SHTF ammo availability myth

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SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by mough » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:11 pm

I've always heard common calibers will be more available in shtf. 9mm, .223, .22lr, etc.

I'm wondering if this isn't a load of s because the s hasn't even htf yet and those were the first calibers to dissapear.

The only calibers I can find for sale are stuff like .410 handgun shotshells, .45-70, and the odd box of .243.

Thoughts?

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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:14 pm

mough wrote:Thoughts?
If you don't have it, don't expect to be able to get it.

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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Finch » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:24 pm

Doctorr Fabulous wrote:
mough wrote:Thoughts?
If you don't have it, don't expect to be able to get it.

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yes do not depend on being able to pick up ammo. Stock up.

hell look at ammo availability today based on the "availability" concept more peolple should have 17 HMR's
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by rburch » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:40 pm

Oh there's plenty of ammo available in my area, it's just not for sale.

The common calibers might be easier to find in a PAW, but the demand for them will be higher too.

In short the only way you'll be able to get them would be through actions most people would consider wrong.

Since I'm not willing to resort to those actions, I choose to stock up.

Still, around here the 40s&w seems to still be somewhat available, so I might need to exchange out one of my 9mms for a 40.

Or at least get some conversion kits, which really I think is your best answer if you choose the foraging for ammo plan. Have the ability to shoot as many calibers as you can so your odds of finding ammo you can use is higher.

Still a reserve supply is a much safer option.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Keith B » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:53 pm

I recently sold 1000 rounds of 556 out of my stockpile for $750. The ammo is out there, just not on the shelves. Think of this time as a mini PAW in relation to firearms. When a full PAW happens, this will effect every aspect of society, not just one. Look at Hostess as another good example. This is why we prep before these things happen, not during, or after.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Browning 35 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:14 pm

To me the idea being able to obtain ammo in a disaster or SHTF scenario isn't based on some black market arms bazaar in Thunderdome with Tina Turner as Mayor. It's based off of what your friends, relatives and acquaintances own.

Chances are if someone needs ammo pretty badly then they can call someone they know and do some trading to get it. Depending on their relationship with the person they'll probably even get a few rounds for free. If someone close to me needed ammo pretty bad chances are really very good that I'll help them out. Most people are like that with their friends and relatives.

If it's a common caliber (.22LR, 9mm, .45 ACP, .38 Special, .223, .243, 7.62x39, .30-30, .308, .270, 30-06 or 12 Ga.) then that persons chances go up that they'll be able to find someone they know that's willing to give it to them or trade goods or even work it off ('Help me fix my car and I'll give you a few rds of 9mm').

That's all that is.

Almost every house I've ever been in has some sort of ammo in it even if the person wasn't a gun owner. My grandmother never owned a gun in her whole life and I found a couple 30-06 shells, half of a 50 rd box of .22's and a couple shotgun shells when I was helping her move once. In dire circumstances if I needed ammo and she had of actually remembered that they were there then she probably just would have given them to me. In fact I think she did give them to me.

If it was an uncommon caliber then I'd probably be shit outa luck.

It's obviously better to just buy it yourself and already have it on hand, but owning commonly available calibers does increase your chances of finding ammo if you ever do run out.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Sworbeyegib » Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:10 pm

I don't think aquiring any ammo is likely in a shtf/paw whatever scenario. All you will realistically have access to will be what you have stocked, and what your close friends and family might help you cover. Me and my close friends/family all shoot and stock pretty much all the same ammo. This is so we can both buy in bulk and split cases, go shooting together and share ammo, and in case of some sort of shtf we all will have similar calibers if things get that bad.

We stock and shoot 5.56, .308, .45acp, 22lr, and 12 gauge. We all still have a few guns that don't fit the "stock it deep" mentality, because they have their own purposes. I don't feel the need to stock a thousand rounds of 30/30 or 7.62x54r, my dad doesn't feel the need to stock up on 16 gauge and .357. We understand the roles those guns play. They are hunting/range guns, not the ones we'd be picking up if doo doo hit the fan.

Yes, some calibers are easier to come by in stores when the "panics" strike. But really, the last place I'd want to be in an emergency is a gun store.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by raptor » Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:52 pm

If there is one lesson to take away from the latest ammo shortage is an axiom that is as old as war itself.

You fight wars with what you have on hand.

Likewise you will have to deal with a true SHTF situation with what you have on hand.

Be sure to have what you need on hand and in stock. That BTW applies to more than ammo and firearms.

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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:56 pm

I chuckle at the guys who want to buy a (gun in caliber they don't stock, but tends to be on the shelves when Panics happen) when they could just sack the money into a .22 trainer and/or stack ammo deeper when it becomes available.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Smash05 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:05 pm

Coordinate around calibers with friends. An argument can be made that local armories may have 5.56 and 9mm, or that the local LEO's might have .40 - but if you think they are going to share with you in a PAW, you live in fantasy land. I know that between myself and my likeminded firearms owning friends, we have at least 38/357 and 12ga in common. Another of my friends is in the process of being licensed, he is planning to standardize around calibers that I own from the outset.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by raptor » Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:08 pm

Doctorr Fabulous wrote: when they could just sack the money into a .22 trainer and/or stack ammo deeper when it becomes available.


The addition to the above may be the inclusion of reloading dies and gear for one caliber you use a lot. In addition caliber converters may also prove useful in limited instances. .22lr in .223/5.56, 7.62x51 in .30-06.

http://www.shootersdepot.com/Caliberconverters.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliber_conversion_sleeve" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:15 pm

raptor wrote:
Doctorr Fabulous wrote: when they could just sack the money into a .22 trainer and/or stack ammo deeper when it becomes available.


The addition to the above may be the inclusion of reloading dies and gear for one caliber you use a lot. In addition caliber converters may also prove useful in limited instances. .22lr in .223/5.56, 7.62x51 in .30-06.

http://www.shootersdepot.com/Caliberconverters.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliber_conversion_sleeve" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Dogan » Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:15 pm

Doctorr Fabulous wrote:I chuckle at the guys who want to buy a (gun in caliber they don't stock, but tends to be on the shelves when Panics happen) when they could just sack the money into a .22 trainer and/or stack ammo deeper when it becomes available.
Or both buy the trainer and stack the ammo for same, and wind up with another decent firearm and thousands, easily tens of thousands, of rounds for the trainer. And depending on the trainer, you might also now have a firearm to hand off to an unarmed friend or relative.

I've got to admit, I did find my brain tilting towards this ever so slightly. I've seen a lot of .243 on the shelves lately, and I remember seeing inexpensive, break action .243 single shots in almost every gun shop at one time or another, due to the fact that they are considered a "good youth gun" for some reason. My brain started to wander, then I thought about the attributes of .243 vs .223 or .308, and the platforms available for the latter two, and then using the cash for the .243 to fill out my incomplete reloading setup with more dies, bullets and primers. My brain went from "Yeahhhh...." to "Nah." in about two minutes flat.

And Mough, those common calibers may actually be more available in a ZPAW, because people be more likely to have reloading dies and stocks of ammo and components. Sure, you can find reloading stuff for less common calibers, and you can find those calibers on the shelves at times like these. But when you can stock up on components and ammo for a certain caliber at Bubba Bill's Blasters and Wallyworld, those are the components you will find up for trade after supply lines go down, or are sucked dry at the consumer end like they are now.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Browning 35 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:16 pm

Dogan wrote:I've got to admit, I did find my brain tilting towards this ever so slightly. I've seen a lot of .243 on the shelves lately, and I remember seeing inexpensive, break action .243 single shots in almost every gun shop at one time or another, due to the fact that they are considered a "good youth gun" for some reason. My brain started to wander, then I thought about the attributes of .243 vs .223 or .308, and the platforms available for the latter two, and then using the cash for the .243 to fill out my incomplete reloading setup with more dies, bullets and primers. My brain went from "Yeahhhh...." to "Nah." in about two minutes flat.

And Mough, those common calibers may actually be more available in a ZPAW, because people be more likely to have reloading dies and stocks of ammo and components. Sure, you can find reloading stuff for less common calibers, and you can find those calibers on the shelves at times like these. But when you can stock up on components and ammo for a certain caliber at Bubba Bill's Blasters and Wallyworld, those are the components you will find up for trade after supply lines go down, or are sucked dry at the consumer end like they are now.
.243's pretty common. At least around here. Maybe only slightly behind the .270 Win.

If you want one just because you want one then that's one thing. The panic seems just about over though. Walked into a fully stocked gun store today for the first time. Prices were about $10-$20 over what they were in August on just about everything.

20 rds of .223 FMJ for $19.99
50 rds of practice 9mm or 20 rds of 9mm JHP for $29.99 and so on.
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It's that smug, superior attitude of theirs, strutting around in their fancy outfits like they're better than everyone else. Yeah, burn in hell, you snobbish bird bastards.

And don't get me started on pandas!

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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by velojym » Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:21 pm

This is a time for me to be lovin' my .243, and since it's my only real rifle-caliber rifle right now, I'm glad that I'm still able to find a few boxes on the shelf. I've been picking up a box or two a week, and considering reloading, as I do really like the caliber. There's nothing in Bama that won't fall to a well placed .243 or my .44mag levergun, so I'm doing pretty well, in my opinion.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by raxar » Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:49 pm

there's one thing I've concluded recently, come summertime, Nobody (even you) is going to go rummaging around in the pockets of corpses for anything.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Sworbeyegib » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:59 pm

I still see plenty of .30/30 on shelves, but I gotta say WTH. Damn .30/30 ammo got expensive in my area over the last few years. I used to be able to get it for $14-$16 a box, now everywhere its over $20. $34 a box for leverevolution. I still have a hundred or so rounds left for it, but damn... Just damn...
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by raptor » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:30 pm

sworbeyegib wrote:I still see plenty of .30/30 on shelves, but I gotta say WTH. Damn .30/30 ammo got expensive in my area over the last few years. I used to be able to get it for $14-$16 a box, now everywhere its over $20. $34 a box for leverevolution. I still have a hundred or so rounds left for it, but damn... Just damn...
Hell I just bought a brick of 500 .22lr for $39.95. Any ammo is expensive these days.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Dogan » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:45 pm

raptor wrote:Hell I just bough a brick of 500 .22lr for $39.95. Any ammo is expensive these days.
:shock: No wonder I can trade mine so easy. Shit son!
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by velojym » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:47 pm

I still have a nice stack of .30-30 ammo in my safe, but no rifle for it. I see decent used Marlins even now for the mid 200s in price... wonder whether I could sneak one in under the better half's nose.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Browning 35 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:53 pm

raxar wrote:there's one thing I've concluded recently, come summertime, Nobody (even you) is going to go rummaging around in the pockets of corpses for anything.
I'm going to have to disagree with that. I wouldn't count on the smell deterring many in dire circumstances.

Starving kids in Africa are sometimes known to pick through feces looking for undigested bits of food to eat. I'm not saying this to be grotesque, but it's the truth and it shows how strong the survival instinct goes.

Just saying, faced with trying to survive and people will do some pretty fucked up things. Including digging through some dead stinky dudes pockets. Just hold your breath for a sec and cut their pocket open with a pair of trauma shears and get to it that way. That's what I do for unconscious/unresponsive pt's ID.
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Evan the Diplomat wrote:Why do you want to shoot penguins? What did they ever do to you?
It's that smug, superior attitude of theirs, strutting around in their fancy outfits like they're better than everyone else. Yeah, burn in hell, you snobbish bird bastards.

And don't get me started on pandas!

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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by Sworbeyegib » Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:00 pm

raptor wrote:
sworbeyegib wrote:I still see plenty of .30/30 on shelves, but I gotta say WTH. Damn .30/30 ammo got expensive in my area over the last few years. I used to be able to get it for $14-$16 a box, now everywhere its over $20. $34 a box for leverevolution. I still have a hundred or so rounds left for it, but damn... Just damn...
Hell I just bough a brick of 500 .22lr for $39.95. Any ammo is expensive these days.
Ow thats brutal... I think .22lr is the one ammo that didn't get jacked up around here. Our 5.56 went from $350 a case, to "good luck finding some", to $650 a case.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by 91Eunozs » Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:36 pm

raptor wrote:
sworbeyegib wrote:I still see plenty of .30/30 on shelves, but I gotta say WTH. Damn .30/30 ammo got expensive in my area over the last few years. I used to be able to get it for $14-$16 a box, now everywhere its over $20. $34 a box for leverevolution. I still have a hundred or so rounds left for it, but damn... Just damn...
Hell I just bough a brick of 500 .22lr for $39.95. Any ammo is expensive these days.
:shock:

damn. I've been able to get 525-rd boxes of Winchester .22LR and the like for $19.99 fairly consistently at Academy... They get trucks in 3-4 times/week and I just get there at 0630-0700 and wait for them to open at 0800. The manager's good about coming out and letting the folks waiting in line know what came in so if there's nothing I want I just head on in to work without waiting.

They almost always have 55 grain XM196 5.56 in stock for $8-$9/20-rd box (1 box/customer per day) so I'll usually pick up a box even though I feel like I'm paying too much and really want/prefer 62 grain XM855. I'll take what I can get for now though and slowly rebuild the stocks one box at a time.

Pretty standard crowd of regulars...one guy is always first in line. I swear he gets there at 0300-0400 every damn day.
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Re: SHTF ammo availability myth

Post by yossarian » Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:54 pm

We've got three Wal-marts, three LGS's, Bass Pro, Dick's, and MidwayUSA. The only .22lr I can find is in a little town 40 minutes away. 50 rd boxes of Eley for.............$24.95. When I went in he'd already sold half of what he'd gotten.
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