Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

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Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by absinthe beginner » Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:12 am

http://rt.com/usa/225011-kalashnikov-ak ... roduction/

On Thursday, the Kalashnikov Group gave the green light to the US-based Russian Weapons Company (RWC), which had earlier announced plans to dodge anti-Russian sanctions and begin a domestic manufacture of the famous Russian brand.

Among many other Russian brands, Kalashnikov also became subject to the economic sanctions imposed by Washington and many other Western capitals on Moscow.

“In the second quarter of this year we are going to start manufacturing here in the US,” Thomas McCrossin, CEO of RWC told CNNMoney in Las Vegas at the annual gun industry show. "This project once again stresses that the legendary Kalashnikov assault rifle is popular," the spokesman said.

Based in Tullytown, Pennsylvania, RWC plans to begin production with the classic AK-47 assault rifle and shotguns under the Kalashnikov brand. In early 2014, the RWC company signed an exclusive contract with Kalashnikov to supply as many as 200,000 Russian-made guns to the US and Canada, annually.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Unorthodox » Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:18 am

It always somewhat baffled me how US made...or how ever the fuck its done. How is it done? Parts kits? US Barrels? I don't understand this AK voodoo

Oops, went off on a tangent. Anyway, I don't understand how the US has been unable to make a 'good' AK. I always hear people talking shit on 'Murrican vodka gats, its not like we are unable to produce quality firearms.

I mean damn, the AK is just plywood and sheet metal, how hard can it be?

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by brothaman » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:52 am

Unorthodox wrote:I always hear people talking shit on 'Murrican vodka gats, its not like we are unable to produce quality firearms.
Gun Divas, man. The same bitches that hate every gun you have because its not exactly like theirs and you didn't consult them first before buying one.

G-Diva speak> "I could have told you that rifle sucks. You should have gotten XXXX. That's what I have." etc,...
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by LowKey » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:56 am

Unorthodox wrote:It always somewhat baffled me how US made...or how ever the fuck its done. How is it done? Parts kits? US Barrels? I don't understand this AK voodoo

Oops, went off on a tangent. Anyway, I don't understand how the US has been unable to make a 'good' AK. I always hear people talking shit on 'Murrican vodka gats, its not like we are unable to produce quality firearms.

I mean damn, the AK is just plywood and sheet metal, how hard can it be?

Disclaimer: I am a complete noob when it comes to AKs and other similar combloc firearms
I suspect it's had more to do with who tried their hand at making them over here in the past.

AK's are pretty simple, and inexpensive to make. Russian/Eastern European labor is much cheaper than American labor, so to equal or beat the price of an inexpensive import you'd have to cut corners somewhere or take a very slim profit margin.
I suspect that the slim profit margin made the manufacturing of AK's in the US unapealing to established firearms manufacturers, and left us with less experienced or more poorly financed folks trying to get started in the business with resultant piss poor QC.

With an effective embargo on Russian made stuff, if the demand stays high then it becomes fiscally worthwhile to tool up and do factory runs here with decent QC.

...or I could be completely wrong. :crazy:
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by We'reWolf » Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:34 am

so..
F*** yah? amiright?
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Mikeyboy » Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:16 am

There are already been a few US made AK-47 on the market. Most have been out well before this Ukraine/Russian mess. Interordance makes one, The CIA Centurion C39, Arsenal makes a few models both milled and stamped receivers.

I love that this is a "news article" from RT...the Putin/SVR propaganda wing. On the one hand I don't mind seeing more jobs in the USA, on the other hand...screw Russia. Sanctions are sanctions. You may have invented Vodka and AK-47, but I can buy plenty of better Vodka and AK-47 for other European Countries...and even stuff that is made in the good ol' USA.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by emclean » Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:28 pm

forget teh AK, i wish someone would make a Dragunov in the US.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by absinthe beginner » Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:17 pm

forget teh AK, i wish someone would make a Dragunov in the US.
The article also mentions shotguns - presumably Saiga or Vepr variants. You can get AKs that are as good or better than the Russian-made ones, but it would be nice to have the shotgun designs made here, too.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:29 am

Like others before have said, the Century Centurion C39 is 100% American made.

Also, I.O.Inc (or Inter Ordnance, if you prefer) is making all their new AKs 100% in the USA after their debacle as an importer. Here is an article about their "comeback". Classic Firearms also has some cool videos explaining their product lines and doing demos. Time will tell if these AKs will be worth it.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/0 ... ce-io-inc/
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Halfapint » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:49 am

I dunno if I read it here while I was piss drunk ::note to self stop getting on ZS while drunk::, on facebook, or perhaps it was wet drea.... I mean my predict the fuuuuuuture dreams..... but I give you.....

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Yup, PSA will start making AK's apparently

Edit: Hot redhead not included apparently :( this makes half very very sad.
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Fri Jan 23, 2015 4:48 am

Halfapint wrote:I dunno if I read it here while I was piss drunk ::note to self stop getting on ZS while drunk::, on facebook, or perhaps it was wet drea.... I mean my predict the fuuuuuuture dreams..... but I give you.....

Image

Yup, PSA will start making AK's apparently

Edit: Hot redhead not included apparently :( this makes half very very sad.
I was just about to post this too... It's sad that you drunk is faster than me sober. Shows I'm losing touch, hand me that beer
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by gun toting monkeyboy » Fri Jan 23, 2015 4:41 pm

The problem with US-made AKs in the past has always been people taking the point of view that they are just stamped sheet metal and plywood. It can't be that hard. And then they make crappy guns with horrible quality control. Canted front sights, feed issues, poor fit and finish, etc... Then they discover that the people who bought the rifles actually expected them to be functional, and at least as good quality-wise as the junkiest AKs from other countries. Which they weren't. And it all goes down hill from there. Or they make them here, and then want to charge more than a premium AR costs, because they think the market will bear it. And that totally removes the one major advantage AKs have over ARs. The cost. If somebody is going to make them successfully here, they need to do something more than the normal half-assed attempt that we have had over the years. And not try to slap them together out of third-hand parts that fell off the back of a vodka truck before being sold through a back-room deal to some stupid Americans who didn't know how to make sure they were made to spec. We have lots of barrel makers here that turn out great AK barrels. We have Tapco turning out great quality internal parts. We have several companies that make great receivers. What we really need is somebody that can turn out those parts and the rest, and put them together like a professional firearms company. Not like a couple of drunk hillbillies slapping them together in a barn someplace, between their conjugal visits with the livestock. And they really need to do it in a Right-to-work state, because the unions have managed to kill a lot of the gun industry in the North East. I am actually looking forward to somebody making a US version of the AK that is worth a damn, and costs less than a kidney and a testicle. If they have half a brain, not only will they make a standard 7.62x39 version, but they will also offer something in .223 that uses AR magazines. You want to talk about AR killers. Come up with a reliable version like that, and you will capture a huge chunk of the market.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by LJ126 » Fri Jan 23, 2015 6:21 pm

I have always been a fan of the Kalashnikov rifles. I'm really happy to hear that quality AKs are starting to be 100% made in America. I'd really like one of the new rifles once they've started rolling off the line for a while and any hiccups are ironed out. I'd also be interested in a C39, should I ever find one at a decent price. Neato stuff.
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by absinthe beginner » Fri Jan 23, 2015 9:07 pm

If it sounds too good to be true….

http://weaponsman.com/?p=20414

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by praharin » Fri Jan 23, 2015 11:44 pm

absinthe beginner wrote:If it sounds too good to be true….

http://weaponsman.com/?p=20414
Lots of hearsay and presumption there. Much could turn out to be accurate, but since we're only 3-5 months from Q2 2015, I say we wait and see instead.
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Kommander » Sat Jan 24, 2015 2:01 pm

Well of course we will wait and see, but I think weapons man is right about this. They may end up making a very good AK that will he worth every dime they ask for, but the won't be any more "authentic" than any other US made AK. Being able to slap a brand name on a gun does not really mean a whole lot.
Why must all the hoops be on fire?

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by emclean » Sat Jan 24, 2015 2:51 pm

Kommander wrote:Well of course we will wait and see, but I think weapons man is right about this. They may end up making a very good AK that will he worth every dime they ask for, but the won't be any more "authentic" than any other US made AK. Being able to slap a brand name on a gun does not really mean a whole lot.
that depends on why you are buying the gun. around here people tend to be practical about their guns, and don't buy ones to sit NIB, hoping that they go up in value.
BUT there are a lot of collectors out there, where brand matters a lot.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Kommander » Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:29 pm

Well I think in this case the brand mean very little, at least until the prove themselves to be a good manufacture. If they make crap, hoping to slap their brand on it and fool everyone the internet is going to run them into the ground. However if the make a good product then they will have a good product and it will sell, and in that case the brand name may help them a bit, especially over the long term.
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Snyper708 » Sat Jan 24, 2015 8:12 pm

I wouldn't put much faith in any story from RT
I'll believe it when I see it

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by Jeriah » Sun Jan 25, 2015 3:26 am

Big announcement at Kalashnikov's booth at SHOT.

Lots of American flags everywhere.

LOTS of awesome looking guns, mostly rifles but some VEPR/Saiga 12s as well.

All imports. No new, US production guns yet.

All of the text said things like "Kalashnikov USA is transitioning from being an import company to being a US manufacturer." NOT "We are licensing our name to some yokels, and hoping they do a better job than Century."

Saw Century's booth as well. Had US made AKs. They looked...eh, fit and finish better than my Maadi, which has plywood furniture and black spray paint for a finish and shoots great. I probably wouldn't buy a Century AK but I'm not dismissing them out of hand. Anybody actually ever shoot one?
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by gun toting monkeyboy » Mon Jan 26, 2015 3:20 pm

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Century has a lot of shoddy reputation to get past. Their decades of turning out semi-functional crap is a lot to overcome. I am going to wait a while either way. I have enough AKs to keep me busy in the event of zombies ever showing up. If an American manufacturer can turn out decent ones at a realistic price (I have heard PSA's will be in the $600 range), I will grab another one or two.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by sheddi » Mon Jan 26, 2015 6:34 pm

gun toting monkeyboy wrote:If an American manufacturer can turn out decent ones at a realistic price (I have heard PSA's will be in the $600 range), I will grab another one or two.
I'm British and know nothing about firearms. I do however hang around with production engineers and curiosity demands that I ask a question.

Is there anything intrinsic in the AK design that makes it cheaper to manufacture than an equivalent-quality AR? Or is it just that the market is used to AKs being cheap due to Eastern European imports while ARs are all new and US-made?
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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by emclean » Mon Jan 26, 2015 6:46 pm

the AK has a stamped receiver, and several other stamped parts.
the AR has a milled receiver, and several polymer parts.

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Re: Russian-Pattern AK-47s to be manufactured in US?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Mon Jan 26, 2015 7:08 pm

sheddi wrote: I'm British and know nothing about firearms. I do however hang around with production engineers and curiosity demands that I ask a question.

Is there anything intrinsic in the AK design that makes it cheaper to manufacture than an equivalent-quality AR? Or is it just that the market is used to AKs being cheap due to Eastern European imports while ARs are all new and US-made?
emclean gave the perfect short answer!

The long answer, the AK has more potential to be cheaper, but economics and politics play HUGE into it.

If a company had 2 assembly lines set up with proper machining, a base model AK would cost less to manufacture than a base model AR (for the reason emclean stated, the AK is just simpler with room for looser tolerances). But if one was made in a US state like South Carolina, it will be cheaper than a product in Massachusetts, no matter the overhead because of state labor laws. That doesn't even take into account the supply and demand of products, the competition with imports, the mark up on imports for huge profits, the import tariffs and sanctions by the government, etc etc etc.

But of course, this is just my take and I am no economist or industrial engineer. The economics of firearms is very interesting
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