mini and even older Colt SP1 we're stamped "Cal.223"......I can see where that may be confused as meaning ".223 Remington".
My first Mini-14 dates to 1978 the others subsequent to that time, with the last being procured in the 1990s. I have used almost exclusively 5.56 ammo in them all (as well as reloads and all manner of cheap and crappy ammo for plinking). In fact I did not even notice the.223 marking. It was not until I bought the last SS one that I noticed the .223 marking during the sale. I asked and was shown the owners manual which said it was ok to fire 5.56. I then checked the others and called the factory (this was pre-internet times) who faxed over written confirmation that they were ok to use 5.56.

Ignornace is bliss I guess. :D

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:55 am

RickOShea wrote:
Merovech wrote:So, turns out raptor is correct. Although stamped 223 Ranch Rifle, the manufacturer says that 556 (according to their website) is just fine and still warranties the rifle if you use 556. I'll admit it goes against the very fiber of my being to put 556 in a 223 rifle but given the paragraph of safety info that Ruger prints on their guns, I guess I can believe them?
Both my old Mini and even older Colt SP1 we're stamped "Cal.223"......I can see where that may be confused as meaning ".223 Remington".
Didn't DPMS and Olympic have ARs that were only warranteed for .223 Remington use? Like the chambers were cut with .223 Rem dies and everything.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Stercutus » Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:54 pm

DPMS did, I recall seeing a few at the LGS. Don't know about Olympic.

I'd rather have a Tavor and an AR than an AR and a Mini-14. The siren song of the bullpup...

But...
I grew up on the Mini-14, I know the gun and I love the gun, I have factory magazines for it, the gun has never caused me problems, and is excellently accurate.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Langenator » Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:00 pm

brothaman wrote:The AR's prevalence and commonality have turned my head from a lot of guns. I can get parts for my AR and stock them cheap. I'll never need a gunsmith to mod or repair my AR. If I want to go SBR, all I need is a Stamp and a barrel. If I want to go with a different caliber, all I need is some parts. I can make my AR as accurate and I want or can afford to. If there's something I don't like about my AR, I can change it with out help. That's all I've got.
^^This.

If it's for general personal/home defense/patrolling (what are you patrolling? I'm assuming you're thinking post-disaster/ZA), the AR is a better choice for all the reasons brothaman listed.

The Tavor at this point is an expensive oddball. Yeah, it has a bunch of technical advantages over the AR. But it comes down to the Tavor being "exquisite" (and, as mentioned, expensive) while the AR is "good enough," and more than good enough for 99% of civilian uses.

If you want to be better prepared, materiel-wise, for bad times, I'd suggest selling the Mini-14 and investing the proceeds in spares for the high wear parts of your AR (bolt, springs, mags), and ammo.

Get the Tavor for the fun-cool factor, but keep the AR (with spare parts and ammo) for if things go pear-shaped.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by jor-el » Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:20 pm

I believe you can find a few NYPD photos where a few Mini-14s are still in circulation as of the new ISIS threat against NYC.
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Armed+Hammered » Sat Nov 28, 2015 11:38 am

What with the decent quality guns out there like Palmetto builds on special, I would go with the AR.

Time behind Minis has shown me all the accuracy of an SKS at four times the price (Canada values) and not quite so durable at all. Its light and handy though, but for what they cost I much prefer a USGI M1 Carbine. Makes a great gun for the Missus, she kinda owns mine now, so buy two :D

Tavors have earned a pretty solid rep, it reminds me of shooting a Glock with a NY trigger pack, but they work. A bit outside the price range though. Wish you guys had access to the Chinese T-97, surprisingly good to go for $900.

Yeah, DPMS chambers are very much on the tight side. I think they do it for accuracy's sake but not sure. They greatly benefit from a touchup with a 5.56mm reamer on the lathe. Surprising to see it does remove some metal alright.

Ran into a problem with full house loads made for a Savage Axis bolt rifle, being unable to extract from a DPMS carbine. The Colt LE6290 eats them for lunch.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Stercutus » Sat Nov 28, 2015 5:30 pm

I'm changing my answer to the Tavor. But it has to be the Bobba Fett edition.

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Because... damn...
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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Mountainsquid » Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:26 pm

Stercutus wrote:I'm changing my answer to the Tavor. But it has to be the Bobba Fett edition.



Because... damn...
If you convert it to 9mm and attach a Manticore Suppressor you can really make it look like a blaster.

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Re: Tavor vs AR-15 & Mini-14.

Post by Stercutus » Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:54 pm

Does it go "Eeornnn" or "peeronpeeron" when you shoot it?

If it does the credit card is about to take a hit.
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